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View Poll Results: Kurenai vs Tayuya
Kurenai 10 47.62%
Tayuya 11 52.38%
Voters: 21. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-21-2012, 03:02 PM   #241
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace View Post
Okay... but most likey she would not be able to. And why is that?
Prove she would know its genjutsu
She could sense it since she's familiar with genjutsu. In other words; a change in her chakra flow.
How would I know what?
-she participated in the FOD
-she was a jonnin who watched ovet the FOD
-she is from the land of where the animals live in the FOD
-her students used the animals to their advantage
-the sound and bashing is simple logic
That's not what I meant. How do you know how long the sound can travel?

what if? that she would get caught or.....
Yeah, and also the part about running into foreign animals or setting off a trap. You can't be sure about that. And if she gets caught in Kurenai's genjutsu she could just break free (since she's a genjutsu specialist and it would be really laughable if she couldn't while a mere Genin like Sakura was able to break out of genjutsu). How can you be so sure that she won't be able to break out? You can't compare Kurenai's genjutsu to Itachi's and Sasuke's genjutsu(the Sharingan). No wonder all those people that you listed failed to break out of it. Kurenai and Tayuya are pretty much equal in genjutsu level, except for the fact that Tayuya's got a stronger genjutsu type which gives her an advantage.

Naw it was just funny
OK, it kinda is

but that is her character. Not a fool but Overconfident
She's fighting Kurenai, a jonin who specializes in genjutsu, not Shikamaru. It would be really senseless of her to not be catious. Even Tayuya isn't that foolish. How does she know that Kurenai is a jounin and a genjutsu specialist? It's possible that she's gotten some intel from Orochimaru.


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Old 12-21-2012, 03:25 PM   #242
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

When has any genjutsu user noticed a change in chakra flow. You even stated the differences of audio genjutsu and visual.

It depends where they are but the sound can not travel though the whole forest.
Disadvantages about tayuya not knowing where Kureani is in forest:
-sound can not travel to far
-flute is not the loudest instrument
-Doki would have ot stay close

the chances are higher for Tayuya to run into issues than Kureani
Tayuya is not a genjutsu specialist and no gennin broke out of her genjutsu
I mentioned people who were not in Uchiha genjutsu (Nagato)
Prove that tayuya will know it is genjutsu
Kureani is more likely to break out of the genjutsu than Tayuya is
Tayuya does not have stronger genjutsu DO you have proof

At best she would go into CS1 right away like she did with the other jonnin... but she would not summon

WOW NOW YOU ARE REALLY ASSUMING (about the Oro intel thing)
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:00 PM   #243
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

please think the way Kurenai would:
-opponents face each other
-is kurenai close enough to use gengitsu or not
+ if she is close she willstart to use it
+ if she is far she will try to come close to use gengitsu
- now what would Toyuya do she would either
a +do summon ( most likely)
b+ Jump to fight kurenai with the flute( unlikely )
c+ pass to CS2 and start to use Gengitsu ( OOC )
-now what would eb the responce of kurenai to what toyuya did
a+ for b+ kurenai is stronger and will finish the battle either by kunai or gengitsu
b+ for c+ the faster is will trap the other but:
+ if toyuya is trapped Kurenai need secondto kill/badly injure with kunai even if toyuya can break out of gengitsu she does not have time to ( she does not have sharingan )
+ if kurenai is trapped Toyuya need much more time ( she should come close to kurenai/ search here for Kunai/ then use it. kurenai has more time to break free,
+ but most likely kurenai would trap toyuya first, cause toyuya needs more time ( cs1/cs2/ play flute/ start gengitsu/ gengitsu takes full effect ) all these steps where required to trap shika who was still able to react at the begining of the gengitsu
c+ for a+ there are two options, when te doki are summoned kurenai will see them and estimate their power ( unlike Itachi the doki has nothing to hide) then Kurenai ( who knows her abilities better than any of us will decide if she can handle them or not
+ if she can handle them then she will take them down
+ if she can not then she has two options, if she can trap toyuya in gengitsu before the doki reach her she will do and finish toyuya as soon as possible, if she can not she will run and hide
now kurenai is hidden she will try to reach toyuya, ( there is no point of trapping her in sound gengitsu while she is not located ) even if toyuya changed her position kurenai has higher chance of locating her first the sound of the flute and second better knowledge about the forest, the doki are not helpful for search once they are away from toyuya`s sight she has no idea what they doing or encountering, with forest of death it is possible to sneak and prepare surprise attack ( with or without gengitsu ) to take down toyuya, if she use gengitsu she can start the technique while hiding and do the last confrontation in the last second before toyuya can do any thing, and finish her,
I tried to include all the possibility and include all the possible scenarios, I can say after this analysis kurenai has more chances to win, not 100% sure only more chance
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:04 PM   #244
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

