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Omniverse Anything goes in this forum. Any multiverse, any singleverse, any fight. Just know in advance that Kakashi can't beat Superman.

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Old 03-25-2012, 12:47 PM   #181
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

Right well, ignoring Ivankov's blatant superiority to Kuma for the foreseeable future, let's move on.

I don't remember, did Doflamingo ever use his powers on Oars (I still think Oz was a better name ) Jr beyond using them to lop off his leg? Such as in the manner he did on Jozu?

Because taking off a leg is not the same thing as having Doflamingo's abilities be able to reach his entire body.

I remember reading somewhere that Oda considers Usopp to be the weakest Straw Hat, and always intends to consider it so because he's the closest to being Human. It's in the 10th Anniversary One Piece: Treasures book evidently.

And anyway, Brook's rocking the blood freezing Soul Solid sword, so he definitely goes up.

Also you misspelled Usopp's name.

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Old 03-26-2012, 02:47 PM   #182
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

So question why is law below Moria? Wouldn't his recent feats of Casually facing down Smoker and his crew almost Gurantee him being moved up. Doubtful Boa can win either.
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Old 03-27-2012, 07:47 PM   #183
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

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Originally Posted by Cult of Personality View Post
Right well, ignoring Ivankov's blatant superiority to Kuma for the foreseeable future, let's move on.
Moving.

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I don't remember, did Doflamingo ever use his powers on Oars (I still think Oz was a better name ) Jr beyond using them to lop off his leg? Such as in the manner he did on Jozu?
He didn't restrain him, though cutting off an enormous giant's leg on a whim is impressive, no?

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Because taking off a leg is not the same thing as having Doflamingo's abilities be able to reach his entire body.
I know that it's pretty vague on when exactly Doflamingo cut off the leg, but either way, Doflamingo was flying above Oars Jr. one second, and the next, he was on the ground with the leg cut off quite the distance away from the rest of the body.

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I remember reading somewhere that Oda considers Usopp to be the weakest Straw Hat, and always intends to consider it so because he's the closest to being Human. It's in the 10th Anniversary One Piece: Treasures book evidently.

And anyway, Brook's rocking the blood freezing Soul Solid sword, so he definitely goes up.

Also you misspelled Usopp's name.
Usopp's Pop Greens are still pretty formidable. Oda could be talking about his will as it's pretty clear that Usopp is pretty fragile mental-wise. Anyway, he's only definitively above Nami.

Not sure, the more I review their abilities, the more I see them as equal.
Brook has speed and swordsmanship on his side. The sword only freezes the blood that spurts out of the victim. In truth, it's not that impressive as it's not really necessary. His freezing abilities are currently nowhere near Aokiji. He also has musical genjutsu, but Oda's been vague on when Brook has his violin with him.

Usopp has those variable and impressive Pop Green's. He can fire plants that instantly grow and eat the victim. He can also instantly grow seaweed that's large and strong enough to hold back an avalanche. In this case, it can be used as a diversion against Brook. He has instant-growing plants that can be land mines, an odor-inducing diversion, a huge trampoline, a huge explosion, rising spikes, or a giant wolf whose nose causes a shockwave.

I'm strongly considering them to be equal as Brook can't necessarily cut through the attrition of plants Usopp has, but his speed and possible genjutsu can bail him out.

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So question why is law below Moria? Wouldn't his recent feats of Casually facing down Smoker and his crew almost Gurantee him being moved up. Doubtful Boa can win either.
He actually didn't do much against Smoker yet. He dodged his head-on attack, but Smoker's never been that much of a speedster.

As hinted, a good amount of Haki, particularly Busoshoku, should render Law's crazy arrangements null. Hancock has shown just as much as Busoshoku Haki as anyone, seeing as she managed to physically hurt Smoker, which Law hasn't. She can also petrify on contact; Law doesn't have to be infatuated with her. She's a real powerhouse.

As for Moriah, I already mentioned that I'm leaning towards Law being above him. However, Moriah is assumed to be given Busoshoku Haki as I'm sure Oda would to an established/experienced One Piece character. Also add that his Shadow easily fought and reacted to Luffy. Moriah can instantly switch places with his Shadow too. As the Shadow is impervious to damage, Law would have to directly go for Moriah, but Moriah can simply switch places with his Shadow. If Moriah or his Shadow manages to grab Law's shadow and cut it, he goes into a 2 day coma. This is Moriah in his prime too.

