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Old 11-08-2009, 10:48 PM   #41
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

the biggest chink in goku's durability armour is the fact he died from 2nd form cells self-destruct...as i said above, supes tanks a lot more than goku...goku is breakable. which is why he wouldnt win in a slugfest. i still say he outblasts superman tho. and IT would work in a fight with superman, all things equal, someone that strong has a ki signature jeez
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Old 11-09-2009, 07:52 AM   #42
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by zebrakiller View Post
the biggest chink in goku's durability armour is the fact he died from 2nd form cells self-destruct...as i said above, supes tanks a lot more than goku...goku is breakable. which is why he wouldnt win in a slugfest. i still say he outblasts superman tho. and IT would work in a fight with superman, all things equal, someone that strong has a ki signature jeez
Outblasts? Superman merely dodges with his millions of times light speed.

Superman is not in DBZverse, he doesn't have a ki signature, plus even if Goku teleports to where he is, Superman would have traveled past Goku before he can hit him.

Also Goku's "light speed" is only travel speed, Superman's travel AND combat speed is millions of times light speed, so even if Goku teleports to him he just can't keep up.
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Old 11-10-2009, 12:44 AM   #43
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticGoten View Post
That was never said n the manga or anime. That's just some fan made idea. PICCOLO ACTUALLY SAYS, "H-He sidestepped it! Th-that means...he can move faster than the speed of LIGHT!"
Dub error. He says no such thing in the manga or in the Japanese version of the anime.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticGoten View Post
No. Goku moves AT LEAST(i've done the math) ten million times the speed of light at SSJ4. Superman moves 4 times the speed of light.
You apparently need to retake math.
Quote:
Superman struggles to move planets.
Is that why Superman towed a few dozen planets at once?
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Old 11-10-2009, 05:11 AM   #44
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

So... Why does your argument mention the anime and GT OP? They are not canon. I guess all you really need to do is add "anime" at the beginning of the word Goku every time you say it.

Now, about your arguments...

Power level is not linear, nor is it an accurate way of reaching a conclusion. This is because power level is rewritten all the time, especially in the anime. Toryama has never said anything about the power level of Super Saiyan 4, since it is not part of his original creation.

Instant Transmission does not have a speed other than that Goku uses to think of a destination. However, it is still only as slow as Goku can think.

Next, character fallible statements are character fallible. Piccolo shouldn't have known that his beam was lightspeed. If we actually want to use that argument, then high-tier One Piece characters are many times lightspeed too.

Really, if they are so fast, why the don't they FLY to other planets instead of using spaceships or IT?

Next, Superman can move millions of times the speed of light because he can travel from planet to planet so quickly. It is no joke to say he has enough physical strength pre-crisis to move planets. Hell, pre-crisis Superman was SNEEZING away solar systems.

Muten Roshi destroyed the moon in what is widely considered a feat of plot; most don't take it seriously, like Goku managing to breath in space while on the moon with Boss Rabbit.

Broly never destroyed the Southern half of the galaxy.

Superman not being able to lift a planet realistically doesn't mean much when shooting ki beams to destroy them isn't realistic either.

Superman is just too strong. This thread has been made way too many times.

And you think Goku can destroy the universe? Please.
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Old 11-10-2009, 11:17 AM   #45
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

Goku obviously wins this IF looked at it by your rules.

BUt listen, its kinda unfair to compare the ''real'' goku vs superman. Since superman fought on earth as far as I know, and goku is anime.

Also im 100% sure, that the dbz makers (sorry forgot the name) Did not think this all through. Thats what I said in the vs Superman thread in the beginning (Which a lot ignored) Exactly what you said. If someone with a pl of like 126 can destroy a moon, what can someone with one of 15,000,000,000 Do?

Exactly.

But we should tbh consider looking at the anime wise, not real life wise, cause theoretically Goku just BEING in Ssj2-4 would DESTROY the universe/planet, just him standing. Since a galic gun of 20,000 Could destroy a planet if aimed in the middle, while 15,000,000,000 Is XXX stronger.


