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Old 08-16-2012, 12:51 PM   #21
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

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Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace View Post
Either way Jiryria loses

I am not going to debate how bad he loses thats cruel to Jiryria
Why enter a debate if you not going say anything :S
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on black person kage when his susuano grabbed him and he put him in ms genjutsu with tsuki.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Souret
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Old 08-16-2012, 01:09 PM   #22
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

Kabuto showed more feats and Justu while in SM so i would give this to Kabuto
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Old 08-16-2012, 02:01 PM   #23
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

Kabuto stomps


We have not seen much from Jiryria unlike Kabuto
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Old 08-17-2012, 01:03 AM   #24
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

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Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace View Post
Kabuto stomps


We have not seen much from Jiryria unlike Kabuto
Barrier: Canopy Method Formation
Barrier: Toad Gourd Prison
Earth Release: Swamp of the Underworld
Finger Carving Seal
Fire Release: Big Flame Bullet
Fire Release: Dragon Fire Technique
Fire Release: Flame Bullet
Fire Release: Toad Oil Flame Bullet
Fire Sealing Method
Five Elements Unseal
Hiding in a Toad Technique
Needle Jizō
Rasengan
Sage Art: Goemon
Sage Art: Hair Needle Senbon
Sage Mode
Shadow Clone Technique
Summoning Technique (Toads)
Summoning: Food Cart Destroyer Technique
Summoning: Toad Mouth Bind
Summoning: Toad Shop Technique
Toad Flatness

How are those 'not much' ? (on top of fukusaku and shimas techiniques)
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on black person kage when his susuano grabbed him and he put him in ms genjutsu with tsuki.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Souret
Yes

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Old 08-17-2012, 07:59 AM   #25
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

Some of those would be useless in his fight and he would not use some attacks in SM

soooooo Whats ur point??

Kabuto still wins

It would be dumb to debate how quickly he wins
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Old 08-17-2012, 08:22 AM   #26
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

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Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace View Post
Some of those would be useless in his fight and he would not use some attacks in SM

soooooo Whats ur point??

Kabuto still wins

It would be dumb to debate how quickly he wins
U said jiraiya hasnt shown much.

I reacted with my list of jutsu he has shown.

My point is jiraiya has plenty in his arsenal to defeat kabuto and u not saying how he would lose is not helping ur case
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on black person kage when his susuano grabbed him and he put him in ms genjutsu with tsuki.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Souret
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Old 08-17-2012, 10:08 AM   #27
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

Kabuto uses earth wall or recarnation to get out of dark swamp. Or he could just shed his skin and get out of the swamp like he did when he was on turtle island.

Jiryria said himself he was bad a genjutsu.

that was PTS Kabuto a much weaker version. So using that has an argument is not valid.

Jiryria would not summon Gama. its not IC. Even if he did summon him. Manda II would take him down

Oro was sick why would you bring him and the fight he had with Saskue up??

Jiryria would have lost even faster to the Uchiha bros. Saskue can beat Jiryria so Kabuto will stomp him
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Old 08-17-2012, 02:55 PM   #28
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

I am back Bit**s uhhh i mean fellow debaters :P

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace View Post
Kabuto uses earth wall or recarnation to get out of dark swamp. Or he could just shed his skin and get out of the swamp like he did when he was on turtle island.

Earth wall while your basicly in a worse version of quicksand? Can he even use jutsu while is he liquid? seems hard with liquid hands..

Jiryria said himself he was bad a genjutsu.

K ill belief you doesnt really matter anyway jiraiya nor kabuto post oros cells use it. And note that a kage lvl ninja that is bad at genjutsu is still decent at genjutsu/breaking it.

that was PTS Kabuto a much weaker version. So using that has an argument is not valid.

I could say the same for jiraiya him fighting oro is even way before the series (its like pts pts) started so is obviously stronger then when he fought oro.

Jiryria would not summon Gama. its not IC. Even if he did summon him. Manda II would take him down.

How is the TOAD sage summoning TOADS not in character please tell me.

Oro was sick why would you bring him and the fight he had with Saskue up??

