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Old 09-06-2012, 07:07 PM   #1
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Default On the subject of Naruto's villains.

Spoiler:
They want to dismantle an economic system based on warfare.

One that uses child soldiers extensively.

One where thousands of shinobi are brainwashed to believe in pseudo-religious gibberish like "Will of Fire/Stone/Boobs/etc."

One where Larger, more powerful countries use small third party ones as their battlefield in wars where they have no stakes at.

One where man who creates a jutsu that enslave people souls and turns them into zombies becomes a leader and celebrated hero.

One where child stealing and organ harvesting is businesses as usual.

One where people get demons sealed inside them and are then treated as living weapons.

One where if you choose to save your companions instead of following the mission you'll be shunned and driven to suicide.

One where people as treated as expendable tools, to be dealt with on first convince.

One where monsters like Danzo and Orochimaru gain power and thrive.

But when someone goes against the system, he's branded as evil.

Sure we might not agree with the methods they use, but lets not pretend that the system they oppose is anything but hellish and inhuman.


Found this online.

Thoughts?
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Old 09-06-2012, 07:11 PM   #2
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

Crack is wack
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Old 09-06-2012, 07:20 PM   #3
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

How is this a case of crack is whack? akatuski maybe despicable but the system their fighting against is honestly morally reprehensible

Konoha should be burned to the ground..all the villages should and their leaders be put on trial for massive war crimes god knows how many human rights violations and be executed

people often forget the heroes of the story are fighting for an incredibly corrupt and evil system
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Old 09-06-2012, 07:22 PM   #4
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

War is war. People are out there to win. The Akatsuki are like mercenaries.
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Old 09-06-2012, 07:23 PM   #5
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

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Originally Posted by The Immortal Watch Dog View Post
How is crack whack? akatuski maybe despicable but the system their fighting against is honestly morally reprehensible

Konoha should be burned to the ground..all the villages should and their leaders be put on trial for massive war crimes god knows how many human rights violations and be executed

people often forget the heroes of the story are fighting for an incredibly corrupt and evil system

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Old 09-06-2012, 07:37 PM   #6
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

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So what you're saying is you're an anti-captialist? (Which I'm fine with.)
...What the hell? Where did you get that from my post? Further more are you for real? Capitalism has nothing to do with the shinobi system..what so ever

A war based economy has a lot more to do with imperialism and even then the way the hidden villages work..is a really messed up nonsensical distortion of it

they've got more in common with Greek city states of old and even then loosely

not to mention the Nazi like idealogy of the Uchiha and Hyuugs clans..the violently oppressive nature of the villages

simply put..that's a Dystopian and evil society

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War is war. People are out there to win. The Akatsuki are like mercenaries.
they have more in common with AL queda than they do mercs
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Old 09-06-2012, 09:07 PM   #7
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

Lol iwd has point and damn when you think about it. Kishi's adaption of a feudal system is pretty jacked up even if its somewhat accurate to a degree
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Old 09-06-2012, 09:22 PM   #8
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

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Lol iwd has point and damn when you think about it. Kishi's adaption of a feudal system is pretty jacked up even if its somewhat accurate to a degree
it's jacked up to the point that it shouldn't function

Kishi fused Greek city states with Nazi Germany and The pre-Khan Mongol nations... and then he threw Feudal Japan and Japanese mythology in there for good measure

the worse part is how a lot of the fandom seem to be eerily okay with the constant cruelty and bigotry and everything else
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Old 09-06-2012, 09:23 PM   #9
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

I've been trying to say this in many posts for a long time: we are reading a story concerning wizard demigod assassin spies. What part of that is libel to create a good system? I believe the Akatsuki are attempting to replace feudal despotism with autocratic slavery. What they offer is worse, because escape is impossible. Escaping a feudal system is always possible, as long as you have the power to go your own way (which ninja wizards can manage, actually -- look at Oro). Hell, Jaraiya just walked away and wrote books for the most part...
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Old 09-06-2012, 09:39 PM   #10
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

Hey kishi did say in an interview that he's mainly writing naruto for junior high boys and if the world was run by a bunch of pubescent boys would definitely become this messed up.

