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Old 08-10-2012, 07:04 PM   #1
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Default Tobi is Obito's Father *Updated 597*

I didn't see anyone else saying this, so... Yeah.

Here's how I see it. Kakashi has now figured out that Tobi's time/space jutsu, which sucks things in and brings things out, works the same way as his own jutsu. So basically, they have the same jutsu. Now, for two completely unrelated people to have the same Mangekyo-level Sharingan jutsu is nearly impossible. So Tobi must be Obito.

But looking at it from every angle, Obito died in the battle during the Third Great Ninja War. Heck, even if he survived, Obito has absolutely no fathomable reason to want to do what Tobi is doing now. His connection with Kakashi would be too strong regardless, and even if you discount that, Obito would have no reason to believe Kakashi would ever forget his face while going around with his eye.

So how can Tobi be Obito and not Obito? Well, because he's Obito's dad.

The Sharingan is a Kekkei Genkai, a jutsu passed down through generations. Obito is dead, so Kakashi would be the only person who could use Kamui, unless Obito's father had the same jutsu (which is highly likely) and was still alive today.

Furthermore, Obito's father would likely be old enough to have lived through the Second Ninja World War in addition to the Third, if not old enough to have seen the First as well. Going through three wars would change his perception of the world enough that he would come to see what he's doing now as just, and his age would explain his knowledge of the Leaf and Jinchuriki and pretty much everything. All this, on top of the fact that his son died in the Third war.

This is probably the biggest supporting evidence I can think against Obito = Tobi and for Obito's dad = Tobi. Obito died giving Kakashi his Sharingan and, in a sense, living on through him. Obito now wants to destroy the world? It's ridiculous, and even if true, it would have to be explained through a tremendous amount of flashbacking. But Obito's dad, on the other hand, has seen the horrors of war. He may not have any friends left alive. And, to top it off, his son was the latest victim of war. A man who literally has nothing left to lose is much more likely to become the world's reckoning. Tobi's statement to Kakashi also makes sense, because it's likely Kakashi and Obito's dad didn't know each other well. They'd meet for the funeral and likely not interact again in their lives. It's possible that Obito's father simply disappeared upon Obito's death, and this actually would fit with Tobi's timeline, given Tobi's activities in the Mist and sudden re-appearance in the Leaf with the attack of the Nine-Tails, both of which would've happened after Obito's death.

So, the way I see it, Obito's father makes sense from many points of view while it fits with what's been established in the story and still creates enough of an impact through the revelation of his identity. Of course, some flashbacking is still required, but that's just gonna happen no matter who Tobi is. And, of course, if I'm right, I've kind of spoiled it.

Also let's say for kicks that Obito's dad is named Kagami. In which case file this under the "Obito is Kagami category", but still, the "Is also Obito's father" is a much-needed connection.

Any thoughts?

Update: As of the new chapter, it's looking more likely that Tobi is Obito, as opposed to a different individual. However, I stand by my theory, for now. What Tobi said in this chapter was "empty promises in front of graves", which translates only to someone having watched him in the Leaf Village. This implies that either Tobi is Obito or a Leaf Villager who was close to Obito and, by necessity of his current state, has stolen Obito's remaining eye.

The greatest piece of evidence against Tobi being Obito is Nagato. In a previous thread I made, I said that Tobi gave Nagato Madara's Rinnegan based on a large number of supporting facts which all fit this theory. That said, Nagato received the Rinnegan before the Third Great Ninja War had even begun. Based on this, Obito would have to have been Madara's accomplice for years before his involvement in the Third War, which is inconsistent with his personality and with Tobi's own age for that matter.

Furthermore, the timeline directly supports Tobi being Kagami as the Second Hokage, Kagami's leader, died during the Second War, the same war when Nagato received the Rinnegan.

As far as Tobi's apparent confirmation that he is Obito, he's just doing this to screw with Kakashi.

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Old 08-10-2012, 07:06 PM   #2
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

Hey, welcome back.

This was a very creative theory, too.
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Old 08-10-2012, 07:09 PM   #3
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

I don't really plan on staying, sorry to disappoint. It just came to me and I had to put it out before it was too late. But thanks for the compliment!