Don't get me wrong though, Law's probably going up after this scuffle with Smoker is over.
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Old 03-27-2012, 08:47 PM   #184
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

Doesn't Law and Drake need to be lower? Because, Zoro and Sanji one shotted a Pacifista, while Kid and Drake barely could take one on themselves.
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Old 03-28-2012, 05:58 PM   #185
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

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Originally Posted by NagatoGod_of_Pain View Post
Moving.



He actually didn't do much against Smoker yet. He dodged his head-on attack, but Smoker's never been that much of a speedster.

As hinted, a good amount of Haki, particularly Busoshoku, should render Law's crazy arrangements null. Hancock has shown just as much as Busoshoku Haki as anyone, seeing as she managed to physically hurt Smoker, which Law hasn't. She can also petrify on contact; Law doesn't have to be infatuated with her. She's a real powerhouse.

As for Moriah, I already mentioned that I'm leaning towards Law being above him. However, Moriah is assumed to be given Busoshoku Haki as I'm sure Oda would to an established/experienced One Piece character. Also add that his Shadow easily fought and reacted to Luffy. Moriah can instantly switch places with his Shadow too. As the Shadow is impervious to damage, Law would have to directly go for Moriah, but Moriah can simply switch places with his Shadow. If Moriah or his Shadow manages to grab Law's shadow and cut it, he goes into a 2 day coma. This is Moriah in his prime too.

Don't get me wrong though, Law's probably going up after this scuffle with Smoker is over.
Smoker is hella fast he kept up with g2 Luffy. Who is faster than Moria. That is both their current minimum speed. His swordsmanship can be compared to current Zoro. He just sliced that battleship in half. Which is as big if not bigger than that galley Zoro cut at the beginning of the part 2. Boa is a toss up that I don't feel like debating. But Moria gets f***ed up. If not for the Haki issue alone.
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Old 03-29-2012, 01:42 PM   #186
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

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Doesn't Law and Drake need to be lower? Because, Zoro and Sanji one shotted a Pacifista, while Kid and Drake barely could take one on themselves.
This list incorporates both characters from pre-Time Skip and those who have already been shown/hinted at currently.

Kid and Drake have been ravaging the New World during the past 2 years apparently. Judging by their previous standings, I think it's fair to say that their current positions reflect at what's been hinted.

Seeing as how Law's improvement made him a top-flight character, Kid and Drake will probably move up tremendously anyway in due time.

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Smoker is hella fast he kept up with g2 Luffy. Who is faster than Moria. That is both their current minimum speed. His swordsmanship can be compared to current Zoro. He just sliced that battleship in half. Which is as big if not bigger than that galley Zoro cut at the beginning of the part 2. Boa is a toss up that I don't feel like debating. But Moria gets f***ed up. If not for the Haki issue alone.
Don't think Smoker has ever even seen G2 Luffy. The only time he fought Luffy after he revealed Gears was at Marineford. Luffy didn't use G2 against him during their scuffle.

As for Law's swordsmanship, I'm hesitant to classify it as the same as Zoro's or Mihawk's. After all, Law can lift battleships and completely control the actions in his "operating table". It's not necessarily the same as Zoro or Mihawk, who cuts ships with pure strength, not thanks to the conundrums of a Devil Fruit. Regardless, I put him above Moriah. Scapel/Mes along with switching places at will is one helluva moveset.
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Old 03-29-2012, 06:16 PM   #187
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

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Don't think Smoker has ever even seen G2 Luffy. The only time he fought Luffy after he revealed Gears was at Marineford. Luffy didn't use G2 against him during their scuffle.