I already said that in my comment how about getting lolsealed by totsuka he seemed healthy enough there to shed his skin and run to freedom instead of getting almost getting sealed and lost in an eternal genjutsu forever sounds like the ultimate moment to shed to me yet he didnt. Kabuto didnt even shed when they cut his horn off.(which couldve easily been his throat

Jiryria would have lost even faster to the Uchiha bros. Saskue can beat Jiryria so Kabuto will stomp him

There is no way we could know that for all we know it coulve went Frog Genjutsu and GG Uchihax(but ill save maybe for another thread) but itachi is a good guy so he never had a reason to fight jiraiya. I doubt jiraiya would have lost i mean itachi deemed him dangerous enough to avoid battle with. And please dont mention sasuke can beat anyone just because he has plot no jutsu on his side.
Now on to the part i meant to write a few hours ago.
Body Fluid Shedding Technique
Frog Song GG. Dark Swamp gg. Being fluid has its cons.
If it was up to me jiraiya would evaporate him with fire jutsu but lets not go there.

Chakra Scalpel
Because it hurt tsunade (no it didnt) anyway jiraiya still fought while his amputated arm stump was still bleeding jiraiya laughs at chakra scaples he uses them to trim his beard (the beard part is not serious)
Earth Release: Hiding Like a Mole Technique
Dark Swamp try to hide like a mole now.
Hidden Shadow Snake Hands
Because those work really he fought oro in the past with no visible battle scars so he knows his way around snakes. Even if he didnt those barely worked on anko
Human Body Shedding Technique
Already talked about it in the oro vs itachi part. there is a limit to it considering the oh so great sasuke was only able to do it one time.
Many Hidden Shadow Snake Hands
More useless snakes.
Mystical Palm Technique
You are talking like a kage class shinobi would actually give oppertunity to heal and lick wounds.
Sage Art: Inorganic Reincarnation (Manga only)
Even kabutos life force is limited. Smahing through the things he controls should atleast stop it for while. Since its an open place and not a cave jiraiya could always dodge.
Sage Art: White Rage Technique (Manga only)
Jiraiya can needle jizo himself to atleast provide some defense. Techniques dont seem to be dispelled as susanoo was still standing (but weakened) atleast jiraiya would not die from it and white rage is only for a brief moment.
Summoning Technique (Snakes) So you mean to say that a snake sage summoning snaked is in character hmmmm....
Temple of Nirvana Technique
Nothing that fukusaku and shima cant break.
Yin Healing Wound Destruction
He used it for a plain base rasengan to recover (slowly) a cho oodama rasengan would leave nothing to regenerate.

I really want to believe kabuto wins but kabuto really loses SO badly in the destructive power department its not even funny. (Kabuto failed to dent a cave) mean while jiraiya squahes giant snakes with his summons roasts manda wih toad flame bomb and traps people in a toad mouth. Not to mention his sage mode.

The only way i see kabuto finishing of jiraiya is if he uses oros final form poison even then who says he wont get goemoned trying to do so.
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Quote:
on black person kage when his susuano grabbed him and he put him in ms genjutsu with tsuki.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Souret
Yes

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Old 08-17-2012, 03:22 PM   #29
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

Hold up lets take this one at a time

1- Do you think PTS Jiryria can take Current Kabuto???

2- Jiryria would not summon any Boss summons the size of Gama. He disspelled the Boss Toad as soon as he went SM. The only way he would use it if he was fightiig Manda II

3- Just how Kabuto shed his skin when he was on turtle island he can do it with SOTU
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Old 08-18-2012, 01:46 AM   #30
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

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Hold up lets take this one at a time

1- Do you think PTS Jiryria can take Current Kabuto???

you said pts kabuto is not the same as current kabuto
i countered with that the jiraiya that fought oro was also a weaker version of jiraiya since that was not pts but before the whole show even began.
Nver Claimed anything about him fighting pts kabuto however if he knew sage mode (which we probably did being toad sage and all) yes pts jiraiya could take current kabuto


2- Jiryria would not summon any Boss summons the size of Gama. He disspelled the Boss Toad as soon as he went SM. The only way he would use it if he was fightiig Manda II.

He dispelled it because Gamaken was beat up and tired from stalling for time for Sage mode. Kabuto Dispelled Manda II also does that mean he can never use it again? Ofcourse not.

