Spoiler Concrete Evidence That Tobi Is In Fact Uchiha Obito

[TobiUchiha111]

Originally Posted by calinarutoguy

You're telling me that in a matter of say like 5 to 10 years, Obito goes from a guy who can barely use his sharingan, to a guy who masters it, is so good he can fight Minato to a stand still (despite being younger than him), and randomly knows all about how to control the nine-tailed fox? There are so many reaches one would have to make to say Obito is Tobi it is not even funny.

For shock factor, what makes much more sense is if Tobi was Sasuke and Itachi's father. I always found it suspicious that an Uchiha who arguably born the two most powerful uchiha's in history (Sasuke and Itachi) could be so easily killed. He was the head of the Uchiha clan for heaven's sake and he's so easily killed by a teenage Itachi? Doesn't make sense.

The only thing that gives me pause really for Obito = Tobi is that Tobi, who is missing the same eye Obito lost, seems to have an advanced version of Kumai, the same jutsu Kakashi has (which he took from Obito). That's seems pretty coincidental. However, there are so many other problems with the comparison that I just have to believe it is a coincidence.

So, Tobi's gonna pull a Darth Vader? XD Personally, I'd love for him to be Fugaku, but for obvious reasons, he's not. I think that Obito makes a better plot twist. Especially since Kakashi's year keeps on getting delayed.

Originally Posted by K3nsh!n

I don't get what you mean by "50, not old enough to have wrinkles"

From the wikia:
----------Tobi|Fugaku
.Height 175cm|175.3cm
Weight 55.9kg|63.1Kg
From what I see there is not much difference...
Weight can be easily explained. Fugaku lost some-maybe he went on diet?

As for difference in height, it's barely 0.3cm- not even noticeable, so it doesn't even count...
Still if you wondering, it's easily accountable...
Fugaku had long hair, Tobi has short hair
Cutting his hair short explains that 0.3cm difference...
I mean, even if you flatten the hair while measuring height having long or short hair still affects the measurement...

As for why would Tobi show part of try to show his face to Sasuke if Sasuke could recognize him:


Read my Tobi is Fugaku theory
After reading it, tell me if you at least consider the Fugaku theory plausible?

EDIT: When did Fugaku/Tobi grew his hair long in one day?

You present some valid arguments. i'll be sure to read your theory. But, Fugaku had the hair he normally does just a day before the massacre, and during the massacre, tobi has Madara-like hair. This is also one of the reasons that I don't think it's Shisui.

Originally Posted by Sasori!

I think it's because their hair is the same way.

it only makes sense.

*facepalm* Tobi being Obito has nothing to do with their hair. In fact,that is the absolute weakest argument since their hair isn't as similar as people think (and yes, I know you were being sarcastic)

Originally Posted by nine-tails chakra armor

dont wanna be mean but this will def dethrone your idea. 1 fact tobi and masked man are the same minato said so. minato is obito's sensei wouldnt in the fight between them minato sense that it was obito.

hes my idea on who he is. we know of madara, and his brother. they had to have learned from someone. could it be that tobi is actually madaras father. think about it he should know all the things madara does and the fight between madara and the first. its never said if his father died or not. probally mumbo jumbo but its possiable. but even if its not how awsome would that be. or another idea of mine is that tobi is the uchiha son of the sage of six paths. cool huh

Well, I don't really think that Minato would have even thought about it being Obito. Plus, the guy was wearing a mask! Also, I agree that it would be cool for Tobi to be Fugaku or the Uchiha clan ancestor.

Originally Posted by Kyūbi no Yōko

No, no, Obito is Tobi because he had only one hole for an eye in the Orange Mask, same side Obito got crushed on, also, we remember that side had the Sharingan.

BEST THEORY EVAAAH.

MOST ANNOYING SARCASM EVAAAH!

Originally Posted by Jakropha

I think Tobi is Obito, because they share common letters in their name!!!

Hoe emjesus! Maybe Tobi is Obito, because I have an addiction to fruit pies!

Yeeeeep.... I love me them fruit pies!!!!!

Originally Posted by kalmeast

Yes, you sir, is welcome to Viz... we're unlike those other bull-headed forums with their egos beyond dead-people. at least if u dont find any reasonable ppl here there's 1 or 2. disregard the insults and write/ post whatever is on ur mind.


