Kisame VS Kakuzu.

[Kuromaki]

Originally Posted by megabbaut

And give Kisame an opening for a fire attack that Samehada can't absorb.

Well there really wasn't any need since it gets larger anyways.

He did, actually. And it took a collaboration ninjutsu from Naruto and Yamato to stop it. It was was shown to be pretty huge, along with Kakuzu's other attacks.

It wasn't really escaped easily. They were mostly knocked back out of the smoke, and if Samehada absorbs a fire technique it won't be able to absorb anything else afterwards.

Omg I'm not even talking about Samehada

He only combined fire and air. He has never combined anything else, and regardless of what he combines, it gets absorbed rather easily.

This is about Giant Shark Missile, not Samehada. And yes Ino managed to jump over the wave of fire.

[paradigm1977]

It seems that everyone in the Vs. Kisame threads believe that the great shark bullet can't be dodged. We saw it only once right? And it was defeated by morning Tiger.

And I don't believe morning tiger can be Guy's passion and sweat and not ninjutsu, so it passes right through great shark bullet and wallops Kisame. It took the form of a tiger.

I would put Kakuzu's threads into Morning Tiger territory since it is not a ninjutsu move. Kakuzu performed a hand seal that is all. Also, if we take kakuzu at his word, no physical damage can hurt him. And if you want to talk speed, Kakuzu slumped to the ground to play dead and kakashi charged hidan. So kakuzu got off the ground, got in front of kakashi, and kicked him back into the opposite direction, and into a huge tree, causing other trees to topple over.

Hand to hand, I have to put Kakuzu's strength on par with Tsunade and A, and just above Kisame (punching Guy down....maybe 50 feet of water. Kakuzu punched down a metal gate to a temple. I only put Naruto's strength above him. Kakuzu should be faster than Kisame, and with better martial Arts and at least as good Analytical ability. Most likely better.

We also should not assume that great shark bullet will absorb all the chakra when it passes through, anyway. Since it has never succeeded as an attack.

Final argument water beats fire, fire beats wind, wind beats electricity, electricity beats earth and........EARTH BEATS WATER. Kisame only has Water, chakra absorption and physical ability (which is less than kakuzus).

[vonshadow]

Originally Posted by paradigm1977

It seems that everyone in the Vs. Kisame threads believe that the great shark bullet can't be dodged. We saw it only once right? And it was defeated by morning Tiger.

And I don't believe morning tiger can be Guy's passion and sweat and not ninjutsu, so it passes right through great shark bullet and wallops Kisame. It took the form of a tiger.

I would put Kakuzu's threads into Morning Tiger territory since it is not a ninjutsu move. Kakuzu performed a hand seal that is all. Also, if we take kakuzu at his word, no physical damage can hurt him. And if you want to talk speed, Kakuzu slumped to the ground to play dead and kakashi charged hidan. So kakuzu got off the ground, got in front of kakashi, and kicked him back into the opposite direction, and into a huge tree, causing other trees to topple over.

Hand to hand, I have to put Kakuzu's strength on par with Tsunade and A, and just above Kisame (punching Guy down....maybe 50 feet of water. Kakuzu punched down a metal gate to a temple. I only put Naruto's strength above him. Kakuzu should be faster than Kisame, and with better martial Arts and at least as good Analytical ability. Most likely better.

We also should not assume that great shark bullet will absorb all the chakra when it passes through, anyway. Since it has never succeeded as an attack.

Final argument water beats fire, fire beats wind, wind beats electricity, electricity beats earth and........EARTH BEATS WATER. Kisame only has Water, chakra absorption and physical ability (which is less than kakuzus).

Note: Afternoon Tiger was defeated because it was not a chakra bullet like Kisame thought it was. If it was a chakra bullet, Giant Water Shark Missile would have gotten bigger and would have killed Gai. If used against any of Kakuzu's jutsus, it will just absorb the chakra out of the attack and make Kisame's attack even more deadly.

Being one of the 7 swordsmen of the mist, I am pretty much sure that Kisame's taijutsu skill is exceptionally good. As for Kakuzu's speed, Kakuzu is not really that fast as even Shikamaru managed to dodge him.

Earth does not defeat Water, in fact, water based attacks will be on par with earth based jutsus.

[paradigm1977]

Originally Posted by vonshadow

Note: Afternoon Tiger was defeated because it was not a chakra bullet like Kisame thought it was. If it was a chakra bullet, Giant Water Shark Missile would have gotten bigger and would have killed Gai. If used against any of Kakuzu's jutsus, it will just absorb the chakra out of the attack and make Kisame's attack even more deadly.

Yes we know that afternoon tiger isn't classified as ninjutsu and that's how it worked. Yeah, but kakuzu also uses water. Good chance he is familiar with the technique and avoids it.

Originally Posted by vonshadow

Being one of the 7 swordsmen of the mist, I am pretty much sure that Kisame's taijutsu skill is exceptionally good. As for Kakuzu's speed, Kakuzu is not really that fast as even Shikamaru managed to dodge him.

