Who will win? <Hokages Edition>

[PrinceofPeace]

Originally Posted by Godaime Kazekage

Srsly dude?? Not sure why you're ranting against Minato and me and Musouka-chan for supporting him, but you're missing some crucial points. We got to see one battle from Minato against an opponent who couldn't be hurt by any attacks unless he solidified himself-of course Minato is going to use FTG, nothing else would be effective-for that matter, there isn't a single other Hokage who would've been able to do anything against Tobi.

As for one good move-did you not notice his ST barrier? That's probably one of the best jutsu in the 'verse. Also, we got to see one battle from him in which he showed highly advanced Space Time techs, Rasengan, Shiki Fujin and a Boss Summon-that's already a bunch of techniques in one battle. He probably also has a bunch of other awesome techs, we just didn't get to see them and unlike most of the other Hokages his abilities are only shown in his one battle and not through other characters talking about him.

Further, what does Hashirama have that can prevent Minato from blitzing him and blowing off his head with Rasengan...nothing. Also, his greatest ability, Bijuu control, would end up being a liability in a battle against Minato-he has a Bijuu spit a TBB at Minato only to have Minato redirect it right at his face with an ST Barrier.

Finally, and this is directed at Kioroshi-there's a big difference between So6P and Hashirama in that So6P is 100% hype whereas we have seen a battle with Hashirama-and this, his only on-panel action, was a pretty pathetic showing-tag teaming with another Kage he was defeated by an old Hiruzen, who...guess what...used one of Minato's jutsu to defeat them.

Yes, I understand that Hashirama is a beast, but Minato is also no slouch and has the right tools to win in almost every situation.

To use FTG Minato has to put a seal places. That takes time and he only has so many tags. Good Luck putting a seal on one of the greates ninja ever.

ST is only useful against long ranged energy attacks . Hashirama uses Wood style so ST is not going to be a big help

Hashirama tamed the Nine-Tails . Gama had trouble with the one-tailed. SO...... Hashirama could easily bind the frog with wood style

Wow probably your saying probablythen I gues probably Hashirama had other weapons and jutsu's we did not see as well. ONLY USE STUFF WE HAVE SEEN no ASSumptions please

Hasirama will not be bilitz so easily HE HAS AMAZING HEALING ABILITIES
can Minato can only blitz him if he put a tag on them

NOT ONLY does Hasirama have bijju control he has
WOOD STYLE
MONSTER STRENGTH
AWESOME GENJUTSU
INSTANT HEALING ABILITES
and other crazy stuff

what does Minato have
FROGS & SPEED (not much)

How does Minato beat Wood Release: Advent of a World of Flowering Trees (uless he put a tag far away from the battle or can fly he is in trouble) This attack stops close ranged attacks and minato excels close range.

Minato is strong but his only feat is speed.

Hashirama wins

[king kakashi]

hashirama's only feats are hype and the brief ET version of him and in the et got stomped by the old man i give this win to sarutobi

[Kuromaki]

Hashirama beat Madara, that's a feat.

Orochimaru was toying with Sarutobi & if he made Hashirama go all out he would've done something like the flowering trees

[king kakashi]

Originally Posted by Kuromaki

Hashirama beat Madara, that's a feat.

Orochimaru was toying with Sarutobi & if he made Hashirama go all out he would've done something like the flowering trees

thats still hype (it was never seen by anyone so we have no idea how it went down) and by hype hiruzen is the strongest hokage ever

[Kuromaki]

No it's not, it was a part of naruto history and Madara admits over and over that Hashirama would kick his ass even in his edo tensei-fied state.

The only thing Sarutobi has going against that is his 'strongest Hokage ever' hype, which unlike Hashirama's achievements, really is hype because we have seen nothing quantifying it and what Madara's saying about Hashirama is sorta contradicting it.

And even if Sarutobi were in fact the strongest hokage ever, it wouldn't matter because he's old in this fight and his old self is 'miserable' compared to his younger self.