3- Just how Kabuto shed his skin when he was on turtle island he can do it with SOTU
I never said he cant do it. I said it has a limit on how many times you can do it. Easily proven by Kabuto and Oro not being unbeatable because of shedding.
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on black person kage when his susuano grabbed him and he put him in ms genjutsu with tsuki.
Quote:
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Yes
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Old 08-18-2012, 05:17 AM   #31
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

Just letting you guys know.

A>B>C doesn't necessarily work in Naruto manga.

That logic works best in DBZ all around or even in Bleach to some circumstances.

Anyway I agree with Iso.

Jiraiya wins if he had prep or some knowledge.

The problem is that Kabuto's style while lacking killing offensive power is much more sudden and quick in his fighting.

Jiraiya is still more straightfoward and mainly long to mid range although his Sage Mode makes him compete in close quarters much more effectively.

I suppose Dark Swamp counters Kabuto's hydration and what not but he can easily in theory escape it through Rebirth jutsu and his stretching.


Also can Toad Song effect Kabuto since he himself said he can liquify himself to avoid sound waves unless being Genjutsu negates that?
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Old 08-18-2012, 08:48 AM   #32
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

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Jiraiya wins if he had prep or some knowledge.
BUt Jiryria does not have knowledge nor prep in the OP so

Kabuto wins
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Old 08-18-2012, 11:38 AM   #33
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

The thing is Jiraiya has tanked much worse attacks then kabuto could ever inflict. So he gets white rage off then a stab ?(what else does kabuto really have?) and then he gets slammed by one of the giant toads , dark swamped when going liquid, captured in a toadmouth etc If only kabuto had that one ultra damaging finisher i would give this to him but he doesnt. The only thing he has on jiraiya is oros final form poison (if he even has it) but he will gets slammed by one of three giant toads before he even can rejoice in the fact he pulled it off.

Edit: Was the ABC thing directed at me?
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on black person kage when his susuano grabbed him and he put him in ms genjutsu with tsuki.
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Old 08-18-2012, 12:06 PM   #34
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

Kabuto is sooo good Jiryria would be lucky to land a hit. The Uchiha bros barely landed a hit. Itachi and Saskue could beat Jiryria so why not Kabuto? Especially when it was edo Itachi.

Manda II counters any and all boss toads
It is Out of Character for SM Jiryria to use a boss toad the size of Gama. He disspeled the boss toad as soon as he went into SM

Rasheramon, Eart wall, Shed skin, Manda II or snake fodder ninja would get Kabuto out of the swamp. Plus he knows of the attack and would be ready for it.

Toadmouth only workes in enclosed spaces (depending on which one you are talking about. If it is the other one than Kabuto can sense where Jiryria is

Kabuto can finish off Jiryria with
Bone forest
Sticky gold weapons
Manda II (but again would not use it cuz it is out of Character)
White Rage
Drwoning him

I think the A>B>C thing was aimed at me but COME ON

Jiryria would have a hard time with Itachi and or Saskue (ESPECIALLY if they teamed up)

Kabuto held his own against edo Itachi and Saskue
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Old 08-18-2012, 01:35 PM   #35
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

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Kabuto is sooo good Jiryria would be lucky to land a hit. The Uchiha bros barely landed a hit. Itachi and Saskue could beat Jiryria so why not Kabuto? Especially when it was edo Itachi.

Manda II counters any and all boss toads
It is Out of Character for SM Jiryria to use a boss toad the size of Gama. He disspeled the boss toad as soon as he went into SM

I already explained 3 times why its in character for a toad sage to summon toads in sage mode which he learned from .....toads. Does Manda 2 defeat 3 Giant toads at the same time? And for the last time he dispelled him because Gamaken was beaten up while he was stalling for time so that jiraiya could go into sage mode.

Rasheramon, Eart wall, Shed skin, Manda II or snake fodder ninja would get Kabuto out of the swamp. Plus he knows of the attack and would be ready for it.

