Naruto Tier List - Group Debate

[BMC1994]

^I know this is kinda vague but its an combination of both.

By looking at both you prevent mistakes like suigetsu in kage tier even if he doesnt have the offensive power to back it up.

And the one with better feats usually is the one who beats the other anyway.

[PrinceofPeace]

lol yeah that was vague

I still do not understand how Tsande is above sages????

Yes she is a tanker YES!!! But she can not tank forever. Her mode has a time limit. Plus she is not a tanker to a Frog Song + SOTU combo

If so many people do not understand how Tsuande is above sages then she does not belong there

Tanker and somewhat speed is the only 2 major feats of hers

The sages have speed, somewhat strenght, ninjutsu , smartz, and endless modes

[JLI2infinity]

Some small editions to the list I used to have, although not all that much has changed

1) Edo Madara
2) Tobi / Hashirama / Naruto
3) Nagato / Itachi / Kabuto / Bee
4) Sasuke
5) Minato / Hiruzen / Third Raikage
6) Muu / Second Mizukage
7) Jiraiya / Sakumo / Shisui
8) Oro / Danzo / Hanzo / Izuna / Kakashi / Gai
9) Kages / High Tier Akatsuki / Kin-Gin Bros.
10) Kitshuchi / Darui / Mifune / Low Tier Akatsuki / Jinchuuriki
*11) Highly Skilled Jonin (e.g. Asuma, Zabuza, etc.) / Kage Bodyguards (Kankuro, Choujuro, Ao, etc.)

Bumped the Kin-Gin Bros. down a bit and bumped Bee up a tier since all he's been showing these past few chapters is ridiculous stamina and rapid fire nukes even if the Juubi is owning him.

[PrinceofPeace]

BMC I DO NOT GET YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You say Tsuande is the best tanker but what about Oro?!?!?!?
Oro got bisected yet he is below Tsuande. And we all know Oro would own Tsuande.

So once again PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE but Tsuande blow both sages

Originally Posted by TheBlackChidori

God Tier
Tobi with Rinnegan and Six Paths
Orochimaru with Edo Tensei(Kages (maybe) not full power)
Hashirama Senju with Tailed Beasts
Madara Uchiha with Rinnegan

Legend Tier
Killer Bee
KABUTO! SAGE MODE
A
Muu
Yagura - Sanbi
Kakashi Hatake
Onoki
Kabuto Yakushi - Sage mode.
Kabuto has 24 hrs prep. That is enough to get his bone flute ready before Onoki or anybody can attack. So he should be below Killer B and higer than Ay.
Tsunade
she NEEDS to fall. Her mode is NOT endless. Saskue's Amaterasu could end her. And If Saskue summons his Hawk Tsuande has no way of hitting him! Tsuande also sucks at genjutsu so how would she break out. And Water dome GG. Kisame just dodges her until she drowns
Might Guy
Naruto Uzumaki - Sage Mode
Jiraiya - Sage mode
Kisame Hoshigaki
still say Kisame is better than. Tsuande! After all her special mode does not last forever. And Kisame broke out of Aoba''s genjutsu AND broke out of wood style in a weakened state. Not to mention Surived Guy's attack that was suppose to kill him. And Kisame tanked an attack from KM Naruto. Not only Kisame infiltarted Kumo and gained bijju chakra.

Kage Tier
Konan
Kin-Gin Bros
are you sure Konan is stronger? It took her more than 24hrs to make that much paperbombs. And The bros have survived much worse then a lot of bombs. Plus there are 2 of them! Not to mention their tools. And Konan does not have many feats to talk about
.

changes ARE NEEDED

what about base:Kabuto, Jiryria, and Naruto

maybe Tsuande can have her own Bykugn mode and a base Tsuande to seperate them. But seriously she can not be in it forever

[BMC1994]

Prince it hasnt been an problem in the past but lately you have been double posting alot.

If you want to add something to yuor post and no else has posted yet use the edit button. Its next to the quote button.

Did oro Punch susanoo, or survived an slaughter which decimated 4 other kage (2 with extremely high durability).

