Zabuza and Haku vs. Base Bee

[PrinceofPeace]

^ Totally agree nice job dude ( this kid deserves rep)

Tactics The kiri-nin can win

1- zabuza uses water dragon towards B. B absorbs it and he leaves his back open for damage which is when Haku throws senbon at his neck

2- B senses zabuza and haku. he attacks (haku) and then zabuza throws his sword spinning in B's direction (B can not sense the sword cuz it does not have chakra)

My main points
- Samehada absorbing the mist is out of the question. How long would it take to abosrob and there is no proof that the sword can do this. That is like saying Samehada can abosrb any and all field chaning ninjutsu. Or that Kisame can absorb genjutsu

- I LOVE KISAME AND SAMEHADA .... (just sayien)

3- Haku will not be holding back and he is bloodlusted so he will be aiming at critical one hit kill spots

4- How does B destroy Ice dome

[JLI2infinity]

Originally Posted by Iso:Dream

Bee predicted he was behind him. Minato, in actuality, has no features proving he's the fastest in the verse. He blitzed Tobi, and managed to port out before A killed him.

Moreover, Itachi moved behind Bee in plain sight then announced his presence before striking.

Zabuza doesn't announce his presence against an opponent he has full knowledge on.

Tobi reacted to and avoided a speedblitz by A, Tobi is holding his own against Gai, RM Naruto, and Kakashi at the same time all high tier speedsters. Tobi lost in a battle of speed to Minato. A proclaimed that he was the fastest shinobi who ever lived and said Minato beat him fair and square. Minato without FTG body flickered to Tobi and took baby Naruto out of his hands then removed a blanket wrapped in explosive tags and teleported out before anyone got hurt. Shee said that A's reflexes and attack speed were on par with Minato's. Minato is the fastest shinobi in the Narutoverse this isn't even debatable.

Bee is able to predict where people will attack from and react with his extremely fast reflexes. Minato's teleportation is instant and Bee reacted to it, that is far more impressive than Zabuza's silent assasination. On top of that PTS Kakashi reacted to the assassination the first time, even if they were both using clones. Bee also reacted to A multiple times. Those are the two fastest shinobi out there, as soon as Zabuza tries to attack Bee counters. Also, when Itachi announced his presence Bee stated that he already knew Itachi was there.

That's laughable. Samehada full chomp only managed to eat a fraction of a fireball moving directly at Bee. To insinuate he's able to eat all of the mist is entirely illogical.

I wasn't saying Samehada clears the entire battlefield of mist, my point was that it can clear a wide enough area around Bee that he can see where everyone is attacking from like clearing a path through some grass with a machete. That was a response to Prince saying that the senbon would be hidden in the mist so Bee couldn't see them.

Highly doubtful against opponents he has no knowledge on. Bee rarely overrates anyone, he allowed Juugo and several others to strike him out of spite. He'd have to be pretty pussied out to cover his blindsides for no reason.

Irrelevant to the fact Zabuza strikes his blindside since he has knowledge on Bee's speed.

Irrelevant, Zabuza strikes his blindside.

Very slim chance he partially transforms before Zabuza makes his move at 17 meters.

Your whole argument is centered around Zabuza being able to sneak up on a character who's reacted to sneak attacks from opponent's of a much higher caliber. That's how you dismissed all my valid strategies. Until you can find a speed feat for me of Zabuza attacking anywhere near as fast as Minato or Itachi you have no right to say Bee gets blindsided at all.

I'm not even going to address this nonsense.

The only logical possibles I already stated in my OP. There truly is no point in debating further.

Let me also add the fact Bee remained in base form against several of Tobi's paths who were clearly defeating him. One of which blinded Naruto and nearly Bee. He refused to transform even when he was nearly killed several times. You're way over your head if you think Bee immediately goes cloak because there's mist around him.

Bee not only held his own against Tobi's paths but he was saving Naruto's ass. He reacted immediately to Utakata's exploding bubbles and pulled Naruto out of them, then he grabbed Naruto when he got sent flying from Han's punch, and then he held Naruto while running away from Yugito's technique and then parrying her strike. If you call that a clear defeat then ok.