Those wrinkles i.e. if they are must be older than 50. Jiraiya was 54, had no signs of such heavy wrinkles...know what i mean...could fugaku have developed such strong wrinkles in a mere 10 years?
Perhaps NOT.


lol...when was such a fact proven...remind me? not that i support it but, it's not a stupid theory and never had been.
ppl who said Obito is dead, end of story are being a bit commonplace when it comes to Naruto manga...Gaara's death was more concrete that Obito's but yet, here is it. back to live fighting with the kage's. To discount possibility of obito being alive is short-sighted i think.


yea, this is the mindset most ppl should adopt...it's wise.

And of those who profess that obito is too weak and couldn't even wield his sharingan? that's no argument at all. When sasuke first awakened his sharingan, he had 1 tomoe in each eye. I'm certain this is the case for most. Obito's first awakening was two tomoe in each eye which could imply he has a greater potential... Having Madara as sensei could make someone like obito really strong in a short period of time. The only discounting facter is the 1 - 2 years gap b/n his death and fighting Minato + controlling Kuubi. That's just too much advancement.

Thank God, finally a sound minded poster. You've thoroughly explained your reasoning and all the points and in a very rational manner.
Also, Madara could have told him all about the past and such things. Also, Tobi only used his eye techniques, I really don't think that it would be hard for Obito to do all that. And, don't forget, tobi still lost to Minato so it's not like he owned Minato's @$$ or anything.

[Naruske Uzuchi]

ok, if Obito is Tobi explain this to me.
How did he know about Konoha and its history? How did he find out about the Rikudou Sennin?(Because people just said that was a myth) How did he know where Kushina was going to give birth? How did he get in Konoha so easily? Why do he have mangekyou Sharingan, I think he have EMS also.

Answer me these questions... hmmn

[Crossover]

If he's Obito, how is he Madara?
So he has 3 IDs? Tobi, Madara, Obito... that's a little too extensive.

We've seen him without his mask ffs.

[Might_GAI]

Originally Posted by Crossover

If he's Obito, how is he Madara?
So he has 3 IDs? Tobi, Madara, Obito... that's a little too extensive.

We've seen him without his mask ffs.

I LOL'd.

Anyway. Hey there, I like your theory. You've made some new(and pretty damn good) points about the Tobi = Obito theory, but there is one thing that stands in the way: How the hell can Obito possibly plan something with Madara during the 1st Hokage's time? When Madara fought Naruto and right after he dropped the huge meteorite on the Shinobi Alliance army, he said something like "Let's hope the fake Madara sticks to our plan" to Kabuto. This means that Tobi planned something with Madara when the 1st was alive. It was revealed that Madara died shortly after the 1st died but after their battle and after he got his Rinnengan. So that means that Tobi planned something with Madara when he was alive. Therefore Tobi was alive when 1st was alive. Obito is the same age as Kakashi.... Their age don't add up.

[Kurama-]

Originally Posted by Naruske Uzuchi

ok, if Obito is Tobi explain this to me.
How did he know about Konoha and its history? How did he find out about the Rikudou Sennin?(Because people just said that was a myth) How did he know where Kushina was going to give birth? How did he get in Konoha so easily? Why do he have mangekyou Sharingan, I think he have EMS also.

Answer me these questions... hmmn

• He was a Chunin
• He was born and grew up Konoha
• He knows people in Konoha
• Research / Books
• He is an Uchiha
• Minato was his old Sensei
• How does anyone know about Rikudou Sennin?
• Obito and Kakashi have the same Sharingan and Kakashi's left Mongekyo Sharingan is similar to Tobi's right Sharingan (possibly how he teleports without hand signs).

Pretty sure theres a simple answer for your questions somewhere in that... but tbh I doubt Tobi is Obito.

[K3nsh!n]

Originally Posted by kalmeast

Those wrinkles i.e. if they are must be older than 50. Jiraiya was 54, had no signs of such heavy wrinkles...know what i mean...could fugaku have developed such strong wrinkles in a mere 10 years?
Perhaps NOT.

Just because Jiraya didn't have wrinkles at a age 54 doesn't mean Fugaku cannot!!
You cannot make a presumption for the entire race based on an individual's observation.