I mean imagine if for example purposes megabutt or someone from his schools student body was declared the undisputed leader of a country

Or worse yet someone like eagles or colorles and scyther
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Old 09-07-2012, 04:46 AM   #11
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.


It can be scary.
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Old 09-07-2012, 06:03 AM   #12
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

Well at least the "living weapons" have free will to change the system.Naruto! lol
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Old 09-07-2012, 06:23 AM   #13
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

Do they tho?

Think about it. The hidden villages and hokages didn't start working together because of naruto. I mean sure he talked nagato out of skull raping what was left of konoha and bringing back people from the dead but naruto really didn't convince the kages to lay down their greivances with each other they did it because of a group of A & S class super terrorists were declaring world war 4. Literally

Oh and that's another thing the ninja world has had twice as many mass wars than our own modern world. That speaks volumes because if that's how many world wars they've had imagine how many minor wars may have been fought even before the sage of six paths time
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Old 09-07-2012, 07:22 AM   #14
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

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Do they tho?

Think about it. The hidden villages and hokages didn't start working together because of naruto. I mean sure he talked nagato out of skull raping what was left of konoha and bringing back people from the dead but naruto really didn't convince the kages to lay down their greivances with each other they did it because of a group of A & S class super terrorists were declaring world war 4. Literally

Oh and that's another thing the ninja world has had twice as many mass wars than our own modern world. That speaks volumes because if that's how many world wars they've had imagine how many minor wars may have been fought even before the sage of six paths time
We know Narutoverse emerged out of a time of mass chaos similar to post-Rome Europe, consumed by clan warfare and strife. Our own world would be like this even today without nuclear arms. Remember, wars are common in our world. It's just that if you are on this forum chances are you live in a relatively developed nation, one that hasn't seen majorly disruptive fighting in a while. Without nukes, we'd have been embroiled in more world wars since the last one, because the consequences are less horrific without them. Surely the Soviets would have attempted to roll over Europe if they hadn't feared total annihilation from above.
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Old 09-07-2012, 07:46 AM   #15
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

True we would be in a near constant era of strife if we didn't have nukes. Ww2 would have gone on much longer and the korean, vietnam would have been worse. And the "cold war" would have been anything but.

However while they aren't as powerful as modern nukes they are certainly fearsome especially considering they can be deployed at anytime and restored rather quickly. In the bijju dama its essentially the NU's equivelent to a nuke and if considering that the hidden villages are not as big as modern cities they would devastate the villages in one or two hits.

And yet the shinobi world has had more wars than we've had

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Old 09-07-2012, 08:23 AM   #16
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

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True we would be in a near constant era of strife if we didn't have nukes. Ww2 would have gone on much longer and the korean, vietnam would have been worse. And the "cold war" would have been anything but.

However while they aren't as powerful as modern nukes they are certainly fearsome especially considering they can be deployed at anytime and restored rather quickly. In the bijju dama its essentially the NU's equivelent to a nuke and if considering that the hidden villages are not as big as modern cities they would devastate the villages in one or two hits.

And yet the shinobi world has had more wars than we've had
The problem isn't really the scale of devastation, but the inability to recover from nuclear warfare. An actual nuclear war could easily wipe out both sides to the point where rodents would take over the earth in our absence. Nuclear winter, something that a bijuu bomb won't create, would kill crops on the other side of the planet. Radioactivity would render whole geographic regions uninhabitable, unlike the "reshaping" that Hashirama and Madara are capable of. For the most part, ninjutsu won't create a lasting hell on earth that cannot be countered immediately afterward, given a powerful enough ninja. Hell, Nagato could bring back the dead! The ability of Narutoverse to reset itself after major conflict is unbounded. We do not share this with them.
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Old 09-07-2012, 08:56 AM   #17
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

Yeah when dealing with legitimate nukes the fallout is more devastating than the actual blast and that's not as big an issue with BD's but the fact remains that the NU is much. More primitive and a lot smaller than ours.

