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Old 11-22-2012, 04:14 PM   #1
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Post Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

I'll try to break this down as good as I can.

Keep these rules in mind :


Gravity is what keeps all matter together.

Blackhole sucks matter with powerful gravity.

If two blackholes with same frequencies meet, they will cancel each other out.


////

Shinra Tensei -

Releases a blast wave from a CENTER OF GRAVITY.

let's say O is that center.
r is the blast radius.


Blast released from O to the blast radius on a 360 degree attack, just like a circle.

Kamui -

Opposite of Shinra Tensei.

It doesn't release a blast, it doesn't PUSH, it PULLS.

S. Tensei PUSHES object P 10m away.
Kamui PULLS object P 10m closer.


Kamui = similar to a Blackhole.

////

Kamui's CENTER POINT OF GRAVITY - X
ST's CENTER POINT OF GRAVITY - Y


X>Y - Kamui works
Y>X - ST works
X=Y - both get cancelled.
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Old 11-22-2012, 05:11 PM   #2
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

Makes sense. And the Juubi has Rinnegan, doesn't it? It could happen.

EDIT: or maybe it's just a weird Sharingan. But Madara and Obito have it, so we could still see it happen.

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Old 11-22-2012, 05:22 PM   #3
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

Kamui is more of a wormhole than a black hole. Even still, it's not officially classified as a black hole, so this wouldn't work that way.

ST is known for repelling taijutsu and ninjutsu. Even though kamui is dojutsu, it technically could work in that sense.
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Old 11-22-2012, 05:32 PM   #4
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BoxHead View Post
Kamui is more of a wormhole than a black hole. Even still, it's not officially classified as a black hole, so this wouldn't work that way.

ST is known for repelling taijutsu and ninjutsu. Even though kamui is dojutsu, it technically could work in that sense.
Even still, if Kamui and ST produce equal and opposite forces, then they'll cancel out.
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Old 11-22-2012, 06:44 PM   #5
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

Shinra Tensei is a force, Kamui is not a force.... Shinra tensei already has an opposite jutsu called BANSHO TENIN performed by the same rinnegan.

Kamui OTOH is not a force. It simply changes the matter composition of the area of it's target before pulling in.

If kamui and shinra should collide, the area by which kamui shinra affects will just get spiraled into kamui, hence making Shinra repel things in the box land.
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Old 11-22-2012, 06:45 PM   #6
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

You imply that ST is a gravity based force. But where did it ever say that? I always assumed it was something like the force of magnetism.

I may be mistaken though.
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Old 11-22-2012, 06:55 PM   #7
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

I thought ST was where you make your self or another object the center or gravity for like a split second, but kamui was just chakra pullin something away, so i thought it would depend on if ST can repel pure chakra?
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Old 11-22-2012, 07:10 PM   #8
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

^ Kamui is not chakra either...

anyhow... one major deference is that u can defend against Shinra Tensei, but u can't defend against kamui...
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Old 11-22-2012, 07:17 PM   #9
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

Hmm.

Its like 2 negatives makes a positive in multiplication. But I see where you're coming from. Hope that makes sense. Lol if not then oh well
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Old 11-22-2012, 07:30 PM   #10
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

The only way to defend ainst kamui is to have it yourself or somehow place an object between you and the users eysight
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Old 11-23-2012, 12:34 AM   #11
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

Why would someone with Rinnega risk with Shinra Tensei, when Preta Path can absorb Ninjutsu?
Maybe it wouldn't work.

Also, Bansho Ten'in is the opposite of Shinra Tensei.

Kamui is like a black hole, it sucks everything in as long as you have chakra.
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Old 11-23-2012, 10:03 AM   #12
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

if preta path can absorb any ninjutsu....it should be able to absorb kamui should it?
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Old 11-24-2012, 07:56 AM   #13
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kalmeast View Post
Shinra Tensei is a force, Kamui is not a force.... Shinra tensei already has an opposite jutsu called BANSHO TENIN performed by the same rinnegan.

Kamui OTOH is not a force. It simply changes the matter composition of the area of it's target before pulling in.

If kamui and shinra should collide, the area by which kamui shinra affects will just get spiraled into kamui, hence making Shinra repel things in the box land.
Kamui was never said to have the ability to SUCK jutsu as well.
//

Bansho Tenin isn't as strong as Kamui, well we can say Kamui is a bit more of a perfected version of Bansho Tenin.

