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Old 07-26-2011, 05:05 PM   #21
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

When I said undesirable I meant from a reproduction standpoint if you believe that is an organisms main goal. (I just want to stick to science there may be reasons from a higher power we don't understand) And when I say "intend" I mean the natural selection process in which traits that help survival and reproduction are passed and ones that hinder those things eventually fade out. I apologise for not clarifying what I meant earlier. But your right homosexuals may very well have a place for reasons we don't and can't understand. I just wanted to look at it from a purely scientific standpoint which is hard to do with this subject.

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Old 07-26-2011, 05:08 PM   #22
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

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nature wants us to reproduce and spread our genes
Whereas I couldn't care less what nature wants for me and rather care about what I want for myself.
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Old 07-26-2011, 05:09 PM   #23
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

So.... Is homosexuality Natural Selection?
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Old 07-26-2011, 05:11 PM   #24
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

You don't choose who you're attracted to, you CHOOSE to act on that attraction.

A gay man CHOOSES to have relations with another gay man.
Just as a straight man CHOOSES to get in some girls pants.
And just like a pedo CHOOSES to rape that little boy.

The attractions not the issue, the issue is the self control or lack there of in others.
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Old 07-26-2011, 05:13 PM   #25
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

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So.... Is homosexuality Natural Selection?
What do you mean? It may be somthing that occurs within natural selection.

And your right a gay man chooses to or not to have sex with another guy.
But he does not choose the fact that he's attracted to them.
But your 100% correct in that its his choice to act on those urges but isn't responsible in any way for the urges themselves.

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Old 07-26-2011, 05:15 PM   #26
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

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What do you mean?
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Originally Posted by boman265 View Post
When I said undesirable I meant from a reproduction standpoint if you believe that is an organisms main goal. (I just want to stick to science there may be reasons from a higher power we don't understand) And when I say "intend" I mean the natural selection process in which traits that help survival and reproduction are passed and ones that hinder those things eventually fade out. I apologise for not clarifying what I meant earlier. But your right homosexuals may very well have a place for reasons we don't and can't understand. I just wanted to look at it from a purely scientific standpoint which is hard to do with this subject.
You said it's an undesirable trait, and then the above bold.
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Old 07-26-2011, 05:19 PM   #27
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

So yes I guess it may be a product of Natural Selection in that it happens in nature. And when I say nature intend for us to reproduce I just meant that as a scientific answer for being not a religious or philosophical one. I don't in any way mean that its bad to be gay or people have their own reasons for being who they are just that I think in science we can all agree that a common goal that all living things share is to reproduce and that being homosexual makes reproduction statisticly less likely to occur. I think that it is most likely a biological disorder though and definatly don't think its a mental one.

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Old 07-26-2011, 05:23 PM   #28
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

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And when I say nature intend for us to reproduce I just meant that as a scientific answer for being not a religious or philosophical.
I know. I wasn't responding religiously. Perhaps philosophically. I simply wanted to object to the idea that I have to do something because nature wants me to, despite the fact that you weren't really saying that. Also that nature "wants" anything. That's more philosophical than scientific.

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Old 07-26-2011, 05:27 PM   #29
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

Like I said in previous posts don't get hung up on when I said "nature wants". I think I've thoroughly explained I meant Natural Selection(that all things spread genes that help their species survive in their gene pool and genes that don't fade out) when I said "nature wants."

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Old 07-26-2011, 05:28 PM   #30
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

I like being technical. That's all.
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Old 07-26-2011, 06:17 PM   #31
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

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Since both you can't really control who your're attracted too, I don't really see why one should be categorized as a mental disorder and one isn't.
Because society is full of hypocritical fools and white knight moronic mentality that the people would rather ignore the scientific facts of the situation. There is nothing different about them on a scientific level. The only reason gays even defend its difference is because of the stigma attached to pedophilia and its virus like tendency to destroy the positive reputation of whatever is related to it.

The difference between them is purely metaphysical, held within the mind of society. Pedophilia has been around since recorded time, and in many of the main civilizations of the past it was accepted in one way or another. Many of Americas founders were pedos by todays standards, as were many of the greatest leaders in human history. Each evolution of society finds another reason to justify their reasons for or against it, when this society falls another will take a place and the process will repeat, and eventually we will come to accept it again, and then again outlaw it. The only argument/excuse against the early days was an short life span on average. Which is faulty on its own anyways because that entire argument is based around the concept of it being dangerous for children to birth children or engage in sexual activity. The physical dangers carry some merit, the risk is increased at an early age. Mental damage however is completely subjective and the only true argument against pedophilia now.
So society blissfully brands pedophiles as monsters due to a subjective ideal that means nothing anymore. Children of today are exposed to sexual content to such an extent that on average a young teenager will do more sexual acts and be more sexually aware of themself and others than their parents were when they reached the legal drinking age.

Further more, that it is so wrong and unnatural is an ideal going against genetics. Females are wired to want a male older than themselves because older males will have more worldly experience and will provide better protection (in any meaning of the word) than a younger male. Which also stems back to the more animal like instincts we have, because competition between older males means that a male has to prove themselves a better fit father than the other experienced males. It's akin to the difference between having two cubs fight for you and two lions. It doesn't matter which cub wins, they are still a cub.
Males are wired to want females younger than themselves because younger females have less chances of birth failure and are generally able of producing milk in higher quantities for their children and have more energy to take care of them. They also typically have more eggs being younger, thus able of producing more children.