And saying "I'm not even going to address this nonsense" isn't an adequate answer in a debate for the record. And if you read carefully you'd notice I'm not talking about him using a cloak I'm talking about actual Hachibi tentacles which we've seen him use multiple times.

I want you to remember that Zabuza was getting mindraped by a simple three tomoe sharingan. Base Bee was absolutely murdering Sasuke, Juugo, and Suigetsu a team far superior to this one. I don't even need to go by reaction feats here, Bee moved so fast that after getting paralyzed by a Chidori he'd disappeared to another mountain before any of Taka even noticed. That means he gave Sasuke who has two fully developed sharingan, the slip. In their most recent battle Kakashi handled Zabuza easily. He managed to get behind him and reacted to the silent assassination, Bee would be fine.

[PrinceofPeace]

Originally Posted by JLI2infinity

Tobi reacted to and avoided a speedblitz by A, Tobi is holding his own against Gai, RM Naruto, and Kakashi at the same time all high tier speedsters. Tobi lost in a battle of speed to Minato. A proclaimed that he was the fastest shinobi who ever lived and said Minato beat him fair and square. Minato without FTG body flickered to Tobi and took baby Naruto out of his hands then removed a blanket wrapped in explosive tags and teleported out before anyone got hurt. Shee said that A's reflexes and attack speed were on par with Minato's. Minato is the fastest shinobi in the Narutoverse this isn't even debatable.

Bee had to be in bijju cloak when he had to do some of those speeed feats

Bee is able to predict where people will attack from and react with his extremely fast reflexes. Minato's teleportation is instant and Bee reacted to it, that is far more impressive than Zabuza's silent assasination. On top of that PTS Kakashi reacted to the assassination the first time, even if they were both using clones. Bee also reacted to A multiple times. Those are the two fastest shinobi out there, as soon as Zabuza tries to attack Bee counters. Also, when Itachi announced his presence Bee stated that he already knew Itachi was there.

Zabua drastically improved the mist in the 2nd battle. Also Bee saw where the FTG kunai landed so it is not that impressive. B needed Bijju cloak to react to Ay



I wasn't saying Samehada clears the entire battlefield of mist, my point was that it can clear a wide enough area around Bee that he can see where everyone is attacking from like clearing a path through some grass with a machete. That was a response to Prince saying that the senbon would be hidden in the mist so Bee couldn't see them.

There is no proof of this. Also Haku can still attack from above. The mist is constant and can still be created/made/spread even if it was abosrobed



Your whole argument is centered around Zabuza being able to sneak up on a character who's reacted to sneak attacks from opponent's of a much higher caliber. That's how you dismissed all my valid strategies. Until you can find a speed feat for me of Zabuza attacking anywhere near as fast as Minato or Itachi you have no right to say Bee gets blindsided at all.


All Zabuza is good for is keeping up the mist and throwing his sword from a long ranged and Samehada will not be able to sense the sword.



Bee not only held his own against Tobi's paths but he was saving Naruto's ass. He reacted immediately to Utakata's exploding bubbles and pulled Naruto out of them, then he grabbed Naruto when he got sent flying from Han's punch, and then he held Naruto while running away from Yugito's technique and then parrying her strike. If you call that a clear defeat then ok.

This is not the same sceniro as what zabuza and haku can do

And saying "I'm not even going to address this nonsense" isn't an adequate answer in a debate for the record. And if you read carefully you'd notice I'm not talking about him using a cloak I'm talking about actual Hachibi tentacles which we've seen him use multiple times.


I want you to remember that Zabuza was getting mindraped by a simple three tomoe sharingan. Base Bee was absolutely murdering Sasuke, Juugo, and Suigetsu a team far superior to this one. I don't even need to go by reaction feats here, Bee moved so fast that after getting paralyzed by a Chidori he'd disappeared to another mountain before any of Taka even noticed. That means he gave Sasuke who has two fully developed sharingan, the slip. In their most recent battle Kakashi handled Zabuza easily. He managed to get behind him and reacted to the silent assassination, Bee would be fine.
Bee would have more confidence he has a bijju and Zabuza lost confidence after his failed mission.