Kamui PULLS and SUCKS objects to another dimension.
Kamui similar to a blackhole. A blackhole sucks objects but it is unknown to where it sends them, it is said that the objects completely dissapear.


//

Okay, if it doesn't work as I said it in the original post, then it might work like this :

If ST's force would be larger than Kamui's -

User activates Kamui.
Shinra Tensei pushes Kamui but doesn't get sucked in by it.
Pushes it to a certain limit and then the Kamui sucks that area.

If Kamui > ST -

Kamui would repell ST but still continue on working, although it probably wouldn't teleport ST to the other dimension.

If Kamui = ST

This is only hypothetical, but they should cancel each other out.

Kamui = -1
ST = +1

ST - Kamui = +1 - 1 = 0
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Old 11-24-2012, 12:31 PM   #14
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kalmeast View Post
if preta path can absorb any ninjutsu....it should be able to absorb kamui should it?
It should. :/
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Old 11-24-2012, 12:48 PM   #15
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

Kamui and Preta Path is similar.

Preta absorbs ninjutsu and only at contact.
Kamui absorbs objects and at any range, even long ranges.

Preta could absorb Kamui, but Kamui could also chop off Preta's head.

//

Answer to Maruko's Dimension question : what if you warp again while in Kamuiland?
YES, you go back to reality.

Proof : Last Chapter, Kakashi warps Gyuki to Kamuiland and immediately (good control of the jutsu) teleports it back to the real world.
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Old 11-26-2012, 09:47 AM   #16
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

@OP I agree with the subect but I don't agree with the reasoning.. Kamui doesnt pull things. It only sucks or warps.

Kamui is a jutsu that WARPS object between two different dimensions.. Enough to classify it as Space - Time jutsu.

Shinra Tensei is a jutsu that PUSH objects by the use of force.
Hence.. WARPING (Kamui) is not the opposite of PUSHING (Shinra Tensei).. But I believed Shinra will cancel Kamui because it can push & distract the Kamui user, thus cancelling it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kalmeast View Post
If kamui and shinra should collide, the area by which kamui shinra affects will just get spiraled into kamui, hence making Shinra repel things in the box land.
Kamui is an ocular jutsu that can warp anything visible but Shinra Tensei is a force that can't be seen.. Therefore, it cant be targeted nor Kamui'd..

That only defense from Shinra Tensei is by increasing your hold on the ground.. Like what 6 tails Naruto & Tsunade did.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyūbi no Yōko View Post
Kamui was never said to have the ability to SUCK jutsu as well.
Yeah it was never said. But it was illustrated many times that Kamui can suck Jutsu as well.. Proof. Kakashi Kamui'd Naruto's rasengan and hits Tobi..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyūbi no Yōko View Post
Kamui PULLS and SUCKS objects to another dimension.
Like I said.. Kamui doesnt pull things. It only sucks or warps.
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Old 11-27-2012, 02:43 AM   #17
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Default Re: Shinra Tensei cancels Kamui?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rikudo Sage View Post
@OP I agree with the subect but I don't agree with the reasoning.. Kamui doesnt pull things. It only sucks or warps.

Kamui is a jutsu that WARPS object between two different dimensions.. Enough to classify it as Space - Time jutsu.

Shinra Tensei is a jutsu that PUSH objects by the use of force.
Hence.. WARPING (Kamui) is not the opposite of PUSHING (Shinra Tensei).. But I believed Shinra will cancel Kamui because it can push & distract the Kamui user, thus cancelling it.
Kamui is an ocular jutsu that can warp anything visible but Shinra Tensei is a force that can't be seen.. Therefore, it cant be targeted nor Kamui'd..

That only defense from Shinra Tensei is by increasing your hold on the ground.. Like what 6 tails Naruto & Tsunade did.

Yeah it was never said. But it was illustrated many times that Kamui can suck Jutsu as well.. Proof. Kakashi Kamui'd Naruto's rasengan and hits Tobi..
Like I said.. Kamui doesnt pull things. It only sucks or warps.
Good reasoning.
The truth is that this thread wasn't made by me, I saw it on another forum.
All I wanted was to see the feedback, yes I did notice some glitches, I played the same movements you did on me on the other forum

That's good reasoning of yours.
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