Which means that what would seem less frightening to us would or should be fairly disturbing to them especially since the weapons that control and fire the. Bd's are sentient and have a will of their own and could turn on their own nations if they had a mind to
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Old 09-07-2012, 09:15 AM   #18
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

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Do they tho?

Think about it. The hidden villages and hokages didn't start working together because of naruto. I mean sure he talked nagato out of skull raping what was left of konoha and bringing back people from the dead but naruto really didn't convince the kages to lay down their greivances with each other they did it because of a group of A & S class super terrorists were declaring world war 4. Literally
and while we're on the subject the rhetoric of a dangerous and somehwta unstable super powered emotionally immature savant has essentially created a personality cult that has unified the four villages

What happens when Naruto dies? What does it say about the utterly deplorable conditions of his world that the moment someone promises something better (never mind that he doesn't have the first clue how to make things better..nor does he have any of the skill to actually change the system) entire legions of super humans throw themselves at him?

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Oh and that's another thing the ninja world has had twice as many mass wars than our own modern world. That speaks volumes because if that's how many world wars they've had imagine how many minor wars may have been fought even before the sage of six paths time
the worse part is..I bet they suffered relative to their population density far more civilian casualties

really ninjas are outnumbered something like 20 to 1 with only a handful being seriously dangerous to normals.. one wonders why there aren't massive anti shinobi movements..hell especially with the samurai

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Originally Posted by Jutsu Junkie View Post
We know Narutoverse emerged out of a time of mass chaos similar to post-Rome Europe, consumed by clan warfare and strife. Our own world would be like this even today without nuclear arms. Remember, wars are common in our world. It's just that if you are on this forum chances are you live in a relatively developed nation, one that hasn't seen majorly disruptive fighting in a while. Without nukes, we'd have been embroiled in more world wars since the last one, because the consequences are less horrific without them. Surely the Soviets would have attempted to roll over Europe if they hadn't feared total annihilation from above.
and what of it? I mean yeah the whole "you first and developing worlders sitting in your ivory towers" type of posts have their value..but really?

Yeah they emerged from a past where for nearly a thousand years there was brutal and habitual fighting simply because one of Jesus's sons got butthurt.(seriously that was so god damn petty I face palmed and the sad part is..it does kinda have basis in reality siblings with power really can be that petulant)..the bigotry and prejudice and all that followed down was just..Well honestly one does wonder why the first hokage didn't truly try harder to create a better world..why when other villages started cropping up he didn't make sure (as the first..real organized nation any way) tha these villages weren't just isolationist parodies of the world he tried to escape?

I mean there really is no justifying either side..Madara wanting the infinite Tsukyomi because he's a raging egomaniac and a Diva with a god complex...and Tobi because he's upset his best friend stole his love interest and then she died in a mission?

It's the Talaban if it was formed by the kids from 90210 or some other vapid drama..

I don't think there is a defense of either side that can justify either

and oh..FYI the fatal flaw in your argument..is the nuclear deterrent point- they had that in the form of ninjas so powerful in one villages case he could take out a tailed beast..in another he can fly islands around in another he was called "the god of all kages" and his successor the "yellow flash" oh..and their immortal rage monsters which fire really crummy mini nukes

basically they had their own deterrents..it didn't stop them it only encouraged them

their just backwards and insane and written by someone not overly skilled enough to actually pull off complex politics and intrigue and nation building
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Old 09-07-2012, 10:42 AM   #19
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

[QUOTE=The Immortal Watch Dog;6237591]
one wonders why there arent massive anti shinobi movements..hel

Last edited by Cult of Personality; 09-07-2012 at 12:11 PM.
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Old 09-07-2012, 11:00 AM   #20
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Default Re: On the subject of Naruto's villains.

Cult is kinda right.

I mean imagine if naruto was the type to snap when people messed with him too much.

Sakura would be a blood and filled crater or a pink smear on the street

What's kinda. Worse is hinata is in love with said psycopath. Well I geuss you can't blame her for being so shy now.

Its all pretty effed up isn't it?
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