Goku is prob the all time strongest character if we look at those facts alone. Although superman is suppose to be ''The perfect'' Being. Insane speed, insane power, can't be touched, can't be hurt, etc. But he does live in the ''human'' world without others of his

Goku Ssj1 could prob beat him then with your rules

Last edited by Shio; 11-10-2009 at 11:19 AM.
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Old 11-10-2009, 02:41 PM   #46
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

Obviously Goku with his Faster than instant speed and his beyond omnipotent strength will dominate a being who can only casually destroy solar systems.
































Goku gets it up the ass, hard.
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Old 11-10-2009, 02:45 PM   #47
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shio View Post
Goku obviously wins this IF looked at it by your rules.

BUt listen, its kinda unfair to compare the ''real'' goku vs superman. Since superman fought on earth as far as I know, and goku is anime.

Also im 100% sure, that the dbz makers (sorry forgot the name) Did not think this all through. Thats what I said in the vs Superman thread in the beginning (Which a lot ignored) Exactly what you said. If someone with a pl of like 126 can destroy a moon, what can someone with one of 15,000,000,000 Do?

Exactly.

But we should tbh consider looking at the anime wise, not real life wise, cause theoretically Goku just BEING in Ssj2-4 would DESTROY the universe/planet, just him standing. Since a galic gun of 20,000 Could destroy a planet if aimed in the middle, while 15,000,000,000 Is XXX stronger.


Goku is prob the all time strongest character if we look at those facts alone. Although superman is suppose to be ''The perfect'' Being. Insane speed, insane power, can't be touched, can't be hurt, etc. But he does live in the ''human'' world without others of his

Goku Ssj1 could prob beat him then with your rules

Dude Goku never destroyed a universe or galaxy.

Precrises Superman has shown greater feats too.

Also at the bolded LOL. That is not true.
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Old 11-10-2009, 04:26 PM   #48
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by 321zigzag1 View Post
Dude Goku never destroyed a universe or galaxy.

Precrises Superman has shown greater feats too.

Also at the bolded LOL. That is not true.
Goku is the strongest character...

In Dragonball...

Who is not fused...

Until the androids came.
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Old 11-10-2009, 05:03 PM   #49
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

in my opinion goku wins. but really this seems to be a very biased battle, and embodiment of east vs. west. I say goku not because of his strength but because of his potential as a fighter. First off he is a saiyan and therefore lives to fight and gains strength by doing so. Secondly his mastery of martial arts not only gives him amazing fighting skills but also a untarnished and enlightened state of mind. Throughout his training as a martial artist he most definitely achieves some sort of enlightenment. Though not stated directly in any canon, this is evident by the fact that the entire dragon ball series is based on the ancient chinese myth Journey to the West. The monkey character in this myth, Sun Wukong, is the basis for goku's character and is essentially a god in the buddhist tradition. This brings up another way this debate is a much greater concern as to who is stronger. goku, and dragonball are more stteped in ideas of spirtuality and magic whereas superman revolves around science. Reason vs. Faith? Another aspect of goku that has thus been overlooked is his purity. He is undoubtably more pure than superman. His childish ways, and seeming stupidity are are sign of an individual untarnished by the world who is entirely good. This along with his warrior spirit and enlightenment makes goku the ultimate hero. He is unquestionably on the side of good, which is destined, as seen in almost any religious belief including buddhism to be victorious over evil. For this reason good allows for unlimited power because it needs to be able to overcome evil no matter how strong it may be. And because he is enlightened from martial arts training and must fight out of a saiyan tradition he has access to this unlimited potential for strength to overcome evil. I am not saying that superman is evil or not pure, but it seems to me that since they are both good guys the only way they would fight all out is if one was evil. I would argue that this cannot be goku because og his spiritual alignment with good, wheras superman I could see being somehow made evil. And if that is the case, then goku would beat him simply because he has to. Please don't be to critical of me, i based much of this argument of my own assumptions and faith in goku's character. Also i don't really know that much about superman, so if someone could take a similar approach for him i would love that. Also, and most importantly, I am extremely high as i write this! Thank you.
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Old 11-10-2009, 05:11 PM   #50
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by awesomest View Post
In my opinion goku wins. But really this seems to be a very biased battle, and is the embodiment of east vs. west. I say goku not because of his strength but because of his potential as a fighter.(New Paragraph)