- Mist would constantly be covering the field
- WIthin the mist the senbon would be hard to react to
- How would he notice a sword in the mist being thrown low at his legs from a distance
- Zabuza uses water style and B absorbs it leaving his back open and Haku attacks it

[BMC1994]

Originally Posted by Iso:Dream

Bee predicted he was behind him. Minato, in actuality, has no features proving he's the fastest in the verse. He blitzed Tobi, and managed to port out before A killed him.

Do you remember A saying him being the fastest shinobi after minato died. Teleporting =/= Speed. Minato being able to react to A while the same A Made sasuke mangekyou sharingan spin is a feat.

Moreover, Itachi moved behind Bee in plain sight then announced his presence before striking. Zabuza doesn't announce his presence against an opponent he has full knowledge on.

KIRIGAKURE NO JUTSU, sounds like an announcement.

That's laughable. Samehada full chomp only managed to eat a fraction of a fireball moving directly at Bee. To insinuate he's able to eat all of the mist is entirely illogical.

Highly doubtful against opponents he has no knowledge on. Bee rarely overrates anyone, he allowed Juugo and several others to strike him out of spite. He'd have to be pretty pussied out to cover his blindsides for no reason.

He wouldnt Hachibi would be. And he isnt cocvering for no reason he is covering because A DUDE WITH A GIANT BLADE STRAPPED TO HIS BACK CREATED THE MIST.

The ice dome isn't required, Zabuza will go for the kill.
Tentacles> Zabuza. Bees reaction feats>>>> Zabuza. If sneak attacks would work on his he wouldve been dead a long time ago considering he has battled top tier speed shinobi.

Irrelevant to the fact Zabuza strikes his blindside since he has knowledge on Bee's speed. Irrelevant, Zabuza strikes his blindside.
Very slim chance he partially transforms before Zabuza makes his move at 17 meters.

You mean the same zabuza that tried to strike Kakashis blind side multiple times and failed, hard? If Zabuza cant Kill Kakashi then he certainly cannot kill be who skirmished with his brother THE FASTEST SHINOBI ALIVE ( just emphasizing it because it doesnt seem to be getting through). What can Zabuza do what A couldnt? Nothing. Really Zabuza is not going to blindside him if he failed to do so with a pts kakashi.
If he doesnt transform he grabs his 7 baldes and makes sushi out of him or hit him with one of his vibrator pencils or make an Ink to strike him when he gets close.

I'm not even going to address this nonsense.
So him Using Ink clones is nonsense? <- nonsense.

Let me also add the fact Bee remained in base form against several of Tobi's paths who were clearly defeating him. One of which blinded Naruto and nearly Bee. He refused to transform even when he was nearly killed several times. You're way over your head if you think Bee immediately goes cloak because there's mist around him.

He went Cloak on taka sasuke while he was stomping him in base anyway. He even went beast form while he was Curbstomping in cloak form. Really Bee can do whatever he wants. Also Zabuza isnt even comparable to jinchuriki with both a rinnegan and a sharingan.

Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace

^ Totally agree nice job dude ( this kid deserves rep)

Tactics The kiri-nin can win
1- zabuza uses water dragon towards B. B absorbs it and he leaves his back open for damage which is when Haku throws senbon at his neck

Or Bee uses his tentacles And Curbstomped both casually. Bee Has More then one arm in fact in total he has 10 (2 plus 8 tails)

2- B senses zabuza and haku. he attacks (haku) and then zabuza throws his sword spinning in B's direction (B can not sense the sword cuz it does not have chakra)

And Bee slices the sword in two like he did when suigetsu had it.

My main points
- Samehada absorbing the mist is out of the question. How long would it take to abosrob and there is no proof that the sword can do this. That is like saying Samehada can abosrb any and all field chaning ninjutsu. Or that Kisame can absorb genjutsu.

No Samehada already Swallowed ELECTRICITY from a PENCIL mist isnt far fetched and considering samahada ate like 6 of Bees tails in an instant That mist will be gone in an second (not that the mist matters).

3- Haku will not be holding back and he is bloodlusted so he will be aiming at critical one hit kill spots
And Bee will be Guarding those vitals spots with his tentacles or his 7 swords sice he would hate to die.

4- How does B destroy Ice dome

Hachibi fist/Tails. Electrical 7 swords. Lariat. He sneezes.

Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace

- Mist would constantly be covering the field
- WIthin the mist the senbon would be hard to react to.
And How would haku even see in this mist? Apart from bee getting his tails accupunctured those senbon will do nothing. Base Naruto And Sasuke Tanked those senbon like nothing and you are trying to tell me bee is going to die from 1 hit?
- How would he notice a sword in the mist being thrown low at his legs from a distance.
A giant Blade Being Thrown(thats not really silent killing) Makes alot of sound and gives away zabuzas location.
- Zabuza uses water style and B absorbs it leaving his back open and Haku attacks it
How about DODGING that water style you know what everyone with a brain would do.
Haku Attacks Ink Clones and gets Stomped by a hachibi fist or Sliced by 7 swords or Electric Pencilled.(to teh face).

Really a pts team 7 kicked the crap out of them. While Bee stomped Taka which is a superior version of Team 7 in EVERY way.

[PrinceofPeace]

- Sugeietsu 's sword already had a crack in it so it was easy to break. B did not do that all by himself

-B is not the fastest ninja ever in base

-Samehada would not let B give up the opportunity to abosorb water ninjutsu.

-B does not know the vital spots.. how many tails has B shown in base

- With haku blood lusted he would use ice mirriors around B then throw them in every direction

-Kakashi was the only one able to react to the thrown sword and that was only because he was suspiscous in the first place.


- B on the other hand is cocky and would be too busy rapping for him to notice

- B would most likely jump to dodge th sword and then he would get blasted with senbon.

- How can the tentcles react to senbon and a giant sword

- (if this was all feats Haku could just use ice spears.... just sayien)

[BMC1994]

Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace

- Sugeietsu 's sword already had a crack in it so it was easy to break. B did not do that all by himself

He did he blocked suigetsus attack and proceeded to buzzsaw through his sword with his own charged with lightning chakra.

-B is not the fastest ninja ever in base
He isnt in any form but in terms of speed he is still leagues ahead of zabuza and haku even in base which casually stomped taka. While zabuza and haku got defeated by a genin team. Face the facts bee is superior in everyway.

-Samehada would not let B give up the opportunity to abosorb water ninjutsu.
Because Kisame just stands there and tanks every jutsu that comes at him ofcourse not. He dodges or Counters with his own attack regardless of samehadas will.

-B does not know the vital spots.. how many tails has B shown in base.
He is an elite ninja, member of the kage family ,a jinchuriki , And the Raikages Tag team mate. On top of having participated in a war.

Why would he not know the vital spots. Bee is laid back not dumb otherwise he would have been dead a long time ago.

- With haku blood lusted he would use ice mirriors around B then throw them in every direction.

You mean like he did with naruto and sasuke in base which didnt kill them and not even caused a few scars?

-Kakashi was the only one able to react to the thrown sword and that was only because he was suspiscous in the first place.

Dude with a big *** blade strapped to his back casting a big mist IS suspicious. Bee manages to keep just fine with kcm naruto in battle again in terms of reaction (and everything else) Base bee>>> Pts kakashi. If you fail to kill a cat you will fail harder to kill a lion.

- B on the other hand is cocky and would be too busy rapping for him to notice.

Yet he casually wrote rhymes in each of his battles with far more dangerous persons then zabuza could ever dream of to become.

- B would most likely jump to dodge th sword and then he would get blasted with senbon.

Bee doesnt really jump around that much if u watch his battles. If u want to get in this lame in character stuff would it be in character for a swordsman to throw his blade? Imagine a gunman throwing a gun see how stupid that looks/sounds? Imagine Kisame Throwing Samehada see how stupid that looks?Now imagine zabuza throwing his sword. Again Pts sasuke and naruto Tanked idk how many of those senbon and stayed alive even if they would hit bee those senbon would be reduced to....wait for it..... accupuncture.

- How can the tentcles react to senbon and a giant sword
There are 8 eight of them and bee has another conciousness within him that can see whats going on *cough hachibi.

- (if this was all feats Haku could just use ice spears.... just sayien)
(If this was all feats theyd get TBB'ed to teh face)

They wont win especially with bee super strenght and extra arms(tails) coming from hachibi.