As for Law's swordsmanship, I'm hesitant to classify it as the same as Zoro's or Mihawk's. After all, Law can lift battleships and completely control the actions in his "operating table". It's not necessarily the same as Zoro or Mihawk, who cuts ships with pure strength, not thanks to the conundrums of a Devil Fruit. Regardless, I put him above Moriah. Scapel/Mes along with switching places at will is one helluva moveset.
Law didn't use his room when he split that battleship in half in the last scuffle. Smoker deflected the slice and the blow split the ship above them. Reread the fight that was his pure power. He relies on his swordmanship more than his trick room. Just like Luffy relies on his strength. As for the gears and smoker Luffy activated them against smoker but smoker slammed him with his sticks. He deactivated imediately because of the seastone.
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Old 03-31-2012, 12:45 PM   #188
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

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Law didn't use his room when he split that battleship in half in the last scuffle. Smoker deflected the slice and the blow split the ship above them. Reread the fight that was his pure power. He relies on his swordmanship more than his trick room. Just like Luffy relies on his strength.
Ch. 660, pgs. 16-17 & Ch. 661, pg. 11 - Clearly shows what's in the vicinity of Law's Devil Fruit. Notice how the pillar of stone and part of the battleship is arranged in a manner only allowed within Law's DF.

Ch. 661, pg. 14 - Read the first panel on the page. The Marines clearly tell the reader what Law has been doing within his DF. Again, this is all within the range of Room.

Ch. 662, pg. 8 - The backlash of Law's swing. Both halves of the battleship were within Law's DF.

How am I supposed to believe that Law's swordsmanship is purely based on strength when he can lift battleships, send them flying, arrange pillars of rock and said battleship, switch places at will with large pieces of wood, take hearts out of humans, etc. all because of his Devil Fruit?

It's no different from when Law lifted the battleship with his finger. It's not meant to be based on strength.

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As for the gears and smoker Luffy activated them against smoker but smoker slammed him with his sticks. He deactivated imediately because of the seastone.
Don't see how that instance means Smoker kept up with G2 Luffy.

Luffy was immobile and used Jet Gatling. Thanks to his Logia, Smoker was unfazed and launched towards Luffy. Luffy had enough time to say an entire sentence and looked directly at him. By the time Smoker was literally around Luffy's body, he attacked. That's closer to reaction time on Luffy's part; doesn't mean Smoker can move as fast as G2 Luffy.

If Luffy was trying to get away from Smoker, moving at G2 speeds, and then Smoker caught up, it'd be a viable speed feat (what Kizaru did later). Not when Smoker is moving towards Luffy, just standing there, looking Smoker in the eye, and even had time to say a sentence.
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Old 03-31-2012, 05:28 PM   #189
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Ch. 660, pgs. 16-17 & Ch. 661, pg. 11 - Clearly shows what's in the vicinity of Law's Devil Fruit. Notice how the pillar of stone and part of the battleship is arranged in a manner only allowed within Law's DF.

Ch. 661, pg. 14 - Read the first panel on the page. The Marines clearly tell the reader what Law has been doing within his DF. Again, this is all within the range of Room.

Ch. 662, pg. 8 - The backlash of Law's swing. Both halves of the battleship were within Law's DF.

How am I supposed to believe that Law's swordsmanship is purely based on strength when he can lift battleships, send them flying, arrange pillars of rock and said battleship, switch places at will with large pieces of wood, take hearts out of humans, etc. all because of his Devil Fruit?

It's no different from when Law lifted the battleship with his finger. It's not meant to be based on strength.
I like how you skip over the fact that it was clearly a slash. Meaning it was from his sword not his df. Just like everyother character in the story he combines his abilities with his raw power. You don't have to beleive it but that was clearly a sword stroke laced with haki that smoker deflected. He didn't switch anything. He is using both his powers and strength. How can you even doubt that when that is the regular in the story?


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Don't see how that instance means Smoker kept up with G2 Luffy.

Luffy was immobile and used Jet Gatling. Thanks to his Logia, Smoker was unfazed and launched towards Luffy. Luffy had enough time to say an entire sentence and looked directly at him. By the time Smoker was literally around Luffy's body, he attacked. That's closer to reaction time on Luffy's part; doesn't mean Smoker can move as fast as G2 Luffy.