[king kakashi]

Originally Posted by Kuromaki

No it's not, it was a part of naruto history and Madara admits over and over that Hashirama would kick his ass even in his edo tensei-fied state.

The only thing Sarutobi has going against that is his 'strongest Hokage ever' hype, which unlike Hashirama's achievements, really is hype because we have seen nothing quantifying it and what Madara's saying about Hashirama is sorta contradicting it.

And even if Sarutobi were in fact the strongest hokage ever, it wouldn't matter because he's old in this fight and his old self is 'miserable' compared to his younger self.

very true i still think that the madara vs. hashirama fight is still semihype because we've never seen it and therefore can't realy quote it
but you can't argue that weather or not the third is in his prime i respectfully concede

[PrinceofPeace]

Oro was controlling the 1st so he was not at his best. And his jutsu's would beat anyone else it does not matter his hype

[JLI2infinity]

Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace

Oro was controlling the 1st so he was not at his best. And his jutsu's would beat anyone else it does not matter his hype

On top of Oro controlling him, Hashirama and Tobirama were still smacking Hiruzen around. The only times Hiruzen was kicking ass was when he was going head to head with Oro and Hashirama and Tobirama were sitting back and watching. Although it was embarassing when they both got tagged by Old Man Hiruzen and got their limbs blown off (even if his taijutsu is a 5 and he's a master of all forms of shinboi combat), but I'm sure if they were alive they would've actually realized it and used a substitution jutsu. In their Edo forms it didn't matter.

[Godaime Kazekage]

Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace

To use FTG Minato has to put a seal places. That takes time and he only has so many tags. Good Luck putting a seal on one of the greates ninja ever.
Minato is exceedingly fast even without FTG (see chapter where he saved baby Naruto from Tobi) all he has to do is put a kunai near him-hitting him is not a problem.

ST is only useful against long ranged energy attacks . Hashirama uses Wood style so ST is not going to be a big help
Any proof for that? Also, the main point was that he can redirect Hashirama's most powerful weapon. He can easily dodge wood style with FTG.

Hashirama tamed the Nine-Tails . Gama had trouble with the one-tailed. SO...... Hashirama could easily bind the frog with wood style.
Assumption on your part, and wasn't even an argument I was using.

Wow probably your saying probablythen I gues probably Hashirama had other weapons and jutsu's we did not see as well. ONLY USE STUFF WE HAVE SEEN no ASSumptions please.
I agree, I was just responding to someone saying Minato has a lack of abilities-when he's actually shown a diverse skill set and in only one battle.

Hasirama will not be bilitz so easily HE HAS AMAZING HEALING ABILITIES
can Minato can only blitz him if he put a tag on them.
As stated above, Minato is fast without FTG, I don't see Minato having a problem tagging him-old Hiruzen placed an explosive tag on him. Hashi's "amazing healing abilities" won't save him if his brain is destroyed.

NOT ONLY does Hasirama have bijju control he has
WOOD STYLE
MONSTER STRENGTH (Not true-no evidence for this)
AWESOME GENJUTSU (One genjutsu shown)
INSTANT HEALING ABILITES (Not gonna help against a Rasengan to the brain)
and other crazy stuff (such as...)

what does Minato have
FROGS & SPEED (not much)
...and Rasengan, ST techs, sealing techs, a sensing technique (like Tobirama), and amazing strategical ability at the spur of the moment and under pressure.

How does Minato beat Wood Release: Advent of a World of Flowering Trees (uless he put a tag far away from the battle or can fly he is in trouble) This attack stops close ranged attacks and minato excels close range.
Has Bunta spit oil on the flowers or jumps to a different location (as demonstrated by the manga he has tags set up in locations all over-like his house or the Hokage monument, or Kushina for example)

Minato is strong but his only feat is speed.
Blatantly untrue.
Hashirama loses

In bold.

[PrinceofPeace]

How would Wood style be defeated by ST. The branch would go into ST then what... it would not be as efffective to work on as to a long ranged energy attack

Not really an assumption gama<bijju tail Harisharam> bijju

Hiruzen placed a tag on an EDO HASHIRAMA who was being controlled. He was not going all out.

one genjutsu is more than what Minato has shown.