Zabuza would get Manhandled by Bees 7 sword style
Haku would get manhandled by a electric pencil.

Zabuza still has to cross 17 meters which gives bee enough time to make said ink clones and simply greet him with his ink clones electric pencilling him.

[JLI2infinity]

Originally Posted by PrinceofPeace

- Sugeietsu 's sword already had a crack in it so it was easy to break. B did not do that all by himself

-B is not the fastest ninja ever in base

-Samehada would not let B give up the opportunity to abosorb water ninjutsu.

-B does not know the vital spots.. how many tails has B shown in base

- With haku blood lusted he would use ice mirriors around B then throw them in every direction

-Kakashi was the only one able to react to the thrown sword and that was only because he was suspiscous in the first place.


- B on the other hand is cocky and would be too busy rapping for him to notice

- B would most likely jump to dodge th sword and then he would get blasted with senbon.

- How can the tentcles react to senbon and a giant sword

- (if this was all feats Haku could just use ice spears.... just sayien)

@BMC1994 THANK YOU. I mean you've mostly been reiterating points I've consistently been making but at least you understand the strength gap here.

@PrinceofPeace
Bee has shown all of his tentacles in Base (he did that to show Naruto how to stack the blocks on top of each other as part of Naruto's chakra arms training).

Bee doesn't need to jump and block anything, this isn't Kakashi here, Bee is already naturally strong he could just plug Samehada into the ground to block it. All eight of those tentacles with Bee's ridiculous reaction time make blocking senbon easy.

When in this entire war have you seen Bee joking around. He raps naturally but he only goofed off against Taka because he knew they were a bunch of kids who were clearly in over their heads, not like Zabuza who is a known assassin and member of the Seven Legendary Swordsmen.

You're forgetting that Samehada can use any of the chakra it absorbs to heal Bee so Zabuza shooting water techniques at him is stupid. Also, you saying that Samehada can't absorb mist because we haven't seen it doesn't make any sense. We hadn't seen Samehada absorb Itachi's fireball but common sense said that it could even before that happened in the manga. Samehada absorbs ambient chakra or chakra infused into ninja techniques. The mist is not natural, the only reason it is there is because someone is using their CHAKRA to create an elemental ninjutsu.

Therefore, Samehada which eats through elemental ninjutsu and devours chakra should be able to absorb the mist. I'm not saying it clears the entire battlefield just that it clears the area around Bee. If anything Bee can just clear a path through the mist into an open area. He's physically faster than both Zabuza and Haku. In case you forgot just seconds after being paralyzed by Chidori he recovered and disappeared completely before Juugo was able to land a bunch. Sasuke had no idea where Bee went and he was already on another mountain. Taka Sasuke's speed feats trump Zabuza's and Sasuke has sharingan to read and track movements.

BTW None of the speed feats I mentioned for Bee were done in his cloaked form I specifically mentioned things in base to avoid that objection.

[Uchiha Sora]

Normally I'd say Bee stomps, but how does he counter mist?

I'd say he reacted to Minato because he heard him. But Zabuza's a master of silent killing.

[JLI2infinity]

Originally Posted by Uchiha Sora

Normally I'd say Bee stomps, but how does he counter mist?

I'd say he reacted to Minato because he heard him. But Zabuza's a master of silent killing.

Have you been reading the last 20 posts where we've been arguing this?

[Uchiha Sora]

Uhm. Yeah.

That still doesn't explain how Bee blocks a great sword while virtually blinded.

His octo-tails were ripped apart by Minato's little kunai.

Even if he does block, there's still Haku.

[BMC1994]

Originally Posted by Uchiha Sora

Uhm. Yeah.

That still doesn't explain how Bee blocks a great sword while virtually blinded.

His octo-tails were ripped apart by Minato's little kunai.

Even if he does block, there's still Haku.

Bee doesnt have to dodge he substitutes with an ink clone and slices Zabuza as soon as he sees him.

Haku can get electric pencilled or get hit by that giant hachibi fist as soon as bee knows where he is. Or (if its allowed which is kinda vague in this thread) go cloak which easily stomps haku.

[Uchiha Sora]

As soon as he sees him? He CANT see him in the mist.