Correct me if i am reading the rules wrong but powers like kimis kekkei genkai cant be activated during prep time.

Tsunades byakugo is long enough to last her a couple of chapters which is enough for most fights. Seperating tsunade and her byakugo is unneeded.

We dont know how long it took konan to make the paper sea but she wont need that much for the kin gin bros. Who cant phase ,10 seconds of explosion would be enough compared to the 10 minutes needed for tobi.

[Uchiha Sora]

If Orochimaru isn't going to be put under Naruto then he MUST be under Madara.

Current Madara just drops meteors and its done. Once Oro is dead, the match is over. Not to mention he would start in perfect Susano'o and he could just make a few casual sword slashes and rape oro's face off. Current Madara should be stronger than Hashirama. Madara didn't fight Hashirama when he had the rinnegan.

Madara is currently Hashirama + Madara + Nagato mixed together.

[BMC1994]

^True but in that case shouldnt we also move madara above hashi?

[Devils Lawyer]

Why is obito in base above Naruto? Also why is Naruto and Bee not in God tier. At their current levels you can argue about them defeating most of the people in god tiers. I know for a fact Naruto could most likely win against Madara.

[BMC1994]

Originally Posted by Devils Lawyer

Why is obito in base above Naruto? Also why is Naruto and Bee not in God tier. At their current levels you can argue about them defeating most of the people in god tiers. I know for a fact Naruto could most likely win against Madara.

Because no matter how powerfull naruto gets he cant hit obito without kamui.

Tell me how would naruto survive 2 meteors? And wasnt madara strangling him with his wood dragon before juubi showed?

[JLI2infinity]

Lolz I think my list is more accurate and inclusive than the current official tier list anyone want to vote mine instead of the OPs. Then we can discuss the changes and I'll move them around as people make their cases.

[BMC1994]

Besides there being no basis at all for sakumo and shishui being up so high, sasuke being above minato and TRK (while his son murdered him) and muu and kakashi , there being no basis for hiruzen to be so high unlesss you take in hype, danzo being to low it looks similiar to this one.

And 'kages' is maybe too generic i mean there are huge differences between all the kages.

Upped Gaara/w shukaku(funny thing is i think gaara without shukaku is stronger) i mean he can create deserts and has killer defense and can fly defend from deidara C3 etc.

Also upped the sage above tsuande because of rasenshuriken and frog song.

Edit 1:I kinda want to replace gaara/w shukaku with current gaara i mean the removal of shukaku barely harmed his power and defense. Thoughts?

Edit2: Changed gaara w/shukaku to just gaara
all kinds of changes in the lower tiers thoughts are always welcome

Edit3: Added titles for the kages, good/bad?

[Devils Lawyer]

Originally Posted by BMC1994

Because no matter how powerfull naruto gets he cant hit obito without kamui.

Tell me how would naruto survive 2 meteors? And wasnt madara strangling him with his wood dragon before juubi showed?

What are you talking about? At his fullspeed Naruto has tagged Obito. The only thing is after that Naruto has had to deal with several bijuu, Madara, and Obito. Yeah also lets not forget the juubi. Not just Obito. Not only if he catches obito cleanly with frs that is game over.

By blowing them the hell out of the sky. Naruto can crank out multiple bijuudama. Each one powerful enough to casually turn them into dust. Madara did catch him with woodstyle. Naruto escaped afterwards with his speed and intercepted an attack from Obito meant for Kakashi. Naruto easily has an arsenal that can go blow for blow with Madara.

[BMC1994]

all i remeber is obito phasing thorugh his , kakashis and gais attacks also including a bijuu bomb

And while hes busy cranking out bijuu dama at the sky madara slashes him with perfect susano'o/catches him with woodrelease.

Besides that the people in god tier either have an immortal squad/army, ridiculous numbers or are straight up gods.(juubi/so6p)

[PrinceofPeace]

Yes Tsuande has shown great feats recently. But how would she kill Oro. Oro could not kill her in her special Bykguan mode but that will not last forever. Oro does not even need a mode. He survived a close up battle with 4tails Naruto... and Oro took the battle as a joke! Plus his hands were sealed. Oro has been bisected and Oro was compelety unphased.