If you mean rashomon he probably doesnt have it if he does good for him he will be rewarded with a cho oodama rasengan. Wasnt Manda 2 "out of character''

Toadmouth only workes in enclosed spaces (depending on which one you are talking about. If it is the other one than Kabuto can sense where Jiryria is
Jiraiya summons a toadmouth which is already a closed space. In which chapter does it say that it only works in enclosed spaces?

Kabuto can finish off Jiryria with
Bone forest
Same as below and bunta would just smash it if you read my previous like 3 posts you can read why its in character for a toad sage to summon toads.
Sticky gold weapons
Jiraiya took 6 chakra stakes through his back on top of getting one of his arms amputated and getting his throat crushed. Kabutos chakra scaples are more usefull.
Manda II (but again would not use it cuz it is out of Character)
So the guy who pratically invented manda 2 is out of character if he uses it i really dont get your logic.
White Rage
Only Brief and what can he do during white rage? he kill failed to sasuke or itachi. People overrate white rage. Its basicly a ninjutsu version of a genjutsu(hindering senses)
Drwoning him
Fukusaku and shima you know the two toads on jiraiyas shoulders the amphibians(or however its spelled)?
Dont think those would tongue split him in two like they did with pains summons if kabuto attempted to drown jiraiya?


I think the A>B>C thing was aimed at me but COME ON

Jiryria would have a hard time with Itachi and or Saskue (ESPECIALLY if they teamed up)

Kabuto held his own against edo Itachi and Saskue
By that logic jiraiya held his own against pain while even getting a message to konoha. The same pain that would stomp itachi 'cause of soul pulling.
Really kabuto vs uchihax and uchihax vs jiraiya isnt comparable they have 2 totally different fighting styles.
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Old 08-18-2012, 08:09 PM   #36
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

He would summon Ma and Pa but not Gama and pals. If Gamiken was beaten up why didn't he summon Gama or someone else. SM Jiryria does not use Big Boss Toads in battle. and it is soooo out of character that Jiryria would summon all 3

I am not saying he will use Manda II NO BOSS SUMMONINGS. They are Our of Character

No Gama so bone forest would work
Jiryria would still take damage
Using boss summonings is our of character for both
Jiryria not only has to dodge the attack but he can not see what Kabuto will do next . That is the PERFECT time for Kabuto to attack
Frogs Tounge does nothing when Kabuto can grab it or thrun into water to dodge it
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Old 08-19-2012, 02:25 AM   #37
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

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He would summon Ma and Pa but not Gama and pals. If Gamiken was beaten up why didn't he summon Gama or someone else.
Because he didnt want his other frog pals to get hurt by pain ? (he even dispelled shima he cares about his frog friends).

SM Jiryria does not use Big BossToads in battle
we havent seen it does mean he cant.
and it is soooo out of character that Jiryria would summon all 3
If it wins a battle would he do it? my guess is yes. Also Naruto summons all 3 whats the big difference between naruto/jiraiya?

I am not saying he will use Manda II NO BOSS SUMMONINGS. They are Our of Character

No they arent for the 100th time.

No Gama so bone forest would work
Jiraiya Cho Oodama rasengans the bone forest problem solved.
Jiryria would still take damage
nope
Using boss summonings is our of character for both
For the 101th time it really isnt.

I DONT see how TOAD and SNAKE sages summoning their respective animals is out of character. Its out of character for kabuto to directly engage in combat by that logic he would just run away.

Jiryria not only has to dodge the attack but he can not see what Kabuto will do next . That is the PERFECT time for Kabuto to attack

Fukusaku and Shima Can see what kabuto does next while jiraiya dodges it. And can counter what kabuto is going to do. Also there tongues were so fast and powerfull that they split a lizard in two i dont see kabuto grabbing that.

Frogs Tounge does nothing when Kabuto can grab it or thrun into water to dodge it
You said Kabuto can drown them i said fukusaku and shima will not allow that simple.
If being liquid was so 1337 he woudnt have been izanamid by itachi.
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Old 08-19-2012, 10:04 AM   #38
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

The animal path was still alive at the time. He was in SM and could have protected the boss toads. If he summoned Gama maybe Jiryria would still be alive. So why would he not want the boss toads to get hurt now if he feared they would take damage against Pain?? Summoning would be out of character. If he would not want them to get hurt against Pain then he would not want them to get hurt from Kabuto especially in a 1v1 fight when he barely knows anything about him and is most likely underestimating him.