Its important to remember that pedophilia does not mean a 60 year old man that likes 12 year olds. It means attraction to a specific age group by someone that is outside of said age group. A 16 year old that likes 12 year olds will be classified as a pedo. If you are to get technical and overly anal about it, a 13 year old would be one too, as pedophilia is pre-pubescent children, almost always universally defined as someone between the ages of about 10-12. So yes, that by the definition makes the 13 year old a pedo. What a monster.
In short, the stigma against pedophilia is a bunch of bullshit crap that holds society back from reflecting that it itself has made their children exactly what they hated pedos from doing--becoming sexually aware beings. That is why everything involving them needs to be on a case by case basis.

A long time ago I was already helping my father invest in the stock market and thinking of how best to manage my retirement fund with the current economic rates, and making corrections based on an assumed future of the economy. And then I had to take a gander at the housing market of course since that would be one of my biggest investments toward myself. Weighing my assumed average pay at that period of time against a variety of factors. Plus I had to consider my family and their expenses and to make sure I had money to live comfortably while maintaining a future for myself and my children--such as college funds. One part of a great many calculations and possibilities I thought of, and still do.

Why did I tell you all of that? Because I started doing that when I was 11. And people have the nerve to tell me I wasn't mentally developed enough to consent to sex? Go screw yourself, so you were a typical dumbass 11 year old, yay, not everyone develops at the same rate. I skipped the teenage years and moved right to 20+. Which is why now at the age of 19 I mentally feel 30 and all the glorious tiredness that comes with it. Constant stress of life does that to you. I knew damn well what it meant to have sex, and even more so with someone far older than me.

Back to the main topic though, we do have cases of 60 year old men going after 12 year old girls. The difference is judging whether the girl is capable of actually giving consent with understanding. As it is, there are more than enough cases of this happening and the child defending their actions. All of which is thrown aside under the guise of the child not being mature enough to know shes/hes been "duped" into thinking they had something special. When no one infact knows anything. People would of told me the same thing, completely ignoring the fact that I was very much aware of the differences between sex and love. And then someone innocent would of been thrown to rot in prison, and then later ruined forever with the sex offender branded on their record. I knew of a relationship like this, said relationship eventually led to them being married and having children after the younger one was older. And now they are content and happy. Freaks. That doesn't mean every case is wrong and that every pedo is a friendly misunderstood person. There are plenty of people that do bad things to children. That problem however isn't because they are a pedo, the problem is themself. We don't call people that rape women anything other than a rapist. We call people that rape children pedos, and this is the wrong use of the term and you will often find that researchers and psychologists that have knowledge of this field will say the same thing. For the same reason calling someone that has sex with a toddler a pedo is wrong. That isn't a pedo, they have another term for it, because the mindset of the person is completely different. A pedo only likes pre-pubescent children in the age range of about 9-12. You can't compare someone that likes 12 year olds sexually to someone that likes infants sexually. The mindset and psychology involved are completely different. Those that do compare them equally are fools and do not understand anything about the science behind it and should go under a rock in shame for making our species that much worse. If you are one of those people, then pat yourself on the back, you're like the other billions of morons.

The point is that pedophilia has an automatic stigma attached to it that is full of so many holes that it makes Swiss cheese blush. Anything positive or logical about it is thrown aside for the sake of trying to make our species look better. And that's all it comes down to in the end, people not wanting to accept what we are. Which ties into the struggles of the gays.
Or might I remind everyone that in the past being gay was considered (among many, many other equally undesirable things) a mental disorder?

You asked what the difference between them was. Nothing.

/Rant

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Old 07-26-2011, 06:54 PM   #32
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

...^that
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Old 07-26-2011, 07:33 PM   #33
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

What Vorn said.
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Old 07-26-2011, 07:41 PM   #34
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

^ What he said
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Old 07-26-2011, 07:44 PM   #35
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

What she said that he said that he said that I said that Vorn said
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Old 07-26-2011, 07:50 PM   #36
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

Honestly I think the reason that homosexuals defend the difference between homosexuality and pedophilia is because it seems that a lot of ignorant people believe that they are one in the same. Not all pedophiles are homosexual. Not all homosexuals are pedophiles. Homosexuality =/= pedophilia. Maybe on some level the reason that people are whichever of the two is the same, but the actual...idk, tendencies? are not the same.
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Old 07-26-2011, 10:27 PM   #37
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

will being gay your born gay. humans are not the only species to be gay even animals have been documented as loving the same sex. when a man or a women is gay they date other gay people just like a straight person dates another straight person.

as for pedophiles when pedophiles prey upon children they child is traumatized and is hurt. children are not mint to be in any sexual activity whats so ever.

when you watch cases about pedophiles like in law and order for example they always seem to play mind games with children. always using tricks or mental control on them does that seem normal too you?
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Old 07-27-2011, 12:37 PM   #38
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

The main difference would be that with Pedophilia the child "wouldn't know better"
whereas with gays it's two consenting adults.
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Old 07-27-2011, 12:42 PM   #39
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

Common sense. There is a difference.

A child is incapable of making a choice, and simply isn't attracted to anyone yet. It's a matter of protecting the innocent party, the child.

Men on men is a choice by both parties. It doesn't matter if it's immoral. They're both grown adults, what they do with each other is under the judgement of only morals.
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Old 07-27-2011, 12:51 PM   #40
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Default Re: Why is being a pedophile a mental disorder, but being gay isn't

Quote:
Originally Posted by [Shikamaru] View Post
Common sense. There is a difference.

A child is incapable of making a choice, and simply isn't attracted to anyone yet. It's a matter of protecting the innocent party, the child.

Men on men is a choice by both parties. It doesn't matter if it's immoral. They're both grown adults, what they do with each other is under the judgement of only morals.
Spoiler:




And for someone that speaks of common sense you show none. Sexual activities of a gay nature are not limited to male on male, nor are they limited to people over the age of consent.

Last edited by Vornmusion; 07-27-2011 at 01:13 PM.
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