Oro solo'd 4tails naruto. While Tsuande needs help with Base Kabuto and an edo Madara.

Oro is smarter and more skilled. Even a better tanker. The only thing Tsuande is better in IS IN STRENGTH

We all know Tsuande can not beat Oro. SO How is she better with only 2 feats that do not last forever.

With Oro's slitering snake mode he can outspeed her and keep the distance. Or Oro can go underground or get her in a genjutsu or just tank the hit until she gets tired

Did Oro punch Susanoo...COURSE NOT. but with Eight Branches. Oro would have no issue with a susanno.
After all Madara's susanoo is not Itachi's Susanoo. ANd Madara is not even taking Tsuande seriously

And lets not forget ORo did tank a DIRECT HIT from Tsuande.

You say Tobi (base) is stronger than Naruto cuz Naruto can not hit Tobi.
SO....
How is that different from Tsuande can not KILL Oro? Tsuande can only be in that mode for so long. And in or out of that mode she can NOT kill Oro. Not to mention Tsuande will be serioulsy tired when her mode ends

I would LOVE LOVE LOVE!!!! To see Tsuande beat 4 Tails Naruto ...WITHOUT her arms

Since Tsuande has seals on her Oro COULD seal it with 5 Element Seal

Has Tsuande
-survived KN4 Naruto?
-tanked a TBB?
-Tanked a Tsuande punch

[BMC1994]

Kabuto abused her fear of blood so she couldnt use her full intellect or power.

And tell me the name of one person in the manga who doesnt need help with edo madara.

Yeah oro took a direct hit from tsunade while a panel before she had been stabbed right through the heart. Not to mention neither of them were at full power anyway.

Yeah madaras susanoo indeed is not itachis susanoo its superior save for totsuka but madara doesnt need hax like that as he can already cut mountains in half anyway.

Has tsunade fought kn4 naruto , no. But let me return the favor and ask has orochimaru ever fought edo madara.

oro never tanked a TBB , if you mean the rashomon that would fall under defending not tanking as it wasnt his own body that was getting hit.

Why would tsunade punch herself please enlighten me. Could oro survive his own poison?

btw 8 branches would be suicide look what she did to manda.

we both know the second he gets close enough to do the seal is the second he will get his skull cracked.

[PrinceofPeace]

Originally Posted by BMC1994

Kabuto abused her fear of blood so she couldnt use her full intellect or power.
So? Even before that Tsuande could not touch him. She could not keep up with him and could not land a hit. Kabuto was just playing her like a fool.

And tell me the name of one person in the manga who doesnt need help with edo madara.
You reallly wanna know? Ight listen in close

Spoiler:

HASHIRAMA

SHHHH its a secret lol

Yeah oro took a direct hit from tsunade while a panel before she had been stabbed right through the heart. Not to mention neither of them were at full power anyway.
At least tsuande could use her arms AND had back up. Oro was in a more dire state without ninjutsu/arms or back up and in a serious health condition. Tsuande was not complaing from the stab

Yeah madaras susanoo indeed is not itachis susanoo its superior save for totsuka but madara doesnt need hax like that as he can already cut mountains in half anyway.
That was not the same Susanoo. Even So 8Branches would still smash madara's susanoo

Has tsunade fought kn4 naruto , no. But let me return the favor and ask has orochimaru ever fought edo madara.
No. Yet Oro would be more help. Due to his ET and the fact that he is hard to kill

oro never tanked a TBB , if you mean the rashomon that would fall under defending not tanking as it wasnt his own body that was getting hit.
true....but he still suriveved without his special mode and without his arms and in his health condition

Why would tsunade punch herself please enlighten me. Could oro survive his own poison?
lol that is not what I meant.

btw 8 branches would be suicide look what she did to manda.
Lol what did she do? Have help from Jiryria and Gama and Katasyus. WIthout the sword from Gama then Manda would still be kicking

we both know the second he gets close enough to do the seal is the second he will get his skull cracked.
But he tanks it like a boss

So how does Tsuande kill Oro ??