*applause*
I fell sorry for the person who has to counter that

This took A LOT of time so PLEASE someone rep him (I can not cuz I already did)

I wanted to quote you but it's hard to do it here... erg hold on

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Old 12-21-2012, 04:09 PM   #245
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace View Post
When has any genjutsu user noticed a change in chakra flow. You even stated the differences of audio genjutsu and visual.

It depends where they are but the sound can not travel though the whole forest. Doesn't matter, sound based genjutsu has a longer range than sight based. The range of Tayuya's genjutsu is extremely long.
Disadvantages about tayuya not knowing where Kureani is in forest:
-sound can not travel to far. Still doesn't change the fact that it can travel far.
-flute is not the loudest instrument. Your point is?
-Doki would have ot stay close

the chances are higher for Tayuya to run into issues than Kureani
Tayuya is not a genjutsu specialist and no gennin broke out of her genjutsu
I mentioned people who were not in Uchiha genjutsu (Nagato)
She is a genjutsu specialist. Shikamaru even stated it. Her databook shows a 5 in genjutsu, just like in Kurenai's databook. This is not the only reason of course, I could go on and on about why she's a specialist but you still wouldn't acknowledge.
Prove that tayuya will know it is genjutsu
She's familiar with genjutsu as I've mentioned before. The chances are high that she would know.
Kureani is more likely to break out of the genjutsu than Tayuya is
Tayuya does not have stronger genjutsu DO you have proof
Do you have proof that Kurenai has a stronger genjutsu? No, didn't think so. Logically, Tayuya's genjutsu is stronger since it's sound based.

At best she would go into CS1 right away like she did with the other jonnin... but she would not summon

WOW NOW YOU ARE REALLY ASSUMING (about the Oro intel thing)
Oh please, as if you weren't assuming about the traps and the foreign animals in the forest for example.
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:23 PM   #246
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Even IF Kureani was caught in genjutsu then what?
-she can release it
-It would take tayuya time to find her
-its OOC for Tayuya to go into CS2
-why did she not do this with the konoha brats right away

It does not matter if it travels far or not. If she can not find her foe then why would she not use genjutsu against all of the konoha brats then?

that the sound will not travel as well or far as other instruments
SAXOPHONES FOREVER BABI
Spoiler:
I play the sax


Kurani got hype from Itachi
Tayuya got hype from Shikamaru

Itachi' compiment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (another universe)>>>>>.Shikamaru's compiment
Data books mean NOTHING by the way. THey are not the best reference and they have not been updated stat wise IN YEARS

Please do not be like the others I DO acknolwedge you
but here are the facts

Kureani is a specialist
-it is her ONLY jutsu
-she realized she was in her genjutsu and did not freak out
-she knew what Itachi did
-she broke out of the genjutsu easily
-she was complimented by Itachi
-caught mutliple ppl in genjutsu

tayuya is NOT a specialist IMO cuz:
-she can only use it in her strongest mode
-she only has one
-sound is ideal genjutsu
(a nube chunnin broke out of it)

Now tell me again why she is a specailist? Maybe she is.... but Kureani is better and more of a specialist.