First off he is a saiyan and therefore lives to fight and gains strength by doing so. Secondly his mastery of martial arts not only gives him amazing fighting skills but also a untarnished and enlightened state of mind. Throughout his training as a martial artist he most definitely achieves some sort of enlightenment. Though not stated directly in any canon, this is evident by the fact that the entire Dragonball series is based on the ancient chinese myth Journey to the West. The monkey character in this myth, Sun Wukong, is the basis for goku's character and is essentially a god in the Buddhist tradition. (New Paragraph)

This brings up another way this debate is a much greater concern as to who is stronger. Goku, and Dragonball are more stepped in ideas of spirituality and magic whereas Superman revolves around science. Reason vs. Faith? (New Paragraph)

Another aspect of Goku that has thus been overlooked is his purity. He is undoubtably more pure than superman. His childish ways, and seeming stupidity are are sign of an individual untarnished by the world who is entirely good. This along with his warrior spirit and enlightenment makes Goku the ultimate hero. He is unquestionably on the side of good, which is destined, as seen in almost any religious belief including Buddhism to be victorious over evil. For this reason good allows for unlimited power because it needs to be able to overcome evil no matter how strong it may be. And because he is enlightened from martial arts training and must fight out of a saiyan tradition, he has access to this unlimited potential for strength to overcome evil. (New Paragraph)

I am not saying that Superman is evil or not pure, but it seems to me that since they are both good guys the only way they would fight all out is if one was evil. I would argue that this cannot be Goku because of his spiritual alignment with good, whereas Superman I could see being somehow made evil. And if that is the case, then Goku would beat him simply because he has to. (New Paragraph)

Please don't be to critical of me, I based much of this argument of my own assumptions and faith in Goku's character. Also I don't really know that much about Superman, so if someone could take a similar approach for him I would love that. Also, and most importantly, I am extremely high as I write this! Thank you.
For anyone trying to read through the solid block of text, here's my edited version. Also, this post is genius. Reps.
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Old 11-10-2009, 05:44 PM   #51
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by awesomest View Post
in my opinion goku wins. but really this seems to be a very biased battle, and embodiment of east vs. west. I say goku not because of his strength but because of his potential as a fighter.
Superman also has massive potential as a fighter.

Quote:
Secondly his mastery of martial arts not only gives him amazing fighting skills but also a untarnished and enlightened state of mind.
Superman is a master of over a hundred fighting styles.

But well thought out post none the less.
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Old 11-10-2009, 07:57 PM   #52
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Abigail View Post
Superman also has massive potential as a fighter.

Superman is a master of over a hundred fighting styles.

But well thought out post none the less.
Just for reference, what gives superman his potential? Also, this is just speculation but I would also argue that goku is the master of countless fighting styles. To my knowledge it never says the number in the canon anywhere, but it seems that he is able to adapt his fighting style depending on the situation making his style infinite in that regard.

And thank you for giving intelligent reasonable responses to my post.
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Old 11-10-2009, 10:09 PM   #53
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

i love the newbies boosting every thread...are some of u obd'ers?
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Old 11-10-2009, 10:26 PM   #54
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

Yeah a bunch of OBD'ers joined out of nowhere, word about us seems to have spread O_o
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Old 11-10-2009, 10:31 PM   #55
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

superman wins

he can withstand anything that goku can throw at him
and really super man rapes goku twice,goku will never win this fight.
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Old 11-10-2009, 11:01 PM   #56
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by awesomest View Post
Just for reference, what gives superman his potential? Also, this is just speculation but I would also argue that goku is the master of countless fighting styles. To my knowledge it never says the number in the canon anywhere, but it seems that he is able to adapt his fighting style depending on the situation making his style infinite in that regard.

And thank you for giving intelligent reasonable responses to my post.
Mostly how quickly he learned said martial arts mainly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zebrakiller View Post
i love the newbies boosting every thread...are some of u obd'ers?
A few of us are, yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rocklee_112713 View Post
Yeah a bunch of OBD'ers joined out of nowhere, word about us seems to have spread O_o
Manwe linked NL's thread to the OBD and far be it from us to not try to beat some intelligence into other forums.
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Old 11-27-2009, 03:03 PM   #57
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

1. Goku will Destructo Disk Superman in half and blow the remains with a kamehameha.
Destructo Disk cuts though anything regardless of its power or density. Cut though Frieza 2nd Form tail of by Krillen who is around x100 times weaker than frieza 2nd Form (Frieza 2nd form PL 1,000,000 vs Krillin 13,000), plus frieza body survived a point blank planetery explosion.

