Spoiler The importance of pairings and deaths!

[SilentBlade]

I know this topic has likely been discussed before in the NaruX<insert name here> threads to death, and a lot of people blow these things off as unimportant because this is a fighting manga, and really the focus should be on the fighting!

Now, with as much as we have nothing really to discuss plot wise (we kind of got a concluding detail more so than anything to build on), I thought perhaps an interesting discussion on some of the important things we're seeing, and why they add so much to the story was appropriate.

First of all, I know somewhere there are NaruHina fans dancing in the street while the others are in their 12/21/12 bunkers again shaking their heads. While what has happened has happened, I think a look at how the character development is shown so prominently here, and perhaps what we expect for others.

Looking at Neji's death, and Hinata's development through the series, I think this was handled well. First of all, Neji actually died following the destiny he thought he was going to, however it was not due to the forced servitude that he once thought he had, but by the choice he made. It was one of those euphoric moments where destiny, fate, and free will all met up! Hinata finally shook Naruto and made him realize just how important he is to everyone, and especially how important he is to her and Neji! While Neji's character development has been brought full circle, I feel Hinata's has a little further to go, but its developing out nicely!

Moving on to Naruto himself, this has been one of those really exceptional manga's with character development of Naruto being superbly handled! I am not even talking about his power ups or fighting ability, because its all been driven by his personal development through the series! from prankster to hero, we see him as always with a sense of humor and warmth (goofiness), and finally here we see him near the edge of madness to be saved (again) by Hinata. Its quite interesting seeing this character development through out the series, from chasing Sasuke to being chased (metaphorically) by Sasuke. This pairing with Hinata though really brings his character down to earth a bit more and it adds something that was missing in his personality, and that was deep affection. We see the development move from boyish crush in the beginning with Sakura to a deep affection with Hinata.

Now, of course the obvious question of "why not Sakura?" as I have watched the character developments through the series, where we see some hinting and what not of pairings, it would ruin Sakura's character development more so than Naruto's, and here is why! Sakura's character has been pretty much obsessed with Sasuke the entire series, while that may seam like a weak reason, we consider her character development and growth has followed a similar path as Naruto's and that was the ultimate goal of bringing back their comrade. What sealed it for me was when Sakura confessed to Naruto that she loved him, with the intention of going to kill Sasuke and give her life in the process next. Here we see her attempting to release Naruto from his duty, give him what he wants (in a superficial manner) and rescue her LI in the only way she knows, kill him (and likely herself) in the process.

I hate to say that the only significant death we have to discuss so far is Neji (since Shika & Ino's dad's haven't died yet).

What do you all think? any additional observations/thoughts?

[LilHinataGirl]

You have quite an interesting theory and I actually have to agree on most of it! (:

[Bacon]

He knows how to make a mediocre manga interesting...xD

[Naruske Uzuchi]

obsessed? The problem is not being obsessed, it's being ''not letting go of the past.'' Sakura wants to kill Sasuke but couldn't because she was holding onto the past. Even though he's an enemy now they use to e friends... um sort-of, which is why Naruto also can't kill Sasuke. I don't think he'll go through with the ''me-and-you-will-both-die-bullcrap''

[SilentBlade]

The idea here is it creates a very complete character. The manga only got a bit wonky in a few place...Obito being Tobi was one of them (more because of the justification than the actual person...Obito needed a better reason).

Essentially, romantic subplots and significant deaths in stories create even more character connection and actually have bigger impacts on the readers than are ever really appreciated. In gaming today, Mass Effect, the story was important to people, but the most important events to people in the series were significant deaths as well as the romantic subplot! It created LEGIONS of fans for those particular side characters and is part of reason people were so stigmatized by the end... I could continue listing examples (wouldn't be as current), but that particular element of character development creates a deeper relationship between the reader and the main character.

As for Sakura being obsessed, in the beginning she was, along with every girl! She had a crush on him through most of the series, and even when he was gone, she never stopped her feelings for him. A maturing of those feelings from a childhood crush, to an adolescent understanding of those feelings and a desire to bring him back, and finally a resolve of understanding the impossibility of it, and finding a solution on her own. Its quite a well done character development if you ask me.

[Sir Michael]

Not reading all that.

But in a nutshell. Character deaths advance movement in pairings?

[SilentBlade]

Originally Posted by Sir Michael

Not reading all that.

But in a nutshell. Character deaths advance movement in pairings?

Essentially, yes! The idea here is to look at what has happened, and try to take in the importance of each event as well as the importance to that particular characters development.

We can only look at Neji's death because that is the only one of consequence we've had during the war (that we know about). I also looked at Hinata & Naruto's pairing, the importance of that to their character development, and what that might mean for Sakura and Sasuke's character development.

