Byakuya vs Kenpachi

[megabbaut]

Originally Posted by Vongolatheeleventh

Ichigo got stronger though out each fight.... But yeah Ikkaku is roughly low captain class, the reason he even stated he never revealed his bankai is because they would promote him and he wants to be under Kenny.... Ikkaku also didn't use shunpo in the bout..... Regardless Ikkaku is way slower then Byakuya based on feats. Renji spent years with Byakuya and developed methods to react to Byakuya. He also is low-mid captain class. Also take into consideration Byakuya wasn't really going that far out to fight Renji.....

Is Tousen lieutenant level? cuz Kenpachi was reacting to him just by senses. Even when he was blitzed it didn't do much damage.

[Vongolatheeleventh]

Originally Posted by NagatoGod_of_Pain

Of course there are inconsistencies. But if Kubo states something that is easily flexible to all instances, then it should be fact. Ikkaku doesn't even release his Shikai until he's beaten up. He holds back on using his strongest moves. Using, or lack thereof, Shunpo is no different. Ikkaku is purely a CQC fighter, he doesn't use attacks that help him gain the advantage.

True, I only meant to use that as an example though. He should have been notably faster then Ichigo at that point, especially when he was going to lose. Though Ikkaku will hold back using anything in some advantage over an opponent, he does still try his best to win. Hence the lucky dance, and duty.

Ch. 286 and 287 - He can barely stand. Riiiiight. He put Orohime over his shoulder, picked up Nel and was going to walk away......

I'm new to this forum, I actually tried to post scans but it turns out you need the direct website and yeah it blocked what I gave xD so my apologies that I couldn't show you what I meant, but IIRC that was also a gag scene....

Funny, since Ichigo was pretty much losing to Nnoitra, he automatically has "drastically less reaction time".

He kind of did though. Nnoitra wasn't even portrayed as a speed based character but as soon as he showed up, he was not only undetected but kicked Ichigo away as if he were just fodder. I mean Ichigo is above the average captain at this point and he was just KICKED away. Albeit it's hard to move with such injuries. He barely could follow Nnoitra and his reactions, and I think it's really safe to assume it's because of how he expended himself against Grimmjow.

Would it not be fair to ignore preconceived notions? Considering Ichigo just fought a tough opponent, his reaction time should be as sharp as can be.

In a sense you're right. I mean you should keep your gaurd up and everything, but he was tired. I mean like Kenny should in theory be way slower then Ichigo at this point, but he's completely on par with Nnoitra who outsped Ichigo to the point Ichigo couldn't react?

Of course Ichigo was injured. I never disputed that. You claimed that readers can clearly see the damage Ichigo took from his previous fight. I said you can't because, well, you can't.

That was my bad. I haven't read those old chapters in a while but I remember the beating he got from Grimmjow (especially being impaled in the stomach twice). Maybe it was an illustration error? I mean I have scans showing he WAS indeed slashed and heavily injured, and I doubt he has wolverine like regeneration xD

Spiritual energy and physical injuries don't have a direct correlation. Ichigo was physically injured, yes. If it were serious, then it would have prohibited him from fighting, but it didn't. Ichigo's spiritual energy was at full power. I remind you that spiritual energy increases every aspect of your fighting abilities, meaning his speed, strength, reactions, and Zanpakuto were at their peak.

Uncontested. I don't understand why they forgot to include Ichigo's injury, and I was exhausted yesterday I forgot why I brought injury up. It's heavily suggested at that point Ichigo was tired though, his bodily movements by the time Nnoitra came somewhat proved difficulty to react to someone who's speed should be slower as well as only moving at faster speeds and such out of rage and momentum. I don't like arguments saying Nnoitra and Grimmjow were that far apart because Nnoitra is one rank ahead, because Grimmjow should be faster. Grimmjow keeps up with Ichigo who was blitzing a shinigami top tier in speed at this point, Nnoitra was on par with a pretty slow enemy of lieutenant level speed (roughly) with captain class reaction.

Funny how you keep relying on subjectivity instead of objectivity. Everyone knows that Byakuya is supposed to be one of the faster characters. All I'm saying is that a fully spiritual energy powered Ichigo struggled with Nnoitra, who in turn lost to Kenpachi.

Byakuya IS one of the fastest characters though who at this point is one of the only ways to scale Ichigo in contrast to Nnoitra. That's all I'm saying. Byakuya isn't the fastest captain, being blitzed by Ukitake and everything, but he was more then enough to blitz Ichigo after he fought Kenny, provided Yourichi didn't save him. Sorry if I dragged it out though, as long as we're all in agreement Byakuya wins here their is no need for us to try to get one another to concede

Originally Posted by megabbaut

Is Tousen lieutenant level? cuz Kenpachi was reacting to him just by senses. Even when he was blitzed it didn't do much damage.

I never said that.... I said speed wise Kenny was lieutenant level with captain class reactions, and that Kaname's speed WAS NOT enough to blitz him seeing as how you need 2-3x speed above an opponent to blitz them, provided their reaction time was at their speed. I'd pit Tousen low captain level. Also Kenpachi has way more durability then Tousen so it makes sense that he can outlast him. Also Tousen wasn't trying to finish him right away, he was taking his time, which lead to his downfall in that bout

[Cult of Personality]

Tousen was screwing around. It was pretty obvious that he wasn't trying particularly hard to actually kill Kenpachi.

I'm new to this forum, I actually tried to post scans but it turns out you need the direct website and yeah it blocked what I gave xD so my apologies that I couldn't show you what I meant, but IIRC that was also a gag scene....

Just as well. You can get infracted for posting pics of anything from Shonen Jump here. It's a really idiotic rule.