ST will not help nor will sealing. Sensing is not very effective and Hashirama is stratgical and great under pressure as well. rasengan is the only threat.

Okay bunta uses oil. good luck covering the whole area. Great Minato flashes away thats a great job. Just run away from the strongest hokage.

Minato can not flash if caught in a genjutsu.

[Godaime Kazekage]

Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace

How would Wood style be defeated by ST. The branch would go into ST then what... it would not be as efffective to work on as to a long ranged energy attack
Not sure what you're trying to argue with this...it's obvious that Minato would use his speed to avoid the wood style, not a barrier.

Not really an assumption gama<bijju tail Harisharam> bijju
Yes, it is an assumption-just because Ninja A beat Ninja B and Ninja B beat Ninja C, does not mean that Ninja A will beat Ninja C. The fact that Hashirama can control tailed beasts has nothing to do with him being able to catch and restrain Gamabunta. Especially when Minato and possibly other frogs are involved in the battle.

Hiruzen placed a tag on an EDO HASHIRAMA who was being controlled. He was not going all out.
It's likely that Hashirama and Tobirama would have fought better if they could've used their own strategies in the battle, but the fact remains that in a taijutsu exchange an old Hiruzen was able to tag Hashirama. Minato is much faster than Hiruzen, he won't have any problems tagging Hashi.

one genjutsu is more than what Minato has shown.
True. I was responding to your exaggerated implications of Hashirama having an awesome repertoire of Genjutsu.

ST will not help nor will sealing. Sensing is not very effective and Hashirama is stratgical and great under pressure as well. rasengan is the only threat.
A complete assumption on your part-Absolutely no evidence for this. Unless you're trying to argue that fighting against Madara fulfills these qualifications Also, ST Barrier and sealing are very useful, assuming that tailed beasts are involved in the battle.

Okay bunta uses oil. good luck covering the whole area. Great Minato flashes away thats a great job. Just run away from the strongest hokage.
Doesn't need to cover the whole area, just the flowers. So avoiding an attack is now considered running away...?

Minato can not flash if caught in a genjutsu.
False. Hiruzen was perfectly capable of using jutsu while he was under the influence of the bringer of darkness technique.

In bold.

[megabbaut]

Please tell me what ST is.

[PrinceofPeace]

Wood style is fast too and supplementary it will not be very easy for Minato. Gama was beaten easily by one tails so it is obvious that nine tails would crush it. Gama has nothing against a bijju

hashriama would not fight close hand it is not like hime. And now your comparing Minato and Hiruzen like they have the same feats. Just because Hiruzen put tags onto an EDO hashirama and saw through the genjutsu does not mean Minato can do it to.

Hashriama can make more flowers or block the oil with wood style Gama can not make that much oil and spread it that fast

[Godaime Kazekage]

Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace

Wood style is fast too and supplementary it will not be very easy for Minato. Gama was beaten easily by one tails so it is obvious that nine tails would crush it. Gama has nothing against a bijju
Wood style is not nearly as fast as Minato-it's very obvious to predict, and hasn't (at least permanently) caught anyone every time it's been shown in the manga. (Hiruzen escaped from Hashirama's wood style, Sasuke and Kakuzu escaped Yamato's, all of the Kage's easily avoided Madara's-Minato is much faster than all of these characters).

It's true that Gama can't effectively take on a Bijuu, but that's not much of a problem in this case-Minato will have already killed Hashirama or broken his control over the beasts before Gama will need to fight. I've never argued that Gamabunta would be used to fight the tailed beasts.

hashriama would not fight close hand it is not like hime.
It's not like Hashirama has a choice-Minato is going to bring the fight to him, and how do you know it's not in Hashirama's nature to fight in close combat?

