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View Poll Results: Kurenai vs Tayuya
Kurenai 10 47.62%
Tayuya 11 52.38%
Voters: 21. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-20-2012, 01:18 PM   #201
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heji Oka View Post
This does not prove her actual knowledge of the forest this is an attempt at generalization. While yes it can be said that because she is a leaf shinobi that she would have knowledge in this instance we could have said that because they were all uchiha they could have MS or even three tomoe or that all rinnigan users can use shira tensei despite no proof to show for it.
you did not answer my main point ( she is a sensie and should have a full knowledge about the chinin exam, including the forest of death to assess weather or not to allow her student to join the exam and their chance of survival )
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Old 12-20-2012, 01:54 PM   #202
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Another grat point
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:23 AM   #203
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

It seems that no body still believe in Tayuya
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:47 AM   #204
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Yeah I guess they gave up lol
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:52 AM   #205
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

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Originally Posted by athoatho View Post
It seems that no body still believe in Tayuya
Of course people believe, but as I said no point in argueing against PoP.
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:55 AM   #206
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

That is why there is athoato here as well.
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Old 12-21-2012, 06:37 AM   #207
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

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Originally Posted by Vivi View Post
Of course people believe, but as I said no point in argueing against PoP.
But Pop`s opinion was solidified by facts, and he confessed whenever he was proved wrong.
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Old 12-21-2012, 06:53 AM   #208
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

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Originally Posted by athoatho View Post
But Pop`s opinion was solidified by facts, and he confessed whenever he was proved wrong.
Facts alone don't make a debate, I said this countless of times before.
But that is something that will never go into the head of that brat.Those who rely solely on facts without even considering a shred of logic are not even remotely worth answering in debates.

But yeah lets just go by facts instead of applying logic, 90% of all named characters are unable to use Henge/Transformation, Tsunade can't use Chakra Scalpels and oh hey Tenten doesn't use seals, and of course by facts Anko and Hayate were like 2 and 3 when they took their chuunin exams but wait they were shown to be older but screw logic by facts they really were 2 and 3.
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Old 12-21-2012, 07:08 AM   #209
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

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Originally Posted by Vivi View Post
Facts alone don't make a debate, I said this countless of times before.
But that is something that will never go into the head of that brat.Those who rely solely on facts without even considering a shred of logic are not even remotely worth answering in debates.

But yeah lets just go by facts instead of applying logic, 90% of all named characters are unable to use Henge/Transformation, Tsunade can't use Chakra Scalpels and oh hey Tenten doesn't use seals, and of course by facts Anko and Hayate were like 2 and 3 when they took their chuunin exams but wait they were shown to be older but screw logic by facts they really were 2 and 3.
but Pop simply said that, Kurenai can hide while her gengitau is being prepared and come close enough to tayuya, then stun her with gengitsu in oen second confront. it is a logical, possible plan that is based on fact
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Old 12-21-2012, 07:12 AM   #210
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

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Originally Posted by athoatho View Post
but Pop simply said that, Kurenai can hide while her gengitau is being prepared and come close enough to tayuya, then stun her with gengitsu in oen second confront. it is a logical, possible plan that is based on fact
And it's also logical that Tayuya knows Genjutsu defense when even Genin can.
Again, what PoP says means jack.

And the whole thing with Kurenai being a Jonin does't mean a thing either when her best feats are from shortly after she was promoted from a Chuunin, at age 27 making her a Chuunin for 14 years.Talent huh?

Nor is every Jonin automatically some powerhouse best examples are Baki,Mikoto,Fugaku,C,Yura,Taiseki among others.


And Kurenai isn't someone to go and hide anyway, heck look at how she tried to take on Itachi head on almost getting herself killed due to pure stupidity.
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:01 AM   #211
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

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Originally Posted by Vivi View Post
And it's also logical that Tayuya knows Genjutsu defense when even Genin can.
Just because she knows genjutsu defense does not mean she can break out of genjutsu

-Whoever said Tayuya is a genjutsu master IS COMPELTELY WRONG! She only has ONE Genjutsu that she can only use in CS2 and it was broken out of by a nube chunnin

-If Tayuya knew about genjutsu defense such as pain she would have known that Shikamaru could break out of it via pain or other ways.

-Besides would Tayuya even know it is genjutsu? She knows nothing about Kureani and her jutsu is forest based!

-Kureani does not need to hide. The distance is INCREDIBLEY short and if you count in the time for Tayuya to summon the doki, tell her smack talk, take out her flute, play her flute , and for the doki to react to the sound.... TAYUYA WOULD BE CAUGHT IN GENJUTSU

-Kureani just has to make hand signs (which she can do while moving) then dissapear (at a slower right)
THEN BAMO!! Tayuya is in genjutsu

I don't know why you are getting so mad/agreesive.
Fine let's ASSUME!!! That Tayuya knows how to break out of genjutsu... then what?
-can she break out of it in time
-does she know she is in genjutsu
-which way would she attempt to break out of it
There are tooo many factors to consider that is why we should use facts.