So, even if I've said anything different in the past, which I probably have, this is my final stance on Tobi's identity. Tobi is Kagami Uchiha, the father of Obito Uchiha.
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Old 08-10-2012, 07:09 PM   #4
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

Damnit, I totally already called this two weeks ago >.>
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Old 08-10-2012, 07:10 PM   #5
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

And Tobi's dad is Kagami Uchiha
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Old 08-10-2012, 07:12 PM   #6
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rasen_Chidori View Post
Damnit, I totally already called this two weeks ago >.>
Really? Sorry. I didn't see that. But why would Tobi be Obito's father and Kagami Tobi's father? Why not the same person? Given Obito's age it would make more sense if Kagami were Obito's father.
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Old 08-10-2012, 07:13 PM   #7
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

Lol, it's cool I didn't make a thread about it, I just posted it in one of the chapter discussions And my one wasn't as detailed as yours, little more than "Tobi is Kagami who is Obito's dad"
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Old 08-10-2012, 07:16 PM   #8
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

Ah. Well, you know me. Always striving for detail.

Although, since I've said that Tobi gave Nagato Madara's Rinnegan, that would mean that Obito's dad was working with Madara before Obito's death. Which still makes sense, but just means that Obito's dad became motivated before Obito's death and merely disappeared afterwards.
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Old 08-11-2012, 05:20 AM   #9
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

Quote:
Originally Posted by deidara330 View Post
Here's how I see it. Kakashi has now figured out that Tobi's time/space jutsu, which sucks things in and brings things out, works the same way as his own jutsu. So basically, they have the same jutsu. Now, for two completely unrelated people to have the same Mangekyo-level Sharingan jutsu is nearly impossible. So Tobi must be Obito.
Well, that means Tobi is also related to Danzo/former user of every sharingan that Danzo had in his arm. Because they both used Izanagi. And also Itachi and Sasuke must be close relatives of Madara, because they use Susanoo. And Itachi must also be close relative to Tobi because Tobi controlled (ended) Itachis Amaterasu.

I'm just sayin. I don't think that Kakashi could learn jutsu that wasn't already invented somewhere. That he invented it by himself. Izanagi/Izanami have their own history of usage (explained by Itachi). So it was used before.

But on the other hand, Danzo could use kotoamatsukami how he wanted. But only this one jutsu. If it is really Obitos father, then he probably transplanted his sons eye. The other things I think sounds correct.

There is motive, something that other theories like Obito, Tobirama, Hashirama doesn't have. But in my opinion, we are still missing something. Theory is good, believeable.
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Old 08-11-2012, 05:20 AM   #10
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

toby is izuna

orichimaro edo tenseid izuna
izuna transplanted obitos eye to him and disspelled the edo tensei[like madara did]
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Old 08-11-2012, 08:13 AM   #11
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

as soon as I saw that deidara made the theory, i knew i wouldn't be dissapointed.
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Old 08-11-2012, 10:22 AM   #12
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

Quote:
Originally Posted by Topik View Post
Well, that means Tobi is also related to Danzo/former user of every sharingan that Danzo had in his arm. Because they both used Izanagi. And also Itachi and Sasuke must be close relatives of Madara, because they use Susanoo. And Itachi must also be close relative to Tobi because Tobi controlled (ended) Itachis Amaterasu.

I'm just sayin. I don't think that Kakashi could learn jutsu that wasn't already invented somewhere. That he invented it by himself. Izanagi/Izanami have their own history of usage (explained by Itachi). So it was used before.

But on the other hand, Danzo could use kotoamatsukami how he wanted. But only this one jutsu. If it is really Obitos father, then he probably transplanted his sons eye. The other things I think sounds correct.

There is motive, something that other theories like Obito, Tobirama, Hashirama doesn't have. But in my opinion, we are still missing something. Theory is good, believeable.
The thing is, what makes this different from Amaterasu and Susano'o is that every Sharingan user will obtain Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi with the Mangekyo, and will gain Susano'o once both the preceeding jutsu have been acquired. However, like Kotoamatsukami, Kamui is a jutsu that only certain users of the Sharingan will unlock once they reach the Mangekyo, sort of like a Kekkei Genkai within a Kekkei Genkai. Shisui was the only one who could use Kotoamatsukami, so Danzo was only able to use it by having Shisui's eye. Similarly, Izanagi is a jutsu not specific to anyone, requiring only that the user have the Sharingan and the power of a Senju clan member.