2. Goku can seal superman in a capsule. House, aeroplanes, time machines, etc are contained in capsules in DBZ cant we why a person cant be (probably coz they will die, during molecular reconstruction to fit the compacted size).

3. Goku has more speed than Superman he can use IT on himself (lock on to his own ki) to avoid attacks (Goku charging spirit bomb and kid buu throws a ki blast, goku uses IT to dodge).

4. Supermans heat vision will have minimal results on Goku, he will either dodge or block it (ie like Goku vs Frieza).

5. Goku has a ki Guard/shield he can use to guard against supermans most powerful attacks, weaker attacks can be shrugged of with a kiai (Goku block an attack from Nappa by using this, its like an invisible barrier).

6. In DBZ Universe Ki is everything RAW STRENGTH get you know where. Nail vs Frieza show that Power Level difference matters (Nail his Frieza with Full Power chop to the neck, Frieza smiles) and that a direct attack no matter how physically strong, produces minimal results unless you have a PL to match.

Last but not least 7. SSJ2 would rip superman apart, SSJ2 Gohan chopped a Cell Jr in half with a kick, exploded their head with a punch. Cell Jr at that time in Storyline was more powerful than a SSJ (Cell Jr > SSJ Vegeta/Trunk). If SSJ2 can put that much difference between SSJ & SSJ2 just imaging the difference between SSJ2 and SSJ3. Oh wait just look at SSJ2 Gohan/vegeta vs Fat Buu and compare to SSJ3 Goku vs Fat Buu, plus Goku was not serious or trying to defeat Fat Buu he was just buying time.

Until Full Humans in DC can Blast the moon out of the sky with their own ablility don't bother saying Superman wins against Goku.
Goku studied under the Worlds No.1 martial artist, under Kami/God/Guardian of Earth, under King Kai/Lord of Worlds, under aliens (Yardrat or sumthing). Born from a Warrior Race, has unlimited potential, stronger with every fight, zenkai/near-death get power boost when recovered, Goku has NO LIMITS, he would forever get stronger if he were immortal.
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Old 11-27-2009, 03:39 PM   #58
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

Quote:
Raditz sidesteps the “Light of Death”(Known as the Special Beam Cannon in the English Dub), which moves at the speed of light
Stopped reading here and will make a probably entirely justified assumption that the whole thing is baseless fanwank.

Quote:
Goku has NO LIMITS
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!

Last edited by Nyruss; 11-27-2009 at 03:42 PM.
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Old 11-27-2009, 03:50 PM   #59
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinVegito View Post
1. Goku will Destructo Disk Superman in half and blow the remains with a kamehameha.
Destructo Disk cuts though anything regardless of its power or density. Cut though Frieza 2nd Form tail of by Krillen who is around x100 times weaker than frieza 2nd Form (Frieza 2nd form PL 1,000,000 vs Krillin 13,000), plus frieza body survived a point blank planetery explosion.
No-limits fallacy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinVegito View Post
2. Goku can seal superman in a capsule. House, aeroplanes, time machines, etc are contained in capsules in DBZ cant we why a person cant be (probably coz they will die, during molecular reconstruction to fit the compacted size).
Show someone sealing someone traveling at a million times the speed of light in a capsule.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinVegito View Post
3. Goku has more speed than Superman he can use IT on himself (lock on to his own ki) to avoid attacks (Goku charging spirit bomb and kid buu throws a ki blast, goku uses IT to dodge).
IT, sadly, is useless because it relies on reaction speed, and Goku does not have a reaction speed close to Superman's combat speed. If Goku cannot think of a location, he cannot go there. It's similar to Goku knocking Itachi's block off before the ninja can even think of using genjutsu.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinVegito View Post
4. Supermans heat vision will have minimal results on Goku, he will either dodge or block it (ie like Goku vs Frieza).
Why use heat vision when he can just punch Goku's block off?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinVegito View Post
5. Goku has a ki Guard/shield he can use to guard against supermans most powerful attacks, weaker attacks can be shrugged of with a kiai (Goku block an attack from Nappa by using this, its like an invisible barrier).
Scans of Goku's shield blocking a punch from someone who can move planets with the greatest of ease.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinVegito View Post
6. In DBZ Universe Ki is everything RAW STRENGTH get you know where. Nail vs Frieza show that Power Level difference matters (Nail his Frieza with Full Power chop to the neck, Frieza smiles) and that a direct attack no matter how physically strong, produces minimal results unless you have a PL to match.
Laughable for several reasons (Such as Destructo Disc cutting Frieza), and it contradicts what you said about destructo disc cutting anything.