[BMC1994]

No kabuto was losing if i remeber correctly and then he resorted to exploiting her fear.

edo madara , smartass.

Its hard to complain when you just got stabbed through the heart

Yeah its not the same its superior that was my point.8 Branches would smash perfect susano'o (the one that slices mountain ranges) the same eight branchers which itachis susanoo manhandled?

Why would he use edo tensei kabuto already summoned everyone avaiable, and tsunade is also hard to kill. Besides no edo around can handle current madara.

He couldnt use rashomon without his arms. (it was without souls arms but he could still use arms)

No without that sowrd manda wouldbe gotten his skull cracked , hard.

Skull - Cracking.

[PrinceofPeace]

Originally Posted by BMC1994

No kabuto was losing if i remeber correctly and then he resorted to exploiting her fear.
How was he losing? He was constantly dodgin her attacks and got hit once. Yet Kabuto instatnly recovered by figuring out how his body works. Tsuande was overconfident and could have finished it but kabuto was too god.

edo madara , smartass.
Again HASHIRAMA! Even Madara said so. And also Kabuto with prep.

Its hard to complain when you just got stabbed through the heart

Same when you get bisected by 4tails
or
Got your arms's soul removed
or
punched by Tsuande

Yeah its not the same its superior that was my point.8 Branches would smash perfect susano'o (the one that slices mountain ranges) the same eight branchers which itachis susanoo manhandled?
I am not talking about PS. Tsuande did not punch PS. The Susanoo Tsuande puched is the one Oro would beat with 8Branches

Why would he use edo tensei kabuto already summoned everyone avaiable, and tsunade is also hard to kill. Besides no edo around can handle current madara.
Oro just has to stall till Tsuande's mode runs out which is not very hard. With Oro's tanking and the fact that he can travel underground and slithering at fast speeds make him hard to hit and defeat.

He couldnt use rashomon without his arms. (it was without souls arms but he could still use arms)
And he STLL was not at full power

No without that sowrd manda wouldbe gotten his skull cracked , hard.
then why did Tsuande not do that ealier.

Skull - Cracking.

Still does not KILL Oro. Oro got a direct head to the cheeck and surivied.

My point is 2 feats of Tsuane in her mode does not make her beat Oro or make her better nor does it mean Tsuande could beat him

[JLI2infinity]

Originally Posted by BMC1994

Besides there being no basis at all for sakumo and shishui being up so high, sasuke being above minato and TRK (while his son murdered him) and muu and kakashi , there being no basis for hiruzen to be so high unlesss you take in hype, danzo being to low it looks similiar to this one.

And 'kages' is maybe too generic i mean there are huge differences between all the kages.

If this is a response to my list Sakumo was hyped as being greater than all 3 Sannin combined, Shisui was well known and respected by characters like Kabuto and Bee, taught Itachi how to use MS, and has the most powerful genjutsu in the shinobi world, his spot is well deserved.

There is a basis for Hiruzen being so high numerous statements regarding his ridiculous skill and mastery of shinobi techniques. Both Kabuto and Oro have stated that he was the best of his generation. Tobirama made him Hokage at around Naruto's age. Just releasing his chakra caused a change in the atmosphere and even in his old age he proceeded to spank Oro in taijutsu when Hashirama and Tobirama weren't helping him.

A beat the Sasuke that couldn't manifest a full Susano'o not the current Sasuke who pulls it out like it's nothing. If Minato were to go against Sasuke he wouldn't be able to do jack sh*t. Rasengan isn't breaking through Susano'o and it's definitely not getting through an Amaterasu defense. It'd just be another stalemate match with Minato fans claiming Minato wins because he cant be hit. The only time Minato would actually be able to put Sasuke down would be if the fight started at close range in which case he could speedblitz.

Sure Kages is too generic I can accept that. Other than that I don't see anything wrong with the list. I actually think it works a lot more than trying to rank people 1 by 1 which just becomes a big arbitrary mess where someone in 4 positions below someone else might still be able to beat them.

[PrinceofPeace]

erg I dislike Hype
--------------------

So Tsuande is so high on the list because she is PHYSICALLy strong and can tank a lot for a peroid of time?++

>.>