I guess being faster than kakashi and slower than shikamiru is just speed inconsistency. Kisami's ninjutsu is good, But Kakuzu's is rated higher, plus Kisami's punches and kicks were not impressive. Kakuzu knocked down iron gates, brushed off Choji's ball attack. Got punched out of the air by a monk, yet never seemed bothered by it. Kicked Kakashi into a massive tree that fell over, and so did other trees. Fought Hashirama before he got Earth Grudge Fear. He failed, but he was good enough to get the assignment, and good enough to live. Someone told me Hashiramam must have let him live, as if that makes sense. I guess like he let madara live.

Originally Posted by vonshadow

Earth does not defeat Water, in fact, water based attacks will be on par with earth based jutsus.

I'm going by Yamato drawing a picture of the elements and explaining to naruto what element has the obviouse advantage over which other element (the one directly proceeding them in a circle pattern). What are you going by?

[paradigm1977]

Originally Posted by megabbaut

Yeah but Kisame's water jutsu will fail against lightning. Water is weak against lightning.

No earth is weak against lightning. Kakuzu vs. Chidori.

fire>wind>lightning>earth>water>....back to fire.

[vonshadow]

Even if Kakuzu is familiar with Great Water Shark Bullet, the range and the size of the attack is huge; plus he might think that it is just a normal water shark bullet only bigger. And if Kakuzu tries to counter it with his ninjutsu, he might get the shock of his life that the shark becomes bigger and more powerful.

Kakuzu has not shown any Earth Release moves outside Iron Skin. Plus Iron Skin can be defeated if there is a significant concussive force

Hahaha I was the one that said Kakuzu probably got spared. And probably Hashirama killed Madara because he, Hashi knew that if he didnt, Konoha would not know peace.

Actually, I think Kisame's ninjutsu skill is overally better. People think Kakuzu's is better because of the combination. But Kisame can easily defeat Kakuzu's wind+ fire ninjutsu very easily with his water jutsu

[321zigzag3]

Originally Posted by paradigm1977

No earth is weak against lightning. Kakuzu vs. Chidori.

fire>wind>lightning>earth>water>....back to fire.

The whole elemental weakness comes into play in NArutoverse when both jutsus are around equal.

Plus Iron Skin is just a defense. It doesn't block chakra draining element of Giant Shark Missile if used that is.

Originally Posted by vonshadow

Actually, I think Kisame's ninjutsu skill is overally better. People think Kakuzu's is better because of the combination. But Kisame can easily defeat Kakuzu's wind+ fire ninjutsu very easily with his water jutsu

Barring Jiongu which are Kakuzu's threads which is S Rank Forbidden jutsu
you could be right.

Giant Shark Missile > Fire/wind combination.

Although Kakuzu jiongu is s rank ninjutsu.

[paradigm1977]

I want proof that Samehada can not just absorb chakra, but pull it out of someone. Have we seen that? Please list a chapter.

Samehada swept through a chakra cloak. So it's loose chakra absorbed. Same thing with the pencil.

I want an example of the sword hitting a person, with no chakra on the outside, where samehada pulls it out of the body regardless.

Also, the Great shark bullet may be similar in that it might absorb loose jutsu as a cloak, projectile or sword, but no evidence that if it hits kakuzu, that his chakra will be pulled out of his body.

I have to take back Kakuzu's taijutsu advantage because the databook has Kisame at 4.5 vs 4 for Kakuzu.

I'm still saying Iron skin is a taijutsu classification not ninjutsu.

[vonshadow]

Naruto chapter 146 page 16,17 and 18. Naruto built up Kyuubi chakra but there was no cloak around him. Kisame just swung his sword around Naruto and Samehada absorbed the chakra up

[Rasengan SageX5]

That's what I was going to say, vonshadow, even though I didn't know the exact chapter and page.

[paradigm1977]

Originally Posted by vonshadow

Naruto chapter 146 page 16,17 and 18. Naruto built up Kyuubi chakra but there was no cloak around him. Kisame just swung his sword around Naruto and Samehada absorbed the chakra up

Wow. The site I've gone to, mangabit.com has the chapters but that one was missing, another was in it's place.

I had never seen that chapter before, just the others in that face off. So now I saw it.

Revised. Kakuzu must dodge that Great shark bullet. Or he's done. Ok, I switched sides.

[Hokage∞]

kakuzu will win because he has 5 hearts.also whoever said kisame is a idiot

[Kakashi11]

Originally Posted by Hokage∞

kakuzu will win because he has 5 hearts.also whoever said kisame is a idiot

what so by your theory because he has five hearts he can defeat Madara

[MatKnapers]

Originally Posted by Hokage∞

kakuzu will win because he has 5 hearts.

So? Whether he has 5 hearts or not dosent matter. he was defeated by 1st Hokage and by Naruto/Kakashi when he had 5 hearts in possession.

[megabbaut]

Kakuzu still wins this anyway. The proof was already given a year ago...literally

[Kakashi11]

Originally Posted by megabbaut

Kakuzu still wins this anyway. The proof was already given a year ago...literally

what was it?
I was not here a year ago

[megabbaut]

Originally Posted by Kakashi11

what was it?
I was not here a year ago

On top of this very page, quoted by Kuromaki.

[Kuromaki]

It's cool how you never actually replied.

Since we all know Kisame wins and effortlessly absorbs everything Kakuzu throws at him, and this thread is too old to debate in anymore anyway, I'm locking.

[Shikamaru Nara]

Can we archive stuff?
What ever happened to that?