Tier Debate: Itachi vs. Pain

[Kuromaki]

Originally Posted by Super Sanin 3

Well the sword and the shield are in it and the Magatama is the 3rd item in mythology next to the sword and the shield

Not always look at Danzo

Yeah it's more risky but not completely useless, there's still the 5 second rule () and using Preta Path would be risky, he doesn't want his defense destroyed. Plus if somebody like Asura uses missiles it'd make a large explosion, which Susano'o can tank and use the sword to pierce one of the paths, even healthy Nagato couldn't react

The sword and the shield are part of the armor though. And like I said, having a fancy name doesn't make it a spiritual weapon/ The only ones confirmed are the sword and the shield.

Dude I don't even know what happened in that fight, but I'll play along. They have multiple lines of sight don't they so why not just rely on that?

I believe it was said that Nagato still had a lack of mobility earlier in this thread. Did the chakra heal his legs too?

Also, Pain still has his summons and such, Itachi would just waste his chakra trying to kill those. You gotta take into consideration just how much energy Susanoo and the rest of the mangekyo jutsu use up. We don't know if being a zombie had any effect on his chakra, but chances are it did.

[Super Sanin 3]

The sword and the shield are part of the armor though. And like I said, having a fancy name doesn't make it a spiritual weapon/ The only ones confirmed are the sword and the shield.

Dude I don't even know what happened in that fight, but I'll play along. They have multiple lines of sight don't they so why not just rely on that?

I believe it was said that Nagato still had a lack of mobility earlier in this thread. Did the chakra heal his legs too?

Also, Pain still has his summons and such, Itachi would just waste his chakra trying to kill those. You gotta take into consideration just how much energy Susanoo and the rest of the mangekyo jutsu use up. We don't know if being a zombie had any effect on his chakra, but chances are it did.

But they're just weapons, Sasuke's Susano'o doesn't have them, why would only 2 out of the 3 legendary items in Mythology be spiritual items? Doesn't make sense

Danzo didn't know he was under a genjutsu (remember when his Izanagi ran out), but wouldn't somebody still have to look at his eyes? Or at least his fingers, remember Naruto was caught in finger genjutsu but didn't know at first

Well he's suppose to be healthy again, he got to Hanzo pretty fast and easily in the flash back

Summons aren't too bad, the sword cut through Hydra's head like ribbons with ease. That's also why this thread will take forever, because a lot of it is speculation, remember that the Mizukage weakened while he was using the clone. Put yourself in a position where you're living off medicine and willpower alone, while fighting somebody like Sasuke

[Kuromaki]

Originally Posted by Super Sanin 3

But they're just weapons, Sasuke's Susano'o doesn't have them, why would only 2 out of the 3 legendary items in Mythology be spiritual items? Doesn't make sense

Danzo didn't know he was under a genjutsu (remember when his Izanagi ran out), but wouldn't somebody still have to look at his eyes? Or at least his fingers, remember Naruto was caught in finger genjutsu but didn't know at first

Well he's suppose to be healthy again, he got to Hanzo pretty fast and easily in the flash back

Summons aren't too bad, the sword cut through Hydra's head like ribbons with ease. That's also why this thread will take forever, because a lot of it is speculation, remember that the Mizukage weakened while he was using the clone. Put yourself in a position where you're living off medicine and willpower alone, while fighting somebody like Sasuke

There's a lot of things in Naruto that don't make sense. I'm not accepting that it is a spiritual weapon until proven otherwise, because so far nothing points to it being of a spiritual nature other than its fancy name.

Yeah but the dog can keep regenerating unless Itachi uses ammy on it, and there are the other summons too like the Giant Panda. That's not even taking into account the Six Paths.


I wouldn't have let myself get into that situation in the first place... but that's beside the point... xD Also, I'm pretty sure Steaming Danger Tyranny had some sort of bad effect on him because it had to cool down, or whatever.

Edit: Forgot to reply to something yeah that's true, they'd have to look at his eyes (unlikely since they have knowledge) or his fingers to get caught. and assuming one gets caught, the others should be able to tell since there's six of them and not one like Danzo.

[Super Sanin 3]

So it's basically all speculation than >.>
Don't forget how quick it can be used, remember how long it took Naruto to get out of the genjutsu even with backup? Itachi found out about linked sight pretty quick, he notices this stuff. For example, if Preta Path is distracted by absorbing a ninjutsu (ammy for example) that leaves the paths open. I'm not even going to deny that there's a great chance Pein would win, I just believe Itachi would win more times than lose

[Kuromaki]

More inferring than speculation. P:

If Preta path is absorbing something, the other paths aren't going to stand there doing nothing.

[321zigzag3]

Originally Posted by TheBlackChidori

I just really don't see the summons being an issue at all, looking at how Itachi reacted to Hydra. For that matter, Itachi's Susano'o has Yata Mirror. Baku wasn't able to break through Sasuke's Susanoo without a double-team, and none of Animal Path's summons are on Baku-Level.

Baku is overall a bit smaller. 2nd, Baku's wind vacuum isn't doing much to the summons.

Overall they serve different purposes.

Either way, Amaterasu is enough.

Itachi will need several of that.

As for Asura Path, Kakashi and Choza were hitting him, Itachi won't have a problem. You're making it sound like Itachi has no speed or Taijutsu forte, when has 5's in the databook.

Asura intercepted Kakashi's thrust. 2nd, the lightning shadow clone temporarily paralyzed Asura giving time Chouza to punch with his giant fist.

Shared Vision is a problem unless its close range for Itachi. Nagato was reacting to Itachi's shunshin in the beginning by giving warnings.

Jiraiya was smart enough to take out his eyes, so is Itachi. He was forced to use nothing but Taijutsu against Jiraiya, and with Susano'o out, good luck with that.

Human Path is mainly speedy distraction and shield.

I think it's a bit different then that. I think they'll moreso effect all 6 bodies rather than Nagato. And again the shared vision comes into play. Vision is notSound.

Not really because the chakra receivers connect to Nagato. They don't connect to each other. The manga never implies that.

Its Nagato who actually looks through all of them, hence shared vision.

But that wasn't genjutsu. That was just him physically absorbing chakra that the body couldn't handle. It's completely different.

But yes but if the bodies were sharing chakra, Deva Path would have been affected too.

Genjutsu is also about controlling chakra as well. The chakra aspect is still somewhat there.