[koshej]

I'll add a bit of the other side, NaruSakuSasu.
Both Naruto and Sakura started off having an obsession-style crush on their targets, but for very different reasons.
Sakura mostly wanted to be like all other girls, she maybe even liked Sasuke a bit herself, but the main initial drive was the fangirling crowd. She never seemed to NEED Sasuke to prove anything to anyone, herself included. This later on developed into more mature crush, with (probably, never paid much attention) more understanding of how Sasuke actually felt. By the time he left Konoha, she was basically his friend emotionally, wit a crush flavor. Still, it wasn't centered on herself, but rather on him.
Now, Naruto was VERY different. His crush on Sakura was a case of extreme loneliness driving him to attempting to get attached to anyone (most probably her being a girl was NOT the main reason). She easily became one of his precious people, like some others, boys included. The very fact that she actively denied him (unlike Sasuke's passive ignoring of Sakura, which MIGHT have been seen as "coolness" by her initially) by constantly hitting for basically behaving like he typically did (even if it WAS stupid sometimes), should have easily shown him that SHE wasn't interested in HIM. But since she wasn't the central reason for that "affection", he kept ignoring it by imagining that she actually liked him (plus, he never experienced normal affection, so he might actually think it was normal). This took place for years, but even the biggest idiots do grow up eventually, so when he did, he stopped being so emotionally selfish and realized that she didn't care for him at all (in the past). Even when she finally started showing him some friendliness, he was already past the point of realizing the above, so he didn't push further. All this took place totally independently from Hinata's involvement. Now, the moment Naruto heard someone actually confessing love to him (Hinata WAS the first, I just checked it once more, see more below) and nearly dying for him, he experienced something he never felt before and had to reformat his feelings' hard disc for that new program. It took him long enough, but by the time Sakura tried her (obviously fake, I just reread it intently, she basically said she was his friend, cause "I'm one of those that love you" is hardly a description of romantic love) "confession", Naruto was mature enough to see "underneath the underneath" and tell her: "don't lie to yourself".
So, the end:
Sakura grew from being a mindless crowd-driven FANGIRL into loving Sasuke for REAL, so she still loves him and is open to forgive him, should he want to try loving her back somehow. Which in itself might be a drive for him to "come back to normal people".
Naruto grew from NEEDING someone into APPRECIATING someone, so he's now mature enough to actually understand Hinata's feelings. Also, Hinata went the other around, she started admiring him for his personality, which grew into drawing personal strength from him. She also went through quite a long period of actually NEEDING him, but now they both are BEYOND that phase and mature enough to start a normal adult relationship.
My personal IMHO - but I'm entitled to opinions, so...

[SilentBlade]

That is actually a very good analysis on the psychology of the pairings and even the individuals! It goes with the idea of their character development and supports what I said in terms of why certain actions would violate character developments and we would have another poorly explained plot point that hovers around without proper clarification...nicely done :-D

[koshej]

Thanks.
I was trying.
I'm also NOT a mindless fanboy that just likes fanserved girls for boobs or faces.
I'm more interested in actual characters.
Sure, some will say "get a life", but we shouldn't forget that our REAL lives ARE influenced by the fiction that we imbibe...
And that was a very SERIOUS remark.
(Mostly unfortunately for many...)

[SilentBlade]

Originally Posted by koshej

Thanks.
I was trying.
I'm also NOT a mindless fanboy that just likes fanserved girls for boobs or faces.
I'm more interested in actual characters.
Sure, some will say "get a life", but we shouldn't forget that our REAL lives ARE influenced by the fiction that we imbibe...
And that was a very SERIOUS remark.
(Mostly unfortunately for many...)

Actually, in college I did a course on the psychology of literature! it really influenced how I read just about any fictional story, watch any movie or any game I happen to play!

It definitely enhances your understanding of how the author wants you to feel or what they want you to see.

[koshej]

You know what's PROBABLY most funny?
There's quite a good chance, that Kishi DIDN'T plan this so deeply.
I can't tell for sure, obviously, but from what snippets I heard about some of his interviews, many things he changed during the course of the manga, while I review it in retrospective and thus implying preplanned plot from the very start.
It's funny to think about, really.
(I'd so like to go Yamanaka on Kishi myself, you can't even guess... )

[Kyūbi no Yōko]

I agree that Neji should've died at some point and should've been the first, but the issue is the way he died, it was ridiculous! It was a classic simple death for such an awesome character. In that situation there were clearly a lot of ways to save Naruto and not only by Neji but by the others too.

What fixed it for me was the outro of the death, the words he said, thus making a major impact on Naruto.

[Azal]

This is actually a pretty good thread. I usually hate threads involving "omg NaruSaku for realz!" But this one actually explains the story signifigance of the pairings. Well done.


If you want my input, pairings are OK as long as they're relevant. At first, they didn't really seem relevant, now you can see that they have a much deeper meaning. But if it is put in there for no real reason, like in other forms of media, such as Shakugan No Shana, Tales of Graces f, or heck, even the first book of the Last Dragon Chronicles, then that will just make a really immature story, especially if it isn't under the romance genre.