Also, you are forgetting that Jiraya was a Sage
We all know that nature chakra has recuperative/healing powers.
It's likely that Jiraya's training with nature chakra could have reduced his aging!

Originally Posted by TobiUchiha111

You present some valid arguments. i'll be sure to read your theory. But, Fugaku had the hair he normally does just a day before the massacre, and during the massacre, tobi has Madara-like hair. This is also one of the reasons that I don't think it's Shisui.

Actually it's no big deal...
Since as per my theory

Spoiler:

Fugaku replaced himself with a Zetsu clone as the Clan Leader, while he infiltrated the Uchiha clan as Tobi in order to find out the traitors/fuel the revolt. Now I am not sure for how long the Uchiha's were planning the coup d'etat but Fugaku could have been masquerading as Tobi for months or maybe even years...

[kalmeast]

Originally Posted by K3nsh!n

Just because Jiraya didn't have wrinkles at a age 54 doesn't mean Fugaku cannot!!
You cannot make a presumption for the entire race based on an individual's observation.
lol...u accuse me of presumption here?

Also, you are forgetting that Jiraya was a Sage
We all know that nature chakra has recuperative/healing powers.
It's likely that Jiraya's training with nature chakra could have reduced his aging!
when what u've done here is even more presumptious in its entirety? since u have no evidence to back it up....

remove the log in ur eyes b4 try'na remove the spec in mine lol

[K3nsh!n]

^ lol!!
All I meant is Jiraya's constitution is much better than Fugaku...

And although this is in no way a proof:
The Other Sannins look much younger than they really are...
Orochimaru-soul transfer, uses different bodies
Tsunade-constant body transformation

Since Kishi love parallelisms, you could say the same about Jiraya...
Jiraya-Sage training

[kalmeast]

^yea...gotcha...that is to say, they all have their own ways of looking younger!

[uchiha|itachi]

well if u think of it kakashi's sharingan sucks objects like tobi sucks objects and himself...it's like a black hole jutsu lol but either way i don't think that obito is tobi cuz of the age thing...tobi was fully grown up when he faced minato...but the thing i strongly agree with u about is how did kakashi activated his mangekyo sharingan? didn't itachi say that in order to activate your mangekyo then you should kill your closest friends ? well rin was one of kakashi's best friends...that's just awkward

[TobiUchiha111]

Originally Posted by K3nsh!n

Just because Jiraya didn't have wrinkles at a age 54 doesn't mean Fugaku cannot!!
You cannot make a presumption for the entire race based on an individual's observation.

Also, you are forgetting that Jiraya was a Sage
We all know that nature chakra has recuperative/healing powers.
It's likely that Jiraya's training with nature chakra could have reduced his aging!


Actually it's no big deal...
Since as per my theory

Spoiler:

Fugaku replaced himself with a Zetsu clone as the Clan Leader, while he infiltrated the Uchiha clan as Tobi in order to find out the traitors/fuel the revolt. Now I am not sure for how long the Uchiha's were planning the coup d'etat but Fugaku could have been masquerading as Tobi for months or maybe even years...

Originally Posted by K3nsh!n

^ lol!!
All I meant is Jiraya's constitution is much better than Fugaku...

And although this is in no way a proof:
The Other Sannins look much younger than they really are...
Orochimaru-soul transfer, uses different bodies
Tsunade-constant body transformation

Since Kishi love parallelisms, you could say the same about Jiraya...
Jiraya-Sage training

Good points. plus, after the fight with pain, we see Tsunade without the jutsu and, from what we can see of her, she's very old. So, just maybe....

Originally Posted by uchiha|itachi

well if u think of it kakashi's sharingan sucks objects like tobi sucks objects and himself...it's like a black hole jutsu lol but either way i don't think that obito is tobi cuz of the age thing...tobi was fully grown up when he faced minato...but the thing i strongly agree with u about is how did kakashi activated his mangekyo sharingan? didn't itachi say that in order to activate your mangekyo then you should kill your closest friends ? well rin was one of kakashi's best friends...that's just awkward

Don't forget that Kishi likes to show how different people grow at different rates. Kakashi and guy were really friggin tall during Kurama's attack. And, Itachi was like 13 when he killed the Uchiha clan and he looked like a full grown man.