That is assuming. You did not prove at all. The only thing odd about her jutsu is that she fades away. And what is basic knowledge in BG?

agreed

I am not assuming that htere are traps and dangerous animals in the forest
Kabuto and Team 8 showed that to be true

No offense but you took assuming to a whole number

P.s.-have fun countereing what Athoatho
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:25 PM   #247
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace View Post
Even IF Kureani was caught in genjutsu then what?
-she can release it
-It would take tayuya time to find her
-its OOC for Tayuya to go into CS2
-why did she not do this with the konoha brats right away

It does not matter if it travels far or not. If she can not find her foe then why would she not use genjutsu against all of the konoha brats then?

that the sound will not travel as well or far as other instruments
SAXOPHONES FOREVER BABI
Spoiler:
I play the sax


Kurani got hype from Itachi
Tayuya got hype from Shikamaru

Itachi' compiment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (another universe)>>>>>.Shikamaru's compiment
Data books mean NOTHING by the way. THey are not the best reference and they have not been updated stat wise IN YEARS

Please do not be like the others I DO acknolwedge you
but here are the facts

Kureani is a specialist
-it is her ONLY jutsu
-she realized she was in her genjutsu and did not freak out
-she knew what Itachi did
-she broke out of the genjutsu easily
-she was complimented by Itachi
-caught mutliple ppl in genjutsu

tayuya is NOT a specialist IMO cuz:
-she can only use it in her strongest mode
-she only has one
-sound is ideal genjutsu
(a nube chunnin broke out of it)

Now tell me again why she is a specailist? Maybe she is.... but Kureani is better and more of a specialist.

That is assuming. You did not prove at all. The only thing odd about her jutsu is that she fades away. And what is basic knowledge in BG?

agreed

I am not assuming that htere are traps and dangerous animals in the forest
Kabuto and Team 8 showed that to be true

No offense but you took assuming to a whole number

P.s.-have fun countereing what Athoatho
Just saying, if Kurenai's statbook was updated, it would be lowered immensely, and Tayuya's would probably go up.
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:37 PM   #248
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Quote:
Originally Posted by athoatho View Post
please think the way Kurenai would:
-opponents face each other
-is kurenai close enough to use gengitsu or not
+ if she is close she willstart to use it
+ if she is far she will try to come close to use gengitsu
- now what would Toyuya do she would either
a +do summon ( most likely)
b+ Jump to fight kurenai with the flute( unlikely )
actually she did intercept Naruto with a punch and clashed upfront with shikamaru who had a kunai so it is not so unlikely
c+ pass to CS2 and start to use Gengitsu ( OOC )
-now what would eb the responce of kurenai to what toyuya did
a+ for b+ kurenai is stronger and will finish the battle either by kunai or gengitsu
b+ for c+ the faster is will trap the other but:
+ if toyuya is trapped Kurenai need secondto kill/badly injure with kunai even if toyuya can break out of gengitsu she does not have time to ( she does not have sharingan )
agreed even IF Tayuya could break out of it let's not go to as far to say that it would be as fast or as well that Itachi did it. WOuld Tayuya even know it is genjutsu.... or ninjutsu?
+ if kurenai is trapped Toyuya need much more time ( she should come close to kurenai/ search here for Kunai/ then use it. kurenai has more time to break free,
plus since she is futher away the sound of the flute will be weaker thus genjutsu is weaker. Shikamaru was able to scream in the genjutsu so Kureani would be able to bit her lip and escape. Remeber Tayuya would only go CS2 if she had no doki and Tayuya does not have weapons so then what???
+ but most likely kurenai would trap toyuya first, cause toyuya needs more time (doki summoned/defeated cs1/cs2/ play flute/ start gengitsu/ gengitsu takes full effect ) all these steps where required to trap shika who was still able to react at the begining of the gengitsu
c+ for a+ there are two options, when te doki are summoned kurenai will see them and estimate their power ( unlike Itachi the doki has nothing to hide) then Kurenai ( who knows her abilities better than any of us will decide if she can handle them or not
+ if she can handle them then she will take them down
+ if she can not then she has two options, if she can trap toyuya in gengitsu before the doki reach her she will do and finish toyuya as soon as possible, if she can not she will run and hide
now kurenai is hidden she will try to reach toyuya, ( there is no point of trapping her in sound gengitsu while she is not located ) even if toyuya changed her position kurenai has higher chance of locating her first the sound of the flute and second better knowledge about the forest, the doki are not helpful for search once they are away from toyuya`s sight she has no idea what they doing or encountering, with forest of death it is possible to sneak and prepare surprise attack ( with or without gengitsu ) to take down toyuya, if she use gengitsu she can start the technique while hiding and do the last confrontation in the last second before toyuya can do any thing, and finish her,
I tried to include all the possibility and include all the possible scenarios, I can say after this analysis kurenai has more chances to win, not 100% sure only more chance
like always we will never know who will TRUELY win but we have to use the info that we have and decide who is MOST LIKELY to win and thus Kurenai wins
THIS IS WHY WE HAVE TO GET RID OF IC
There are TOO MANY FACTORS to consider that changes what they would do
The simplist changes such as distance,location, appearence, e.t.c would change their character and what they would do. Just cuz they did it for one person does not mean they will do THE EXACT SAME THING.
^don't forget to counter this! I am so glad I invited him to this debate
--------------------------------------------------------------------
@Noctris
-yeah cuz she is pregnaunt.
Plus her stats will only get better than Tayuya's cuz tayuya can not get any better than she already is
And those stats do not always matter
Oh and btw your welcome for the chpater and page reference.

