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Old 02-10-2011, 10:21 AM   #21
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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Any issue of the Economist. Poor Bangladeshi teenager.
I knew it would be something like that...

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A know-it-all?

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Old 02-10-2011, 10:30 AM   #22
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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Originally Posted by Sina View Post
they are not" Muslim governments " they are terrorists for their country but I think Saudi Arabia loves USA

Oooh looks like you people think thats all ... A country who keep the military plans as secret as they can are winners
Most governments in Muslim countries hates USA, all of them for good reasons.
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Biggest and most appallingly incorrect generalization. Not all Muslims hate America, just like not all of Americans blame Islam.
I did not speak of the people, but of governments.
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Sweden's airforce is not that strong though.. Sure we have a good airforce but a american F-5 would take down the JAS 39-Gripen like a fly.

However the F-5 is extremely overpriced compared to a Jas.

The F-5 is superior in all ways though. So no. Sweden does not have a strong force. Sure we have decent equipment but 100 Jas can't cut it against any other airforce more or less...
Actually you are wrong. The JAS 39 is impossible to shoot down even if you launch a million missiles against it. Missile trackers cannot see it, and a machine gun is never to be used in air-to-air combat. So, the JAS 39 - or any other plane with ECM equipment - is basically undefeatable.
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Old 02-10-2011, 10:31 AM   #23
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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Actually you are wrong. The JAS 39 is impossible to shoot down even if you launch a million missiles against it. Missile trackers cannot see it, and a machine gun is never to be used in air-to-air combat. So, the JAS 39 - or any other plane with ECM equipment - is basically undefeatable.
Can you give me a reliable source to this? If not I'll give you mine... And I bet mine beats yours no matter what the heck you say. But yah. GLHF finding a source that proves that.
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Old 02-10-2011, 10:33 AM   #24
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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Not all Muslim people hates USA, but all Muslim governments does. So do 72% of the world - with right.

Japan does not reveal half of their army on Wikipedia. More reliable sources can come from one who actually has Japanese relatives working in the military.
With right... maybe. The government has done shady and terrible things to other nations, but that's not at all unique.

No, plenty of uninformed and misinformed personnel in every military force, I'm sure. Half of whom are likely the ones editing each other's nation's wiki entries.

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Huh..?



Do you see me quoting/questioning the OP anywhere in my post?



That is the reason why I aksed for his sources regarding a particular point that, being an Indian myself, I found quite amusing.
Indeed?

No, I do not, but that is the problem. You asked this of Wooster, but how is he obligated to provide sources when the OP hasn't?

Yes well, cuts both ways, really. No one is in any real position to declare national innocence.
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Old 02-10-2011, 10:37 AM   #25
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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Originally Posted by Ninja of Tao View Post
I did not speak of the people, but of governments.

Actually you are wrong. The JAS 39 is impossible to shoot down even if you launch a million missiles against it. Missile trackers cannot see it, and a machine gun is never to be used in air-to-air combat. So, the JAS 39 - or any other plane with ECM equipment - is basically undefeatable.
You really needed to clarify that earlier.

i'd use whatever's at my disposal, but it seems you've greatly overestimated the Gripen, sir, in any case. It is by no means invisible. Where on earth did you even hear that?
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Old 02-10-2011, 10:40 AM   #26
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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You really needed to clarify that earlier.

i'd use whatever's at my disposal, but it seems you've greatly overestimated the Gripen, sir, in any case. It is by no means invisible. Where on earth did you even hear that?
As I questioned earlier. I want a solid source of it (wich is non existent).
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Old 02-10-2011, 10:00 PM   #27
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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Indeed?
Yes indeed..

PS: Not sure if thats an appropriate response..Feel free to correct and make it a bit wittier if possible..

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No, I do not, but that is the problem. You asked this of Wooster, but how is he obligated to provide sources when the OP hasn't?
Is it just me or are you seriously incapable of reading a simple post? The OP never made any claims regarding anything. All the OP stated was a bit about "forgotten" military powers and I couldnt care less about that.

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Yes well, cuts both ways, really. No one is in any real position to declare national innocence.
Once again, and for the last time, I am not trying to declare anything. All I needed was a creditable source for the statements he made. But this is not really going to take us anywhere. C ya and may the great Kreegah! be with you all the time..
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Old 02-11-2011, 01:31 AM   #28
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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Most governments in Muslim countries hates USA, all of them for good reasons.

I did not speak of the people, but of governments.

Actually you are wrong. The JAS 39 is impossible to shoot down even if you launch a million missiles against it. Missile trackers cannot see it, and a machine gun is never to be used in air-to-air combat. So, the JAS 39 - or any other plane with ECM equipment - is basically undefeatable.
First of all sweet tart I am pretty sure that is not really a word, the word invincible would have been a better word choice.... and second
there is no such thing as that. Meaning nothing is invincible! Don't be over confident, and don't under estimate. That is when you will be defeated.
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Old 02-11-2011, 03:05 AM   #29
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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The JAS 39 Gripen pictured above, is the main source of Swedish military power. It is among the world's best planes, and due to advanced electronic countermeasures technology, not even USA would have a chance to shoot it down once it was in the air. Homing missiles cannot see it, and its excellent speed and agility makes it superior in air-to-air fighting.