How does Bee fight two opponents while blinded when they can attack him without problems?
He can't hear them, he can't sense them. How does Bee react to something that he doesn't know is there?

[BMC1994]

Originally Posted by Uchiha Sora

As soon as he sees him? He CANT see him in the mist.

How does Bee fight two opponents while blinded when they can attack him without problems?
He can't hear them, he can't sense them. How does Bee react to something that he doesn't know is there?

The same way kakashi did. Btw can haku even see in the mist considering he is not one of the 7 swordsman(or a kirigakure ninja).

Kiillerbee atleast know zabuza/haku are there right he just gets insta-misted or did i read the OP wrong ?

Also there is a slight problem with the hidden mist in part 2 during the war kakashi was able to evenly battle with zabuza even with the hidden mist
( Naruto 522 Page 8 : Casting hidden mist, Page 15: Clashing with zabuza)

I doubt killerbee wouldnt be able to do that so zabuza probably isnt completely invisible in the mist. (523 page 15 kakashi clearly sees zabuza in the mist and prepares to strike with chidori)

If we go by its most recent use bee can easily counter and win.

[PrinceofPeace]

Haku is from the same village fo the mist and has been with Zabuza through it all and haku was able to throw needles at zabuza so yeah Haku can see in the mist

Just because Kakashi has experience with the mist and zabuza does not mean B who is not very bright see it to.

[Uchiha Sora]

Originally Posted by BMC1994

The same way kakashi did. Btw can haku even see in the mist considering he is not one of the 7 swordsman(or a kirigakure ninja).

Kiillerbee atleast know zabuza/haku are there right he just gets insta-misted or did i read the OP wrong ?

Also there is a slight problem with the hidden mist in part 2 during the war kakashi was able to evenly battle with zabuza even with the hidden mist
( Naruto 522 Page 8 : Casting hidden mist, Page 15: Clashing with zabuza)

I doubt killerbee wouldnt be able to do that so zabuza probably isnt completely invisible in the mist. (523 page 15 kakashi clearly sees zabuza in the mist and prepares to strike with chidori)

If we go by its most recent use bee can easily counter and win.

Yes, he can. Him and Zabuza were the first to kill people inside the mist after it was casted. Chapter 522.

He gets insta-misted I think.

Earlier in that chapter, Kakashi needed a Yamanaka to sense Zabuza for him. The Yamanaka took his body and used his sensory abilities to locate him, while a Nara backed him with a shadow possession. Guy even restated that because of their Silent Killing technique they cant even use their ears to locate them.

[Zack Fair]

The thing with B is that he can destroy the battlefield, actively sending out a strong gush of wind in which could disperse the mist. That aside, I want to give this to Zabuza and Haku, mainly for nostalgic reasons, but their combo isn't one in which to be underrated.

[BMC1994]

Originally Posted by Uchiha Sora

Yes, he can. Him and Zabuza were the first to kill people inside the mist after it was casted. Chapter 522.

He gets insta-misted I think.

Earlier in that chapter, Kakashi needed a Yamanaka to sense Zabuza for him. The Yamanaka took his body and used his sensory abilities to locate him, while a Nara backed him with a shadow possession. Guy even restated that because of their Silent Killing technique they cant even use their ears to locate them.

Chapter 523 page 15. The yamanaka cancels the mind body switch technique kakashi still sees zabuza and charges at him with a chidori.

Chapter 524 Page 7 Kakashi (not mind body switched) sees zabuza and charges at him with a chidori again.

Chapter 522 Page 14 Lee and guy (they have never experienced the mist) counter hakus attack.(which means they can see him)

[Uchiha Sora]

Thats because they were in eyesight range.

His shades dont make things much easier either

[BMC1994]

So bee would be able to see in eyesight range meaning he can counter attack.

Its as simple as making a ink clone and simply awaiting zabuza.

If pts base naruto and sasuke can tank senbon so can bee.

[Uchiha Sora]

If Haku REALLY wanted to kill them he could have. He put Zabuza into a partial death state.

Yes but that doesn't help when he's blindsided. They have full knowledge, they'd know he's stronger than them. They wouldn't attack from the front. Haku can even use crystal ice mirrors while he's in the mist. Random senbon spraying from everywhere, Bee wouldn't even know he's in the technique.