Originally Posted by Might_GAI

I LOL'd.

Anyway. Hey there, I like your theory. You've made some new(and pretty damn good) points about the Tobi = Obito theory, but there is one thing that stands in the way: How the hell can Obito possibly plan something with Madara during the 1st Hokage's time? When Madara fought Naruto and right after he dropped the huge meteorite on the Shinobi Alliance army, he said something like "Let's hope the fake Madara sticks to our plan" to Kabuto. This means that Tobi planned something with Madara when the 1st was alive. It was revealed that Madara died shortly after the 1st died but after their battle and after he got his Rinnengan. So that means that Tobi planned something with Madara when he was alive. Therefore Tobi was alive when 1st was alive. Obito is the same age as Kakashi.... Their age don't add up.

This is definitely a really good argument against the theory. But, it might not have been Tobi that Kabuto was talking about. Since white Zetsu was made from Hashirama's DNA, then it would make sense if Black Zetsu was made from Madara's. Black Zetsu could have found Obito and told him all about the past and the moon's eye plan. I really think that this is something Kishi would do. Kishi just probably wants us to think it's not obito so it will be even more shocking if he is. But, that might be getting too much into it.

[zerosameri]

Believe it or not read the whole things and pondered about it. It's good and thought out, though the only thing wrong with these are the fact that everything can be proven wrong. I really do not feel like responding to everything you wrote buuuut

Something else that's suspicious is that Kishi has never explained how Rin died or how Kakashi got his mangekyo, when he could have easily have had Kakashi explain how he got mangekyo when he first got it and tell how Rin died in the databook. We are missing a major flashback! And we will most likely get it eventually, but it has to occur at a time that makes sense and has something to do with what's happening around it. Tobi being Obito, would make the most sense to be what triggers this flashback.

The data book is BS, everything in there (most of the time) is wrong and crap. It all ways says thing that it does not say in the manga. Like for example the manga does not really say exactly how Izuna dies, but in the date book it says once his eyes were removed he fought a few more years (blind) along side Madara and died in battle. :\ Any, you get the point.

[kalmeast]

^ lol..what happened....? the best response i've ever read from thee i like it!

[zerosameri]

Originally Posted by kalmeast

^ lol..what happened....? the best response i've ever read from thee i like it!

I didn't write that, my brother did. It doesn't even sound like me

--

Any ways dude, no matter how you put it Tobi is NOT obito. No matter how you put it or even look at it, it is no plausible.

[aimop95]

personal input. So far, only two people have been seen using space time jutsu, that's Tobi and Kakashi. Now Kakashi has a visual time and space jutsu similar to Tobi's though with the difference that Kakashi can only teleport parts of people away.
Now to draw a connection, Kakashi uses Obito's mangeko sharingan to use his space time jutsu, and to my knowledge, I've never seen Tobi's eye when he teleports himself. This could lead to the possible conclusion that Tobi is Obito because Tobi's space time jutsu is similar to the one Kakashi uses (Obito's eye). I haven't worked out all the kinks in my theory, but basically, Tobi is Obito because he and Kakashi share a similar jutsu that originates from Obito's eye (the teleportation jutsu).

once again, to my knowledge, no other user has had a space time jutsu that originates from the sharingan.

I personally don't care if i'm proven wrong but I just noticed this.

As for the relationship with Madera and being old and all that.

Old argument: Half the people who look like girls turn out to be boys (voice actors don't help). This leads me to the conclusion that appearances are basically one of the more less reliable resources to turn to.

Madera/master plan/etc argument: Tobi had his own plan ("there are many doors open to me" end quote) chapter 503. Madera was well dead by then.

[TobiUchiha111]

Originally Posted by zerosameri

Believe it or not read the whole things and pondered about it. It's good and thought out, though the only thing wrong with these are the fact that everything can be proven wrong. I really do not feel like responding to everything you wrote buuuut

The data book is BS, everything in there (most of the time) is wrong and crap. It all ways says thing that it does not say in the manga. Like for example the manga does not really say exactly how Izuna dies, but in the date book it says once his eyes were removed he fought a few more years (blind) along side Madara and died in battle. :\ Any, you get the point.

Thanks, lol.