Another part of the Swedish defense that plays a high role is their stealth technology, which is the best in the world. They have been able to mount stealth ability on both land vehicles and surfaced naval vessels - an ability few superpowers have been able to create.

HAHAHA!

JAS gripen was determined to be way weaker than the JSF by multiple sources. In terms of armament, speed, manuverability AND stealth. The main reason why the Norwegian Air Force decided to buy the JSF instead of the Gripen. The only reason why the Gripen even came close was that it was priced at 40% of what the JSF would cost.

And yes, I've had access to the complete comparisons, made by the air force.

JAS gripen is a 4th generation fighter, and as of now, barely outperforms the venerable F-16. Russia and China are both developing 5th generation aircraft to match the American F-22.

You clearly don't understand what stealth technology and ECM (electronic counter-measures) is based on. Today, the multiple ways of detecting aircraft and ships makes it impossible to hide them completely. Radar is the main form of detection used, but there are many other kinds, some that rely on other mechanics. Thermal satellite scans will detect any kind of aircraft for example.

The best fighter in the world is the F-22 Raptor, which has the ability to supercruise along with the best stealth technology in the world. It is very hard to destroy. Still, it is estimated that most major countries in the world (Russia, China, India, Britain, France etc) have missiles capable of shooting it down. Note that these countries also have missiles that are capable of engaging ICBMs, which are way harder to both detect and destroy than any kind of aircraft.

You should honestly stop making these military threads until you actually learn some more about the technology behind them and also study warfare and maybe enlist in the army to learn how wars are really fought.
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Old 02-11-2011, 03:08 AM   #30
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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Sweden's airforce is not that strong though.. Sure we have a good airforce but a american F-5 would take down the JAS 39-Gripen like a fly.

However the F-5 is extremely overpriced compared to a Jas.

The F-5 is superior in all ways though. So no. Sweden does not have a strong force. Sure we have decent equipment but 100 Jas can't cut it against any other airforce more or less...
THe old F-5 aircraft has no chance against any kind of modern 4th generation fighters. I'm assuming you mean the JSF: F-35 Lightning II.
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Old 02-11-2011, 03:14 AM   #31
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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THe old F-5 aircraft has no chance against any kind of modern 4th generation fighters. I'm assuming you mean the JSF: F-35 Lightning II.
Not the F-5 I just couldn't remember the name ^^ mainly ment that the Swedish airforce is nowhere near any big nations airforce. However. JAS is one of the most priceworth aircrafts in the world.
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Old 02-11-2011, 09:33 AM   #32
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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Yes indeed..

PS: Not sure if thats an appropriate response..Feel free to correct and make it a bit wittier if possible.

No, that's wholly appropriate.

Is it just me or are you seriously incapable of reading a simple post? The OP never made any claims regarding anything. All the OP stated was a bit about "forgotten" military powers and I couldnt care less about that.

I'm afraid it is just you, kind sir. He clearly states he's provided proof of his information, that all of his evidence is backed by innumerable sources, yet never provided these sources to us. If you'd like Ninja of Tao to cover his claims with sources, please petition him to do so, then I'll accept your query towards Wooster.

Once again, and for the last time, I am not trying to declare anything. All I needed was a creditable source for the statements he made. But this is not really going to take us anywhere. C ya and may the great Kreegah! be with you all the time..

It seemed to me you thought his statement on India's "ethnic strife" and implied incompetence were "amusing", and that you were curious as to his sources of information (which is at best a moot point at this juncture).

This can take us a great many places if you let it. I've nothing against you or even your initial question; to be perfectly honest, I just wanted to set some topical equilibrium, based on the... "standards" (if you can call them that) set forth by the NoT's first post.

In yellow.

@Ninja of Tao: it's obvious you like this stuff, so why not take Aurega's advice and delve deeper? Your topics won't be trolled as much, and you'll enjoy your own passion that much more. Also, provide a source or two next time, to at least show you're serious.
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Old 02-11-2011, 10:40 AM   #33
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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I'm afraid it is just you, kind sir. He clearly states he's provided proof of his information, that all of his evidence is backed by innumerable sources, yet never provided these sources to us. If you'd like Ninja of Tao to cover his claims with sources, please petition him to do so, then I'll accept your query towards Wooster.
Now I am afraid that my initial assessment was spot on. I have already said that I dont give damn when someone says that India's military is weak compared to other countries. The only reason I posted was because I read a post that disturbed me a little and Wooster had not provided any sources to back his statements.
And this doesnt really make any sense to me anymore. What the hell are we debating about? Wooster? Lack of sources? India's Military? Your abiliity (?) to comprehend?
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Old 02-11-2011, 01:20 PM   #34
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

Worry not, I mock all countries. India's army at least exists unlike all mainland European countries.