Kureani has recieved props on her genjutsu from the Genjutsu Master ITACHI!
She caught multiple opponents in it
Kureani has better hype and feats with her genjutsu. Genjutsu is what Kureani speaciliez in.

Look at Naruto. Even though he knew how to break out of genjutsu it still took him a while to realize it was genjutsu and to start to break out of it.
I know Naruto and Tayuya are different but it still is not as easy

You bash me constantly and call me names when I am not even being that unreasonable. Am I just supposed to agree with you cuz I am using facts and you are using REASONABLE ASSUMING LOGIC. There are too many factors to consider bud. I am dissapointed in the fact that you are being so harsh when I really am not unreasonable. I even dropped and admited defeat at some points I made. I wish we could work it out.


Please tell me how Kureani would lose
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:28 AM   #212
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

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Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace View Post

Please tell me how Kureani would lose
Because she barely showed anything. She only showed one measly genjutsu and thats it.


If you are going to prove it at least use she shoud be stronger than the two special jounin that were still defeated by Sound 4 going CS2.

The point is that while hype has her back, her one feat doesn't.

Well she has Shunshin when she used to intercept Part 1 Neji in the Exams.
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:55 AM   #213
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

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Originally Posted by 321zigzag3 View Post
Because she barely showed anything. She only showed one measly genjutsu and thats it.
That "Measly" genjutsu is all she needs to win this battle especially when we do not know the factors of Tayuya breaking out of it

If you are going to prove it at least use she shoud be stronger than the two special jounin that were still defeated by Sound 4 going CS2.
well we can not really prove that and A>B>C logic does not really work here

The point is that while hype has her back, her one feat doesn't.
so how does Tayuya overcome that one feat?

Well she has Shunshin (whats? that?) when she used to intercept Part 1 Neji in the Exams.
How does Tayuya win? How does she overcome genjutsu?

The distance is not that great she could use it on the spot or take one good leap to another branch while weaving hand signs then she would dssapear behind tayuya
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:58 AM   #214
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

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Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace View Post
Just because she knows genjutsu defense does not mean she can break out of genjutsu
Genin Sakura can dispell Genjutsu from a guy who is said to be kakashis level yet someone far superior cannot despite both being Genjutsu types?
Quote:
-Whoever said Tayuya is a genjutsu master IS COMPELTELY WRONG! She only has ONE Genjutsu that she can only use in CS2 and it was broken out of by a nube chunnin
You love your facts, it's a fact Tayuya knows 10s of Genjutsu so yes she is.
Broken out by noone other than the 2nd smartest strategist using a trick.

Quote:
If Tayuya knew about genjutsu defense such as pain she would have known that Shikamaru could break out of it via pain or other ways.
Overconfidence + Strategy of Shikamaru.

Quote:
Besides would Tayuya even know it is genjutsu? She knows nothing about Kureani and her jutsu is forest based!
Kurenai vanishes into literally thin air, a tree suddenly appears with Kurenai in it.
Besides, even a Genin Sakura was able to tell a Genjutsu.

Quote:
-Kureani does not need to hide. The distance is INCREDIBLEY short and if you count in the time for Tayuya to summon the doki, tell her smack talk, take out her flute, play her flute , and for the doki to react to the sound.... TAYUYA WOULD BE CAUGHT IN GENJUTSU
That's only if Tayuya would remain on the spot which she clearly won't as she is a long range fighter that loves to hide.
Quote:
Kureani just has to make hand signs (which she can do while moving) then dissapear (at a slower right)
THEN BAMO!! Tayuya is in genjutsu
Kurenai needs to get in close for that which ain't gonna happen against someone who stays at long range.

Quote:
I don't know why you are getting so mad/agreesive.
Cause you're acting like a Robot that overanalyzes and observes but has no own mind, only believing what it see's.
It's like in Umineko.
Facts say the Killer is Beatrice,Shannon and Kanon being 1 sole person called Yasu with each metaphor in it being an imaginary friends of hers when the Truth is actually something else which can only be seen if we use our own head and heart instead of believing our eyes.

Quote:
Fine let's ASSUME!!! That Tayuya knows how to break out of genjutsu... then what?
-can she break out of it in time
-does she know she is in genjutsu
-which way would she attempt to break out of it
There are tooo many factors to consider that is why we should use facts.
if you look at how Kurenai used it, it takes ages for an effect.
And yes she would.
Self-inflicted pain or simply Kai.