If Luffy was trying to get away from Smoker, moving at G2 speeds, and then Smoker caught up, it'd be a viable speed feat (what Kizaru did later). Not when Smoker is moving towards Luffy, just standing there, looking Smoker in the eye, and even had time to say a sentence.
For smoker to even hit Luffy that would mean he needed the reaction and speed to tag him. Luffy reactions is top notch if the opponent was slower than him he would have avoided it. Smokers is definetely on par with g2 Luffy.
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Old 04-01-2012, 12:13 PM   #190
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

I rewatched it. Luffy used JGG and Smoker just flew by it, allowing it to go through him. He then split into different pillars of smoke and then reformed, slamming his jutte into Luffy's throat.
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Old 04-06-2012, 12:21 PM   #191
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

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I like how you skip over the fact that it was clearly a slash. Meaning it was from his sword not his df. Just like everyother character in the story he combines his abilities with his raw power. You don't have to beleive it but that was clearly a sword stroke laced with haki that smoker deflected. He didn't switch anything. He is using both his powers and strength. How can you even doubt that when that is the regular in the story?
I like how you completely ignore that Law has seemingly complete control of everything inside his Room. His reach extends as far as the size of Room.
Who's to say that his sword is nearly an "operating tool" that makes incisions? He has gravitational abilities strong enough to lift battleships, but can't slice objects with that ability. For all we know, his sword is the tool that starts the incision while his gravitational abilities then makes use of it (i.e. pulling it apart).

Until we get an exact answer that Law's swordsmanship is on par with Zoro or Mihawk (which I can't see Oda doing for character's individuality sake), then I'm not going to count that as concrete. Or if we see Law use his sword outside of his DF.

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For smoker to even hit Luffy that would mean he needed the reaction and speed to tag him. Luffy reactions is top notch if the opponent was slower than him he would have avoided it. Smokers is definetely on par with g2 Luffy.
Or it could simply be that Smoker was unfazed from Luffy's attack thanks to his Logia, then proceeded to attack. Logia's can become intangible on reactions from physical contact.

It doesn't take much to let attacks move through you, proceed to move forward, and attack an immobile target. Luffy made eye contact with Smoker and had enough time to compliment him. It's more of a failure on Luffy's part than an impressive feat for Smoker.
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Old 04-06-2012, 01:00 PM   #192
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I like how you completely ignore that Law has seemingly complete control of everything inside his Room. His reach extends as far as the size of Room.
Who's to say that his sword is nearly an "operating tool" that makes incisions? He has gravitational abilities strong enough to lift battleships, but can't slice objects with that ability. For all we know, his sword is the tool that starts the incision while his gravitational abilities then makes use of it (i.e. pulling it apart).

Until we get an exact answer that Law's swordsmanship is on par with Zoro or Mihawk (which I can't see Oda doing for character's individuality sake), then I'm not going to count that as concrete. Or if we see Law use his sword outside of his DF.
I like how you ignore the fact he was molding his physical attacks and DF attacks together. Then lets mention the fact that on Panel they said the attack was an slash. Since when does Laws df give off sword energy. That alone proves that his raw power. Yes he used his df constantly but he also used his raw power too. Just like the admirals, just like Whitebeard, Just like Ivan. Everyone combines their df an physical stats.


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Or it could simply be that Smoker was unfazed from Luffy's attack thanks to his Logia, then proceeded to attack. Logia's can become intangible on reactions from physical contact.

It doesn't take much to let attacks move through you, proceed to move forward, and attack an immobile target. Luffy made eye contact with Smoker and had enough time to compliment him. It's more of a failure on Luffy's part than an impressive feat for Smoker.
Bro Luffy's reactions was top notch for his rank in the world back then. He has dodged high speed atacks close in. Not only that he plays around all the time and still doesn't get caught off guard. Smoker would need to be hella fast to tag Luffy. That is no excuse. Anyways Smoker has always been faster than Luffy since they first met. He didn't dodge because he didn't have to. Doesn't mean he can't.
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Old 04-08-2012, 08:08 PM   #193
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

Where would SA Zoro and Sanji fit?
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Old 04-11-2012, 05:53 PM   #194
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

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Originally Posted by Devils Lawyer View Post
I like how you ignore the fact he was molding his physical attacks and DF attacks together. Then lets mention the fact that on Panel they said the attack was an slash. Since when does Laws df give off sword energy. That alone proves that his raw power. Yes he used his df constantly but he also used his raw power too. Just like the admirals, just like Whitebeard, Just like Ivan. Everyone combines their df an physical stats.
What else are fodder Marines supposed to say on the spot? They can't analyze things in the split seconds that they have. Thus, they call what they see, which is a physical action of moving a sword that results in a cut object.