I wouldn't say everything can be proven wrong. besides, when you think about it from a storytelling angle, the only really logical Tobi candidate to surprise the audiences and be a great final villain, is Obito. I don't see why people are denying a whole theory just because of a small inconsistency that Kishi could easily explain. Seriously, why else does Kakashi's year keep on getting delayed as Tobi's revealing moment does. It's not like Tobi could just be any one of those other candidates. Why? Sasuke's dad as final villain???? Lmao. (plus, he doesn't look a thing like Tobi) A random one page totally irrelevant character (Kagami) as final villain????? It's ridiculous. (He looks nothing like Tobi either. Izuna? Possible but too cliche. plus, his name wasn't even mentioned in the manga. Which means Kishi probably doesn't have any big plans for him. Also, his eyeshape and eye lids are different from Tobi's. Elder Son of Rikudo? Oh, this is just weird. How the heck is he even still alive???? People seem to forget that Naruto is fiction, in which anything can happen. it's not like it's real life or anything. People need to chill out, and really think logically about who Tobi really could be.

Originally Posted by zerosameri

I didn't write that, my brother did. It doesn't even sound like me

--

Any ways dude, no matter how you put it Tobi is NOT obito. No matter how you put it or even look at it, it is no plausible.

Well, to each their own. Anyway, we'll never know for sure until the mask comes off.

[ILIKEPIE]

The best suprise character to be Tobi weird cause most people believe him to Obito despite the all the people that think there is no way it could Obito. This post is based on the average beliefs of others.

[K3nsh!n]

It bemuses me to no end how people in favour of Tobi=Obito theories will often say something like "It's fiction! Anything can happen!" in support of their theories!!
True it's fiction and you can expect anything not possible in real-life to happen...
But fiction also follows logic. By logic I don't mean real-life logic but the one that is being used in the fiction...

What's logical is that Obito couldn't possibly have become strong enough to take on someone like Minato in a matter of 1-3 years. Even if you pass off his apparent growth in physique as being caused by drugs- it fails to explain his growth in terms of skill and knowledge which is inconsistent with the logic that Kishi has set up so far in his manga.
Even Sasuke who was considered to be a better genius by Oro could only became so-so strong after training with him for 3 years. Forget Itachi, Sasuke wasn't even a match against Oro, so he waited for the moment when Oro was the weakest. Even after he got his MS he still got pawned by Bee and wouldn't have survived without Jugo's help.
So by what logic are you saying that Obito, who was dull-witted to begin with, become so skilled and strong enough to extract the Kyuubi, control it and take on one of the strongest Kage in history with ease?

Even with all this argument, I still don't deny the possibility that Tobi could be Obito.
And if he is indeed Obito, Kishi better come up with a damn good explanation for all the inconsistencies involved

Also just so you know, the reason I didn't vote on the poll, is well, because it is an inappropriate question.
Since you are not referring to any particular Tobi=Obito theory, a more appropriate question would have been "After reading this, do you at least consider the possibility of Tobi being Obito plausible?"

[kalmeast]

^yea, that's the argument...the only major thing standing in the way of the theory. I actually just realize the time gap between obito's death and Naruto's birth is exactly 1 year.

[K3nsh!n]

^lol...
And I was being conservative in my estimate!!
But either way it's too less of time for someone like Obito to achieve such high level.
Maybe if he had more time...
Wait!! I think I just figured out the ONLY way Kishi could possibly explain the time gap!!

Spoiler:

Anyone who has watched DBZ would know of the Hyberbolic Time Chamber!
1 year inside the chamber is equivalent to 1 day outside!

What if Tobi's pocket dimension is the same?
Since it is an alternate dimension created by Tobi himself he should, speaking theoretically, be able to manipulate the flow of time inside it!!
So he could make the time flow faster inside the pocket dimension!!

Maybe Obito spent years training inside his pocket dimension while only a few months passed in the real world!
The time he spent inside that dimension could easily exceed 10 years since the Tobi we saw fighting Minato was an adult.
10 years is enough time for someone with Sharingan to achieve extraordinary skill, especially if trained under some competent Uchiha like Madara!!
This could be why he appears older than Kakashi!

From what we know Kishi is a big fan of DBZ, so it's actually quite possible!!

*gasp*