Manda took on 2 boss summonings. SO it is not going over boad if Mana II and take up to 2-3 boss toads. It would be way out of charcter for Jiryria to summon more than one boss toad anyway

How will the toad sages see what Kabuto is doing. The tounge does not do anything cuz he can turn to liquid. Kabuto was getting cocky. He underestimated his foe and he throught genjutsu did not effect him
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Old 08-19-2012, 03:20 PM   #39
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

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The animal path was still alive at the time. He was in SM and could have protected the boss toads. If he summoned Gama maybe Jiryria would still be alive. So why would he not want the boss toads to get hurt now if he feared they would take damage against Pain?? Summoning would be out of character. If he would not want them to get hurt against Pain then he would not want them to get hurt from Kabuto especially in a 1v1 fight when he barely knows anything about him and is most likely underestimating him.

The toads are a giant target for someone like pain . And no kabuto is not comparable to pain in any way. Pain has idk how many giant summons himself so jiraiya wouldnt have been alive if he summoned them since they would have been busy battling pains own summons. What does kabuto have to hurt the giant toads except manda 2 please tell me.

and again ITS OUT OF CHACTER FOR KABUTO TO EVEN ENGAGE IN DIRECT COMBAT YET HE DID. People do things that are out of character when they are faced with potential death. Deal with it.

Manda took on 2 boss summonings. SO it is not going over boad if Mana II and take up to 2-3 boss toads. It would be way out of charcter for Jiryria to summon more than one boss toad anyway

And how did that work out for him? having to shed his skin and getting buntas giant blade rammed in his mouth by tsunade. And in shippuuden he ends up getting fodderized by sasuke (hilarious) seriously manda and his clone are overrated.

How will the toad sages see what Kabuto is doing. The tounge does not do anything cuz he can turn to liquid. Kabuto was getting cocky. He underestimated his foe and he throught genjutsu did not effect him.

Toads have eyes and look out for jiraiya not to mention they are nin toads both having their own sage mode. Kabuto turning liquid will stop his attacks thats what the tongue does. And thats just prove that kabuto just isnt as smart as he looks. I still see him getting frog songed. But lets forget that.


Kabuto gets dark swamped or toad mouth binded which would even counter his liquid form and if it didnt he couldnt escape anyway so he'd just get goemoned or cho oodama rasenganned to teh face.
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Old 08-19-2012, 07:16 PM   #40
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Default Re: Jiraiya Vs Kabutomaru

Animal path summonings and paths of pain that are good in only one field are also easy targets. Toad bosses would have a hard time fighitng a small target like Kabuto due to the fact boss summonings are used to fighting larger foes and Gama would b slower. Kabuto has genjutsu and Manada II to damage toad bosses.
What time are you talking about Kabuto engaged in direct combat?

Manda would have finished off both boss summonings if it was not for being outnumbered. Any summoning would have lost in the position Manda was in. What summoning could have prevented a genjutsu from Saskue ... or any Uchiha. Manda had no chance neither would any other summoning. Manda is one of the strongest summonings sooo not overrated. Underated if anything.

Any close ranged attack is useless with kabuto. Kabuto goes into a liquid form to dodge. White Rage would blind everyone. Frog song takes prep and being convinced by Ma. On the other hand Kabuto's genjutsu is way faster and better.

Kabuto sheds his skin to dodge SotU or tounge bind. Even if Jiryria summoned boss summonings it is way out of character to summon more than 1 especially when Kabuto has yet to summoned AND when Jiryria is in SM and does not want others to get hurt.

How does Jiryria escape Kabuto's webs?
Close combat is useless against Kabuto due to liquid state and Sakon/Ukon genes
Bones can easily be fired at Jiryria
Kabuto knows of SotU
Jiryria has no knowledge of how much of a thread Kabuto is and Jiryria would be overconfident
Kabuto can heal from just about any attack
Jiryria could never beat Oro so how is he going to beat Kabuto.
Frog song takes too much time and genjutsu does not effect kabuto well.. especcially with Sakon/Ukon genes
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