Tobi vs. Naruto

[PrinceofPeace]

Originally Posted by megabbaut

Again, having knowledge of something does not mean that you can counter it. Tobi always becomes intangible when he's attacked. He never spams it because it's massively OOC and he can't attack very well if he spams it.

Chakra receivers can be dodged easily, and he doesn't have Madara's fan anymore.

Ok we agree that he has knowledge on naruto. Do he would know that the rasenshyurken can expand.
Tobi know this so he would stay intangible after and during while the attack is thrown

[Shikamaru Nara]

The way this fight is set up, it seems like it's stacked in Tobi's favor.

He gets BOTH of his Mangekyou Sharingan, and essentially Kakashi's MS as well. (As far as I'm concerned, MS is pretty useless in the hands of Kakashi aside from Kamui, though.) If this fight had more restrictions, it would be less easy for me to decide.

MS in conjunction with Space-Time Ninjutsu is a combination that Naruto's going to be unable to counter.

[Shukketsu]

I know he can become tangible and intangible at will, but the moment he tries to become tangible is the moment Naruto attacks him.

I'm aware that Naruto may attempt to attack him the moment he becomes tangible again, I'm simply drawing attention to the fact that Tobi can use the ability as is appropriate in a combat situation, and doesn't have to keep it active to make use of it.

However, I'm simply repeating myself at this point and it seems you are showing signs of understanding my point now, so I'll leave it be. As for the subject of discussion itself, I believe Tobi has the upper hand.

[PrinceofPeace]

Demonic chains should end it

[megabbaut]

Originally Posted by Shukketsu

I'm aware that Naruto may attempt to attack him the moment he becomes tangible again, I'm simply drawing attention to the fact that Tobi can use the ability as is appropriate in a combat situation, and doesn't have to keep it active to make use of it.

However, I'm simply repeating myself at this point and it seems you are showing signs of understanding my point now, so I'll leave it be. As for the subject of discussion itself, I believe Tobi has the upper hand.

To get right to the point, how does Tobi counter a Rasenshuriken expanding behind him? Since it's behind him, he can't see it about to engulf him.

[Shukketsu]

By maintaining intangibility until the danger has passed. Given that he has knowledge, this is not unreasonable. However, for the purposes of satiating my curiosity if nothing else, how fast does the Rasenshuriken expand and what kind of size increase results from it?

[GuillermoTheGamer]

im going for Tobi i mean just look at how fast minato was >.> well i suppose naruto could become faster.

[BoxHead]

Minato didn't have that impressive of speed, when compared to someone in the higher tiers. His "speed" was mostly FTGing around.

[megabbaut]

Originally Posted by Shukketsu

By maintaining intangibility until the danger has passed. Given that he has knowledge, this is not unreasonable. However, for the purposes of satiating my curiosity if nothing else, how fast does the Rasenshuriken expand and what kind of size increase results from it?

Well if the Human Path couldn't to it, it must expand pretty fast. You can look at chapter 432 and compare pages 5 and 6 for reference on it expanding.

And like I keep saying, having knowledge of something does not always mean that you can counter it. Even if he has knowledge of Rasenshuriken and that it expands, he can't expect when it actually expands. For example, I can say that Gaara has knowledge of Kankuro's puppets and that he hides them to surprise the enemy (see Kankuro vs Hiruko) , but that doesn't mean Gaara would know exactly where they are hidden, right?

And like I said before, even if Tobi somehow predicts the expansion of Rasenshuriken and uses his intangibility, Naruto can use Shadow Shuriken Jutsu to catch Tobi by surprise when he becomes tangible again to attack.

[PrinceofPeace]

Originally Posted by megabbaut

Well if the Human Path couldn't to it, it must expand pretty fast. You can look at chapter 432 and compare pages 5 and 6 for reference on it expanding.
yes the fact that it expanded is great and all
BUT!!!!!!!!!!!
Since Tobi has full knoweledge he would run towards the attack (intangiable)
when the attack has gone throught TObi would keep runing (intangiable)
Tobi would wait till it expanded then resume (tangiable)
Tobi is fast enough to go in n out of tangiability

And like I keep saying, having knowledge of something does not always mean that you can counter it.
you are correct.... but we just told you how he counters it