Besides you can't say India and Pakistan aren't obsessed with each other. >.>
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Old 02-11-2011, 09:12 PM   #35
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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Worry not, I mock all countries. India's army at least exists unlike all mainland European countries.
And everything else...

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Besides you can't say India and Pakistan aren't obsessed with each other. >.>
In a strange love-hate kinda relationship...
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Old 02-11-2011, 09:16 PM   #36
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

anybody mention Prussia yet
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Old 02-12-2011, 03:47 AM   #37
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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Originally Posted by Aurega View Post
HAHAHA!

JAS gripen was determined to be way weaker than the JSF by multiple sources. In terms of armament, speed, manuverability AND stealth. The main reason why the Norwegian Air Force decided to buy the JSF instead of the Gripen. The only reason why the Gripen even came close was that it was priced at 40% of what the JSF would cost.

And yes, I've had access to the complete comparisons, made by the air force.

JAS gripen is a 4th generation fighter, and as of now, barely outperforms the venerable F-16. Russia and China are both developing 5th generation aircraft to match the American F-22.

You clearly don't understand what stealth technology and ECM (electronic counter-measures) is based on. Today, the multiple ways of detecting aircraft and ships makes it impossible to hide them completely. Radar is the main form of detection used, but there are many other kinds, some that rely on other mechanics. Thermal satellite scans will detect any kind of aircraft for example.

The best fighter in the world is the F-22 Raptor, which has the ability to supercruise along with the best stealth technology in the world. It is very hard to destroy. Still, it is estimated that most major countries in the world (Russia, China, India, Britain, France etc) have missiles capable of shooting it down. Note that these countries also have missiles that are capable of engaging ICBMs, which are way harder to both detect and destroy than any kind of aircraft.

You should honestly stop making these military threads until you actually learn some more about the technology behind them and also study warfare and maybe enlist in the army to learn how wars are really fought.
My uncle is a captain in the air force, he knows more than you for sure. Also, you are incorrect. The F-22 is not near the JAS 39 in matters of armament or maneuvarability, and the world's best plane is the Chinese J-20.
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In yellow.

@Ninja of Tao: it's obvious you like this stuff, so why not take Aurega's advice and delve deeper? Your topics won't be trolled as much, and you'll enjoy your own passion that much more. Also, provide a source or two next time, to at least show you're serious.
I have already gained more information than necessary to prove my facts. Also, the main reason of these threads are to give one important message to everyone: USA don't rule the world! There are plenty of countries that is better than the US army in more than one category.
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anybody mention Prussia yet
Prussia? You mean early Germany?
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Old 02-12-2011, 06:05 AM   #38
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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Now I am afraid that my initial assessment was spot on. I have already said that I dont give damn when someone says that India's military is weak compared to other countries. The only reason I posted was because I read a post that disturbed me a little and Wooster had not provided any sources to back his statements.
And this doesnt really make any sense to me anymore. What the hell are we debating about? Wooster? Lack of sources? India's Military? Your abiliity (?) to comprehend?
Comprehension isn't something I embrace. It leads to unity and a strife-free environment.

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I have already gained more information than necessary to prove my facts. Also, the main reason of these threads are to give one important message to everyone: USA don't rule the world! There are plenty of countries that is better than the US army in more than one category.

You haven't shown us where the information you gained came from. The best airborne combat platform is the one piloted by the best people. Just look at the sh*tty things the German aces were flying in the African campaign in WWII. Couldn't see a thing through that cage and they were still a terror in those skies. Superior tech only gets you so far, not that you've given examples of superior tech.
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Old 02-12-2011, 06:55 AM   #39
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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Comprehension isn't something I embrace. It leads to unity and a strife-free environment.




You haven't shown us where the information you gained came from. The best airborne combat platform is the one piloted by the best people. Just look at the sh*tty things the German aces were flying in the African campaign in WWII. Couldn't see a thing through that cage and they were still a terror in those skies. Superior tech only gets you so far, not that you've given examples of superior tech.
The best planes of WWII was built in Japan. On second place were Germany and third England.

The planes you speak of were outdated in Germany. They were used against Africa because the best defense Africa had was a machine gun from WWI and two British colonists with rifles.
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Old 02-12-2011, 07:18 AM   #40
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Default Re: Forgotten military powers - Small but still strong

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My uncle is a captain in the air force, he knows more than you for sure. Also, you are incorrect. The F-22 is not near the JAS 39 in matters of armament or maneuvarability, and the world's best plane is the Chinese J-20.
The F-22 is considered the state-of-art when it comes to aircraft. It is just a massive waste of money. The F-16 gets better bang for the buck. The J-20 may be better than the the F-16, but as no one has as much war-time flight experience as American fighter pilots, so it matters little.

Of course, whereas US dominates the skies. In naval affairs, no other country is more than a tadpole. The US has more aircraft carriers than the rest of the world combined. Planes don't do you much good if you have to fly them half way across the world.
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