[The Immortal Watch Dog]

the Tousen fight is a prime example of PIS and CIS

Tousen being a damn pawn of Aizen who seemed to be powerful even back then should have had the staying power to wound Kempachi and his Bankai gave him the tools to end it in seconds

1, he had to hold back or wasn't a vaizard yet

2, he got butthurt about Zaraki's out look on life and took the battle immensely personally and wanted to punish him and torment him more than anything else - while in a monolog about how it wasn't personal like a true resentful

essentially Kane tousen fought like a moron and paid for it dearly. It's not exactly a good feat to use in defense of Zaraki..Byakuya while prideful and vain even against Ichigo didn't let that fully cloud his judgment

and it wont happen against Zaraki especially when he knows just how much that acting like that can cost him.

[Mouse]

Originally Posted by megabbaut

Byakuya can't hurt Kenpachi

^

Lolwut?




Kenny and Byakuya are both Captains my friend.

[The Immortal Watch Dog]

Originally Posted by Mouse

^

Lolwut?




Kenny and Byakuya are both Captains my friend.

not all Captains are created equal and this has been made painfully obvious numerous times

[Mouse]

Originally Posted by The Immortal Watch Dog

not all Captains are created equal and this has been made painfully obvious numerous times

You're right I'd say Byakuya Soifon and Hitsugaya are the weakest.

While Yama, Kyoraku, Ukitake, and the other Seniors are stronger.

Spoiler:

(I won't name other Seniors for obvious Spoiler Reasons)

But saying Byakuya can't harm Kenpachi is definitely incorrect.

[The Immortal Watch Dog]

I wasn't disagreeing with what you were trying to convey at all I agree both can absolutely harm the other and badly at that.

I was just pointing out that saying because they're captains isn't perhaps the best way to go about correcting the guy is all do you have an idea of who would win this?

[Mouse]

Originally Posted by The Immortal Watch Dog

I wasn't disagreeing with that you were trying to convey at all I agree both can absolutely harm the other and badly at that.

I was just pointing out that saying because they're captains isn't perhaps the best way to go about correcting the guy is all

Yes I completely understand. You were quick on that one I expected nothingness from a OBD member.

[Cult of Personality]

Hitsugaya yes, Byakuya and Soifon no. Komamura and Kenpachi.

[The Immortal Watch Dog]

Originally Posted by Cult of Personality

Hitsugaya yes, Byakuya and Soifon no. Komamura and Kenpachi.

Komamura? the guys got some the best damage soak feats in the series granted that's all he has but still.

Toushiro.I dunno there's his fight with Boobs Mcgee which he seemed to handle pretty well until forest gump bailed Queen honkers out

[Cult of Personality]

High damage soak does not make for high power.

Boobs McGee was screwing with him the entire time as proven when she casually blitzed him with just an air slash after first using Ressureccion. The Ice Clone was lolkubo. Even his "instant death" final attack didn't do anything to her.

[Mouse]

With the recent Time Skip Byakuya has impressed me.

I like Byakuya he's one of my favorites that's why I tell myself he's weak so I don't wank him.

Hitsugaya's limiter is what makes me classify him as weak.

Soi Fons shikai isn't much help unless the enemy's reitsu is her level or weaker.

Aizen proved that with their difference in power

Until they prove otherwise they still aren't impressive other than Byakuya and Kenpachi.

[Cult of Personality]

Aizen stopped Soifon from landing a second hit. If it wouldn't have done anything to him, why would he bother?

[The Immortal Watch Dog]

Soi Fon was a massive let down especially considering what Yuroichi could do even out of shape

edit - I always assumed boobs got bailed out by Forest Gump and his big bag of lard and that she wouldn't have been fine other wise

[Cult of Personality]

Inverse Law of Fatality Versus Usefulness. Or something.

Anyway, since Soifon's shikai is insta-kill, Kubo(in one of the few smart moves he's ever made) can't let it be used on anyone with any real importance because that would kill tension or whatever.

Originally Posted by The Immortal Watch Dog

Soi Fon was a massive let down especially considering what Yuroichi could do even out of shape

edit - I always assumed boobs got bailed out by Forest Gump and his big bag of lard and that she wouldn't have been fine other wise

Nah, Hitsu was like WHEN THE LAST SNOW FALLS YOU'LL DIE!!! and then like fifty chapters later after the last snow had fallen, Forest Gump and the BBOL showed up. Plus, her power is hot water. How hard could it be to melt the ice?

[UchihaXSasuke]

byakuya doesn't realy have something that could kill kenpachi only by a mass atack wich can be blocked by kenpachi,and in the end kenpachi will catch byakuya

[Cult of Personality]

Kenpachi can't block all of Senbonzakura Kageyoshi. He might block some of it but not all of it.

[Vongolatheeleventh]

Originally Posted by UchihaXSasuke

byakuya doesn't realy have something that could kill kenpachi only by a mass atack wich can be blocked by kenpachi,and in the end kenpachi will catch byakuya

How in the hell can Kenny block a mass surrouding attack.... Or move sealed in kido....... Or having his head cut off after being sealed in kido

[Mouse]

Originally Posted by UchihaXSasuke

byakuya doesn't realy have something that could kill kenpachi only by a mass atack wich can be blocked by kenpachi,and in the end kenpachi will catch byakuya

Other than a barrage of Senbonzakura thousands petals.

Blocked by Kenpachi? Since when has Kenpachi shown the flurry slash that Ichigo did when breaking out of SenbonZakura in the SS Arc?

Uhh he has Senbonzakura I seem to recall him using it to kill Zommari.

Kenpachi can keep up with Byakuya in speed now?