But if you REALLY value your stats here is a more TRUSTWORTHY source

tayuya's status- -removed-

kureani's status- -removed-

Kureani is OBVIOUSLY better
------------------------------------------------------------------

And with that post I think the debate is over..... unlesss someone else wants to step up.

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Old 12-21-2012, 05:37 PM   #249
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Illegal links.

I'm seeing so much BS logic but I'm on my phone right now and it's too difficult to respond
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Old 12-21-2012, 05:40 PM   #250
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

ight well Stats are usless anyways. Plus any site you look on will have different stuff and different opinons. Nothing is offical

BS logic? Wow I can't wait to hear this! Arothoa and I are READY!

ALSO!!!

Kureani was able to dodge a kunai swipe from Itachi when she JUST got out of the genjutsu
Spoiler:
yes I know she was then kicked in the face

That is an impreesive reaction feat

So with that she could dodge the doki's attacks since Kureani would not be in genjutsu and have her eyes on the foe

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Old 12-22-2012, 08:14 AM   #251
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hard one! got to say tayuya she has the demons and the distance they both have gejutsu but tayuya uses demons witch isn't a illison

idk Kurni could still win this we just havent seen her fight enought to really be 100 percent sure
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Old 12-22-2012, 09:49 AM   #252
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So does anyone think tayuya would win? If not this is as good as done.

Most of tayuya's argument was based on logic... But logically kurenai is a jounin and has more experienced and better hype to beat tayuya

So at least by hype tayuya would lose.

Yes it is logical to say tayuya would break out of kurenai's genjutsu... But not as well as Itachi did that's for sure.

And whoever down repred atortha that us just sad. He did nothing wrong except prove you wrong. I guess haters are gonna hate.

Thanks cooler for the great match up

bump

any other opinons???

Last edited by BMC1994; 04-20-2013 at 07:58 AM.
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Old 01-04-2013, 02:25 PM   #253
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

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Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace View Post
bump

any other opinons???
One of the first things you do after getting back into the BG's is to revive this thread?

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Old 01-04-2013, 02:26 PM   #254
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Lol yes sir
Just making sure
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Old 01-04-2013, 03:15 PM   #255
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

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Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace View Post
bump

any other opinons???
you have learned nothing from your ban I see

also because the problems the narutoverse section faces aren't limited to POP's special kind of antics


Word Of God: Should not be used as evidence unless directly supported by on panel feats. Inconsistent writers can be impeached and declared invalid if what they intended to portray does not support what occurred on panel. Writers make spoken word errors all the time and narration can be flawed. While you can use proven reliable character statements they should always be backed up by feats suggesting that such a thing is possible. When not supported by such evidence a statement no matter who makes it is invalid.

Data Books: famous for being laughably inaccurate this form of evidence will be used as secondary canon only when not contradicted (if the Data Book in question has even one inconsistency then the entire book will not be allowed to be used as evidence)

Hyperbole: will not be used as valid evidence on this site: Cell cannot destroy a solar system and Amateratsu cannot burn as hot as the sun.