Nail vs. Freeza shows that physical strength is boosted by Ki. Superman has enough physical strength to make up for any lack of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinVegito View Post
Last but not least 7. SSJ2 would rip superman apart, SSJ2 Gohan chopped a Cell Jr in half with a kick, exploded their head with a punch. Cell Jr at that time in Storyline was more powerful than a SSJ (Cell Jr > SSJ Vegeta/Trunk). If SSJ2 can put that much difference between SSJ & SSJ2 just imaging the difference between SSJ2 and SSJ3. Oh wait just look at SSJ2 Gohan/vegeta vs Fat Buu and compare to SSJ3 Goku vs Fat Buu, plus Goku was not serious or trying to defeat Fat Buu he was just buying time.
And SSJ hasn't shown feats anywhere close to Superman. Neither have any of the above.

For reference, one of Superman's high end feats is SNEEZING and rearranging solar systems in the process.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinVegito View Post
Until Full Humans in DC can Blast the moon out of the sky with their own ablility don't bother saying Superman wins against Goku.
Spoiler:


Superman isn't human, and neither is Goku. Why the hell does being human matter? Superman is still stronger than Goku either way.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinVegito View Post
Goku studied under the Worlds No.1 martial artist, under Kami/God/Guardian of Earth, under King Kai/Lord of Worlds, under aliens (Yardrat or sumthing). Born from a Warrior Race, has unlimited potential, stronger with every fight, zenkai/near-death get power boost when recovered, Goku has NO LIMITS, he would forever get stronger if he were immortal.


Superman is the son of Krypton, brought here by circumstance, ready to fight for the American way and destroy evil. As long as he is under a yellow sun, his potential is limitless, as his power increases with every second.

See, I can post idiotic irrelevant comments too.
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Old 11-27-2009, 03:55 PM   #60
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Default Re: A REAL Goku vs. Superman Thread

You guys are trying to scientifically prove who wins Goku vs Superman....how stupid is that come on? Neither DBZ nor Superman Comics/tv shows follow Science or Physics. You can't prove either of them wins. You can say it seems likely, but you cannot prove it either way. Its completely science fiction. It'd be like saying Who wins God or The One Above All??? Well both are fictional beings and people can claim they are as powerful as anything else.

Btw if you are trying to be all scientific and accurate about this, start with Copyright. Legality is pretty technical and can help to straighten things out.

Anime is canon because of copyright laws. Go read up on that. I'm trying to think of an example where this would actually come to play, but I've read law book about it and un court, if you were in a lawsuit you CANNOT say something DBZ anime isn't canon. It would be credited the EXACT SAME as manga due to copyrights. Both would hold equal weight. I think an example was that some guy who had created a manga series was suing another guy who created a manga, which was then made into a anime (which had a good amount of filler). The courts used material from both the manga and anime to realize that in fact the second party had stolen many ideas. Filler was used to judge as well, so it held equal value.

So I'm sorry to all you Otaku's who think wanking manga makes you somehow cool and superior (I guess you think wanking manga means you are closer to the original product or something? I don't get that, but I won't judge), but anime holds just as much scientific value. Again this is based on legal rules.

Now if you don't want to follow legal rules, then go ahead and pretend you are being technical and scientific, but you really aren't. You're hypocrits in that case because if you really wanted to be scientific you would understand you would have to base info off legal copyrights as well.

Last edited by Err; 09-14-2010 at 04:38 AM. Reason: Removed bad language.
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