Law has never been illustrated as a fighter with renown swordsmanship. He's not classified or exemplified by Oda to be the same kind of fighter as Mihawk or Zoro. That much is obvious. Wouldn't you think Oda would take the time to exclusively show Law cutting a battleship in half with pure strength if he wanted him to be in that category? Instead, he leaves it ambiguous for fans.

The fact that he can lift battleships with his Devil Fruit should also lead one to think he can cut battleships with his Devil Fruit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Devils Lawyer View Post
Bro Luffy's reactions was top notch for his rank in the world back then. He has dodged high speed atacks close in. Not only that he plays around all the time and still doesn't get caught off guard. Smoker would need to be hella fast to tag Luffy. That is no excuse. Anyways Smoker has always been faster than Luffy since they first met. He didn't dodge because he didn't have to. Doesn't mean he can't.
Except that Luffy treats Smoker closer to a playful rivalry instead of a serious one. I don't understand how you completely ignore this sentence: Luffy made eye contact with Smoker and had enough time to compliment him.

All of what Luffy has shown becomes null if he disregards those feats in this one instance. There is no other way around it, Luffy made eye contact with Smoker and had enough time to compliment him.

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Originally Posted by boxhead327 View Post
Where would SA Zoro and Sanji fit?
I'm assuming you mean Sabaody Archipelago? Not sure I would include characters by the arc since that would lead to an inflated list. But to answer your question, they'd probably end up around Capone Bege's and Killer's placement.
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Old 04-25-2012, 08:51 AM   #195
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

A few changes are needed, I think.
First, why is Aokiji below Rayleigh and the other admrails when he has the best destructive feat in one piece?
Also, why is enel so high up? He has good capacity, but he's a really slow glass cannon, seeing as skypia luffy could both harm him and keep up with him. he should be below sanji.
Why is croc equal to ace, jimbei and Ivankov? Croc should be way below him, just below sanji, and the three should go:
Ace
Ivankov
Jimbei
Why are hancock and law below ace, jimbei, ivankov? Due to their haxx, they should be placed between ivankov and ace, with law above hancock.
Gecko Moriah's placement depends on whether is is in nightmare mode or not.
Why is brook so low? He should be above Daz Bones.
Why is buggy so low? He should be above arlong.
Done for now.
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Old 04-25-2012, 09:45 AM   #196
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

Quote:
Originally Posted by waterluffyG2 View Post
A few changes are needed, I think.
First, why is Aokiji below Rayleigh and the other admrails when he has the best destructive feat in one piece?
Enel has the best destructive feat in One Piece is memory serves. Or failing him, Akainu.

What's Aokiji ever destroyed.

Quote:
Also, why is enel so high up? He has good capacity, but he's a really slow glass cannon, seeing as skypia luffy could both harm him and keep up with him. he should be below sanji.
Totally ignoring the fact that Enel is a logia, can fly, and can shoot lightning with pretty good accuracy from like 30285285903869043869035 miles in the sky. In addition to possessing Haki on steroids.

90% of the characters on the list could never touch him.

Quote:
Why are hancock and law below ace, jimbei, ivankov? Due to their haxx, they should be placed between ivankov and ace, with law above hancock.
Hancock's hax is highly situational and wouldn't work on Iva and probably wouldn't work on Jimbei either.

No comment on Law.

Quote:
Gecko Moriah's placement depends on whether is is in nightmare mode or not.
Not really. He's slow while using Shadows Asgard.
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Old 04-26-2012, 06:13 AM   #197
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

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Originally Posted by Cult of Personality View Post
Enel has the best destructive feat in One Piece is memory serves. Or failing him, Akainu.
What's Aokiji ever destroyed.
Search "Aokji vs the ocean" in google.