Quote:
Kureani has recieved props on her genjutsu from the Genjutsu Master ITACHI!
She caught multiple opponents in it
Kureani has better hype and feats with her genjutsu. Genjutsu is what Kureani speaciliez in.
When was that?When he said a Genjutsu of that level won't work in him?
She only caught Itachi.
What Genjutsu feats?Getting stomped?
So is Tayuya.
Quote:
Look at Naruto. Even though he knew how to break out of genjutsu it still took him a while to realize it was genjutsu and to start to break out of it.
I know Naruto and Tayuya are different but it still is not as easy
Naruto is a Genjutsu fool there's no point in comparing.

Regarding the rest:
I wouldn't have to "bash" you if you wouldn't be like a Robot.
I cannot stand it if people won't use their own brains, overanalyzing and simply go by what they see.
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Old 12-21-2012, 09:19 AM   #215
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Please that level of genjutsu was too weak. Just because he was on Kakashi's level does not mean all of his jutsu's were powerful on Kakashi's level. They are both strong but they specailize in different things. Also the genjutsu took out innocent people who were weak (a.k.a gennin, citiziens) No jonnin/chunnin fell prey to that genjutsu. SO it is different. Plus Kurenai is better in genjutsu than Kabuto.

She is no genjutsu master. By hype she has more genjutsu techs but we do not know how strong they are. All we know is that her "strongest" one was broken out of by a great ninja. Kurenai would know it was genjutsu like SHikamaru then and she would break out of it.... that is IF Tayuya surivived that long.

Overconfidece + Kureani genjutsu = Tayuya's death

So what's your point? tayuya still knows nothing of her target. And Tayuya is not as smart as Sakura. Plus in sakura's case feathers were falling from the sky.... odd no? With trees coming and binding you in a forest it is less odd and people vanish all the time with body flicker. All I am saying it is LESS LIKELY for tayuya to figure that it is genjutsu. Especially if she fell for the Shikamaru n Naruto diversion trap lol. Kurenai could hide behind a tree then vanish if she really wanted to. Didn't she go behind Asuma? So it may not be OOC but whatever. Even if tayuya figures out its genjutsu it may be too late.

It is OOC for Tayuya to move to another branch. She stood in the same spot for 97% of the entire battle. It is OOC for Tayuya to hide. When has she ever hid? Also tayuya is NOT a long range fighter (well she is but she does not act like it)
What am I talking about you ask?
-she got in close to finish off Shikamaru when she could have thrown the kunai
-she punched Naruto when he tried to attack Kimi
-she stood still and engaged Shikamaru in close combat her flute vs his kunai

I already proved that tayuya would not run away to keep the distance. She did not do that with Shikamaru. Also the distance is 50m which is REALLY short. And in a forest where you can leap it is basic for Kureani to close to distance fast.

I dont know what that is

Maybe maybe not. My the FACTS Most likely NOT!
-she may not know it is genjutsu (my main point)
-infliciting pain is not alwayas enough
-she may not kai in time
Kureani could finish her off in that time and/or the Doki would drop dead

look at the chp fight ill try to give it to you.
It can get multiple opponents. AFter all both akasuki memeber saw her dissapear.
Getting multiple and stronger opponents
now when it is broken out of and she only has one in her strongest mode.

Sorry you don't use facts but this is how it is in BG just the facts.
Even if I do not use the facts there is no guarntee that she could break out of it
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Old 12-21-2012, 09:22 AM   #216
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Please tell me how a genjutsu user can't break out of genjutsu? Especially when hers isn't so advanced that you have mental break downs like Itachis or Tayuyas. Genjutsu is controlling another persons chakra flow. You gonna tell me that she can control someone else's but not her own?

Kurenais jutsu also took a long time to actually affect Itachi and Kisame. Itachi was just standing there waiting for it to actually take effect on him. Kisame and Asuma had a little scuffle in between the activation of the jutsu and when it actually effected them. Kurenai also took her sweet time actually emerging from the tree

All you have to do to escape Kurenai is bite your lip. Inflicting pain on yourself to escape is something Tayuya already knows about.
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Old 12-21-2012, 09:26 AM   #217
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Goes to show Kurenais inexperience and perhaps even overconfidence.
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Old 12-21-2012, 09:30 AM   #218
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

You know what's funny?

Tayuyas jutsu worked on Itachi and Sauce man but Kurenais didn't work in the slightest.
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Old 12-21-2012, 09:32 AM   #219
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uchiha Sora View Post
You know what's funny?

Tayuyas jutsu worked on Itachi and Sauce man but Kurenais didn't work in the slightest.
Awww you had to bring THAT up.;D
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Old 12-21-2012, 09:33 AM   #220
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Default Re: Kurenai vs Tayuya

Why is this thread still happening? There is literally, absolutely no point in arguing with him, because it's the equivalent to arguing with a brick wall.

I say that if anyone else wants to come in and defend Kurenai, let them. But until then, Tayuya would win.
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