And now your comparing Minato and Hiruzen like they have the same feats. Just because Hiruzen put tags onto an EDO hashirama and saw through the genjutsu does not mean Minato can do it to.
What else am I supposed to do? Minato and Hashirama have never fought-in debate threads you necessarily have to compare characters according to the feats of other characters. I don't see why it's such a stretch to believe that a faster ninja with better reaction speed would be able tag Hashirama when a slower ninja did it. EDO Hashirama has the exact same abilities as regular Hashirama-only difference is he didn't have the ability to use his own battle strategy. Your point about the genjutsu is ridiculous-by your logic there are no other characters in the Narutoverse who can see through Hashirama's genjutsu, because Hiruzen was the only one proven to do it (even though no one else was proven to be unable to). When all you have to go with is the fact that one character was able to function despite being in a genjutsu you'd naturally assume that other characters would also be able to function under the genjutsu unless that specific character is especially well known for genjutsu resistance, which Hiruzen is not.

Hashriama can make more flowers or block the oil with wood style Gama can not make that much oil and spread it that fast
We also have no idea how many flowers he can make (while trying to fend off Minato at the same time, mind you)

In bold. Also, meggabaut-ST is "space-time", I think you were confused because PoP was often abbreviating the name for Minato's space-time barrier technique as ST.

[TobiramaSenju307]

NO one else can do what the 1st did.

He took on Kurama AND Madara.

thats probably because no one else can supress kurama and control him. without that hashi was sure to die. he already almost died\

Hashirama is a monster, the true defintion of a god shinobi followed

how? when hed lose definitely to real gods like nagato and madara.

he said himself that the person he fought was stronger than him

no he didnt. he said no one can fight tobi without a specific set of abilities. which he had but minato had to fight kyuubi too so he couldnt finish tobi himself

don't see Minato finding a way around Hashirama's defense, genjutsu, or healing ability.

im sure healing wont make him grow his head back after its blown to bits by rasengan and wood defence is crushed by gamabuntas massive oil katon.

The First Hokage would win

no he wouldnt

Not to mention he did own Madara and the Kyuubi in the same battle

no he didnt. madara nearly killed him and he had to supress kyuubi not fight him. mito sealed kyuubi.

Though he seriously got downgraded in the fight with the Third Hokage...

impossible as all edos are the same power as the moment they died.

the 3rd in his prime could not even beat the 1st.

and yet he did exactly that at 70 years old.

and last BUT not least how does the 3rd defend against Wood Release: Advent of a World of Flowering Trees: it is Hashirama's STRONGEST attack and if the 3rd breaths the posion in he is DONE FOR.

yuo think he wont know about that? his own teacher's tech?

Minato had a hard time with Tobi

anyone would. look at tobis jutsu set\

He's like the strongest ninja ever known, other than the Sage of Six Paths.

not even close. plenty of shinobis would annhilate him. like kabuto, muu, madara, nagato, tobi, naruto, danzo

[PrinceofPeace]

Hiruzen did not beat hashirama he beat the edo version of him who was not at his best plus he was controlled by Oro

Hashirama would knockout tobi with fumes from plants

Just because you know of you teachers strongest attack does not mean you can beat it you did not say how he would win and you did not say who you think would win

the edos are as strong as the one controlling them

surpessing is fighting do no sugarcoat it

Hashirama has too many feats too win

Tobi survied rassengan why not Hashirama

[HashiramaSenju]

You've got you Hokages mixed up man
1st Hashirama Senju
2nd Tobirama Senju
3rd Hiruzen Sarutobi(Old Man)
4th Minato
5th Tsunade

[HashiramaSenju]

Hashirama will win!

[PrinceofPeace]

Polls say Hashirama wins

Spoiler:

polls NEVER LIE

[TobiramaSenju307]

Hiruzen did not beat hashirama he beat the edo version of him who was not at his best plus he was controlled by Oro

so third raikage was not beaten by naruto and nagato was not beaten by jins and itachi? ok...even at 50% its still hashirama senju. and hiruzen was confident he could beat both his teachers.

Just because you know of you teachers strongest attack does not mean you can beat

so the professor who knows all existing jutsu in konoha wont find a counter?