Quote:
Totally ignoring the fact that Enel is a logia,
So anyone with coA haki or seastone can hit him.
Quote:
can fly,
So can rob lucci, and you put him way below enel.
Quote:
and can shoot lightning with pretty good accuracy from like 30285285903869043869035
miles in the sky.
In which case he can shoot lightning further than the sloan great wall: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sloan_Great_Wall, so yeah, he can solo one piece. Futhermore, he has to get up there first, and a huge amount of the characters you put below him could blitz before that
Quote:
In addition to possessing Haki on steroids.
Good point, but only CoO.
Quote:
Hancock's hax is highly situational and wouldn't work on Iva and probably wouldn't work on Jimbei either.
It works on magellan. (and without her fruit, as well).
Quote:
Not really. He's slow while using Shadows Asgard.
But without it, his speed is even worse, and his capacity and duriblity are rubbish. He has good range, though.
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Old 04-26-2012, 08:12 AM   #198
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

Quote:
Originally Posted by waterluffyG2 View Post
Search "Aokji vs the ocean" in google.
Freezing an ocean is not the same as destroying it.

Quote:
So anyone with coA haki or seastone can hit him.
Supposing he was up close and personal with the maybe ten people that meet that requirement and not 94056890345809365 miles in the air picking them off with El Thor spam.

Meanwhile, there's five people below him that meet that requirement. Smoker with his seastone. El Thor.

Hancock, Pekoms, Sentomaru, Jinbei all with Color of Armament. El Thor, El Thor, El Thor, El Thor.

Quote:
So can rob lucci, and you put him way below enel.
Lucci doesn't have the benefit of being a logia with a range greater than any other character in the series.

Quote:
In which case he can shoot lightning further than the sloan great wall: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sloan_Great_Wall, so yeah, he can solo one piece.
Intentionally taking obviously exaggerated numbers literally aside, he does have a massive range.

Quote:
Futhermore, he has to get up there first, and a huge amount of the characters you put below him could blitz before that
Not really. The few people capable of actually doing anything to harm him get El Thored.

Quote:
It works on magellan. (and without her fruit, as well).
Magellan isn't a gay man, nor is he a walking fish.
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Old 04-27-2012, 08:57 AM   #199
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cult of Personality View Post
Freezing an ocean is not the same as destroying it.
Yes, he can absorb 24X the energy of a tsar bomb and there is the added haxx of freezing.

Quote:
Meanwhile, there's five people below him that meet that requirement. Smoker with his seastone. El Thor.
Dodge. Seastone hit.
Quote:
Hancock, Pekoms, Sentomaru, Jinbei all with Color of Armament. El Thor, El Thor, El Thor, El Thor.
Dodge, petify,
fair enough,
dodge, punch,
dodge, brick punch.

Quote:
Intentionally taking obviously exaggerated numbers literally aside, he does have a massive range.
Don't exaggerate. Scale matters.
Also, if he does fire his lightning from cloud height, even if it is the speed of real lightning, supersonic characters can dodge it, unless he gets a lucky hit.
Quote:
Magellan isn't a gay man, nor is he a walking fish.
She has also petrified robots, snails, women, and cannonballs.
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Old 04-27-2012, 09:09 AM   #200
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Default Re: One Piece Tier List

Quote:
Originally Posted by waterluffyG2 View Post
Yes, he can absorb 24X the energy of a tsar bomb and there is the added haxx of freezing.
Fascinating. No one cares. It's still not a destructive feat.

Quote:
Dodge. Seastone hit.
Dodge. El Thor.

Quote:
Dodge, petify,
Dodge, El Thor.

Quote:
dodge, punch,
Dodge, El Thor.

Quote:
dodge, brick punch.
Dodge, El Thor.

Quote:
Don't exaggerate. Scale matters.
Not really.

Quote:
Also, if he does fire his lightning from cloud height, even if it is the speed of real lightning, supersonic characters can dodge it, unless he gets a lucky hit.
He's good at lucky. He can predict his opponents moves before they make them. He aims where they are and a second El Thor fries them where they will be.

Quote:
She has also petrified robots, snails, women, and cannonballs.
Male snails. As to women, maybe she was a lesbian. Either way.

Robots I don't remember, but the cannonballs was Slave Arrow, which takes longer than Mero Mero Merrow, which hasn't worked on anyone other than fodder and which can be easily dodged by anyone worth mentioning.

In any event, unless you can prove Mero Mero Merrow works on Iva and Jimbei, it can't. Period.
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