Kakashi's eye is Obito's, so if we say Kamui is like Kotoamatsukami, only Obito's eyes should be able to use the jutsu. You could be right in that Obito's father may have actually had to steal his son's remaining eye, which would explain why it seems only this eye can use Kamui, but it is still possible that Obito's father was the original user of Kamui and that Obito inherited it. Shisui himself had no offspring to speak of, so we can't actually say whether a Kekkei Genkai within a Kekkei Genkai can be passed down or can't.
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Old 08-11-2012, 02:11 PM   #13
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

Since koto could only be used every 10 years, and since Danzo knew that wouldn't affect him since he had senju DNA, it stands to reason that some jutsus that stem from the sharingan are uncommon or rare.

We do not know exactly how uncommon or rare kamui might be. I think I read koto was pretty rare, and the most powerful of all the sharingan techniques. Yet Shisui could have only used it...twice in his life. Who then figured out it's once every ten years?

I don't think it is out of the question that Tobi or another Uchiha might have the same T/S eyes as Obito.

Obito's body should have been recovered. So the eye could have been stolen later by his father or someone else. That makes much more sense than Obito surviving the boulder crushing jutsu (the one after he gave his sharingan, not before).
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Old 08-11-2012, 09:23 PM   #14
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

It could be someone related to Obito. His dad is a good of choice as any.
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Old 08-11-2012, 11:27 PM   #15
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

It could be Rin's brother at this rate
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Old 08-12-2012, 10:07 AM   #16
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

i said this two weeks ago too noone pays me any attention tho i posted it in the bet....
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oro-"WITH OTHER SUBJECTS I'VE TRIED ORALLY BUT THEY JUST GAGGED IT ALL BACK UP"
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Old 08-12-2012, 10:14 AM   #17
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

^That's probably why
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Old 08-12-2012, 11:14 AM   #18
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

Originally Posted by Uchiha Maruko
I found a hole in your theory.
You say that they both use the same dimension, and that everything that Kakashi warps hurts Tobi?
Remember when Kakashi warped Deidara's blast, that would have killed Tobi if the theory were true.


it only crosses paths in the other dimension if they do it at the same time like there is one door and they're both goin in(and out) at same time and bumps into each other.

*cough* not obito *cough* Obito's Father *cough* Tobi was Obito's nickname* cough*cough* Revenge for his son dieing so young*cough*cough*Kumai family jutsu*cough*cough*.... excuse me allergies towards obito theories hes to young and was crushed by a boulder!!! R.I.P.
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i posted it in a few threads too this is the i told u so thread buy kyubi.
ps. im not fancy with computers, quoting older qoutes is new to me(i copy-n-paste this like the old days) so i put what the first guy posted in orange and what i posted in red. see im ahead of my time hell my explanation even matches kakashi's im so underatered
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oro-"WITH OTHER SUBJECTS I'VE TRIED ORALLY BUT THEY JUST GAGGED IT ALL BACK UP"
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Old 08-18-2012, 06:04 PM   #19
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father

Bump: Updated, with new evidence against Tobi being Obito and for Tobi being Kagami/Obito's father.

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Old 08-18-2012, 10:10 PM   #20
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Default Re: Tobi is Obito's Father *Updated 597*

Quote:
Originally Posted by deidara330 View Post

Furthermore, the timeline directly supports Tobi being Kagami as the Second Hokage, Kagami's leader, died during the Second War, the same war when Nagato received the Rinnegan.

As far as Tobi's apparent confirmation that he is Obito, he's just doing this to screw with Kakashi.
The second hokage did not die during the second war. It was the first. Hiruzen and Danzo were young Then. In the second war The 3 sennin, were Hiruzen's pupils. They were older at that time that Hiruzen in the second.

So Nagato is closer in age to Minato, likely 2-7 years older.
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