Spoiler:

tobi stays intangible

Even if he has knowledge of Rasenshuriken and that it expands, he can't expect when it actually expands. For example, I can say that Gaara has knowledge of Kankuro's puppets and that he hides them to surprise the enemy (see Kankuro vs Hiruko) , but that doesn't mean Gaara would know exactly where they are hidden, right?
yes you are right.
Tobi does not know when or if it will expand. But Tobi can stay intangible for a good 5 minutes. Plus with knowledge Tobi knows how far it can expand. So Tobi would stay intangible for the range of the rasenshuriken.
Tobi knows that it can expand so would stay intabile for a while longer to be on the safe side

And like I said before, even if Tobi somehow predicts the expansion of Rasenshuriken and uses his intangibility, Naruto can use Shadow Shuriken Jutsu to catch Tobi by surprise when he becomes tangible again to attack.
but like you said how would Naruto know when Tobi becomes tangiable? How would Naruto even know if he was tangible or not???
And what is shadow shuriken (chp please)

I think i know what shadow shuriken is and heres what can happen
1-Tobi warps away shadow Shuriken
2-Tobi goes underground to dodge
3-Tobi quickly goes tangiable but immeditely goes back to being intangiable
4-Tobi goes to kaumiland
5-Tobi uses fire ninjutsu
6-Tobi surronds it with a flaming pillar

[megabbaut]

yes the fact that it expanded is great and all
BUT!!!!!!!!!!!
Since Tobi has full knoweledge he would run towards the attack (intangiable)
when the attack has gone throught TObi would keep runing (intangiable)
Tobi would wait till it expanded then resume (tangiable)
Tobi is fast enough to go in n out of tangiability

And when he becomes tangible, he gets killed by a Rasengan.

you are correct.... but we just told you how he counters it

But then he can't attack.

yes you are right.
Tobi does not know when or if it will expand. But Tobi can stay intangible for a good 5 minutes. Plus with knowledge Tobi knows how far it can expand. So Tobi would stay intangible for the range of the rasenshuriken.
Tobi knows that it can expand so would stay intabile for a while longer to be on the safe side

Yes he can only be intangible for 5 minutes so what will he do if shadow clones keep throwing Rasenshurikens at him for more than 5 minutes?

but like you said how would Naruto know when Tobi becomes tangiable? How would Naruto even know if he was tangible or not???
And what is shadow shuriken (chp please)

He would know when Tobi becomes tangible when he attacks.
For shadow shuriken: Chapter 442 page 2

I think i know what shadow shuriken is and heres what can happen
1-Tobi warps away shadow Shuriken
2-Tobi goes underground to dodge
3-Tobi quickly goes tangiable but immeditely goes back to being intangiable
4-Tobi goes to kaumiland
5-Tobi uses fire ninjutsu
6-Tobi surronds it with a flaming pillar

1-He can't see it until he avoids the first one and becomes tangible again, and if he warps it he's tangible so Naruto can kill him especially if it expands in his dimension

2-He can't do that anymore

3-If he goes tangible he dies

4-then he can't attack

5- Naruto blitzes behind him and kills him

6-See 5

[PrinceofPeace]

So naruto is going to spam rasenshyurken and tobi is going to spam intangibility. Well nAruto would be wasting a whole lot of chakra. Tobi can still go underground to dodge

[megabbaut]

Like I said Tobi can not go underground any more. Rasenshuriken spam will last long enough for intangibility to end.

[PrinceofPeace]

why can Tobi nto go underground?

[megabbaut]

Because only Silly Tobi does that and Serious Tobi does not

[PrinceofPeace]

are you saying they are two different people?

(IT's your move in the battle by the way)

[megabbaut]

Well Silly Tobi is the swirl zetsu and Serious Tobi is Obito

[PrinceofPeace]

So I am guessing that means you have no proof that they are different people???

The point is Obito has shown the feat to go underground and as far as we know they are the same person.

Silly naruto rarely uses sexy jutsu but that does not mean he can no longer use it

[megabbaut]

That IS the proof

That is not Obito's feat it is Swirl Zetsu's and they are not the same person

Naruto is different because that is PTS Naruto

[PrinceofPeace]

Obito has switched masks more than once. Just cuz they have different masks and act differently does not mean thy are different.

How do you explain the part when tobi first met Kakashi and the rest of konoha hounds?

He had the swirl mask on but his personality was diffeeent