I see multiple violations of these three rules in this thread alone..none of you are allowed to use the statbooks because Naruto databooks have shown to be inconsistent and even if they weren't you are not allowed to use any databook in place of primary canon- they are secondary canon and only supplement canon material when not ruled invalid.

I see uses of hyperbole and powerscaling and everything else

if this is pervasive in this section we mongooses are going to begin cracking down

abide by the official standards for debate or do not abide here at all
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Old 04-20-2013, 02:04 AM   #256
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

It is just so dumb for you to compare a genjutsu MASTER to a genjutsu USER
Kurenai is noted for her powerful genjutsu , and that's what rose her to fame , as A GENJUTSU MASTER . Even Itachi himself praised her , I know you will say that Itachi praised Kurenai because he have met her and not Tayuya right ?

Well you're wrong , according to Narutopedia , Kurenai have 4/5 for ninjutsu , taijutsu , and intelligence , SPEED and of course 5/5 for GENJUTSU COMPARED TO TAYUYA TAYUYA HAVE 3/5 FOR NINJUTSU , SPEED , AND STAMINA . SHE HAVE 2/5 FOR TAIJUTSU , AND 1/5 FOR STRENGTH . OVERALL KURENAI STATS ARE 29.5
TAYUYA STATS ARE 24.5

SO TO ALL DUMBASS CAN'T YOU SEE THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THEIR STATS ?
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Old 04-20-2013, 02:10 AM   #257
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Not this thread again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin View Post
It is just so dumb for you to compare a genjutsu MASTER to a genjutsu USER
Kurenai is noted for her powerful genjutsu , and that's what rose her to fame , as A GENJUTSU MASTER . Even Itachi himself praised her , I know you will say that Itachi praised Kurenai because he have met her and not Tayuya right ?

Well you're wrong , according to Narutopedia , Kurenai have 4/5 for ninjutsu , taijutsu , and intelligence , SPEED and of course 5/5 for GENJUTSU COMPARED TO TAYUYA TAYUYA HAVE 3/5 FOR NINJUTSU , SPEED , AND STAMINA . SHE HAVE 2/5 FOR TAIJUTSU , AND 1/5 FOR STRENGTH . OVERALL KURENAI STATS ARE 29.5
TAYUYA STATS ARE 24.5

SO TO ALL DUMBASS CAN'T YOU SEE THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THEIR STATS ?
*Double Facepalm*
First of all, you're not supposed to use databooks, they don't count. Did you not read what the guy above you posted?
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Old 04-20-2013, 02:15 AM   #258
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

I lol'd at the polls.

Just because Kurenai failed against Itachi it doesn't make her weak. she is still a Jonin which are not as common as you would think. There are only about 10 Jonin in Konoha and any one of them would easily defeat Tayuya.

Sakon was the only Jonin level among them, and Kimimaro was almost at Kage level

P.S Kurenai is the best genjutsu user in Konoha apart from Itachi
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Old 04-20-2013, 02:27 AM   #259
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

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I lol'd at the polls.

Just because Kurenai failed against Itachi it doesn't make her weak. she is still a Jonin which are not as common as you would think. There are only about 10 Jonin in Konoha and any one of them would easily defeat Tayuya.

Sakon was the only Jonin level among them, and Kimimaro was almost at Kage level

P.S Kurenai is the best genjutsu user in Konoha apart from Itachi
R.a.n.k.s. d.o.n.'t. c.o.u.n.t.
I swear I've never been this close to losing my temper.

That's it, I'm gonna request a locking of this thread if the next person who posts breaks another rule. This thread went to hell a long time ago, and everyone involved broke at least one rule. Enough is enough.
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Old 04-20-2013, 03:48 AM   #260
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Kurenai failed so much against Itachi, I laughed.
She is a jonin, with ''high'' genjutsu skill, and yet she didn't even think about Sharingan and its feats.
/derp herp let me solo Itachi

Tayuya would wreck her from long distance
Kurenai is all hype
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