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View Poll Results: Who wins?
Neji 6 46.15%
Shikamaru 7 53.85%
Voters: 13. You may not vote on this poll

 
 
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Old 03-29-2010, 08:05 PM   #41
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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Originally Posted by (un)Godly Hiroku View Post
no he doesnt have more long ranged, and they didn't "screw him" different character are weak/strong against other characters, it just depends on their fighting styles.
And shikamaru is alot smarter than Neji, and he can easily dodge Neji's air palm. And if Neji's gonna go that route. Then Shika can just dodge 'em until Neji runs out of chakra.
Neji wil not waste chakra (also we have yet to see more long range jutsu, but i bet they made Neji have more. thats like saying naruto only has one rasengan. )
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Old 03-29-2010, 08:07 PM   #42
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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He may be able to out smart them, but thats not enough to win. And he can't out smart Sasuke (just onoe example).

you have to give reasons to back up your presumptions.
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Old 03-29-2010, 08:07 PM   #43
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

ok guys im not arguing anymore! (after this post) this would be an epic fight! we will never know unless they make he episode or something like that!!!
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Old 03-29-2010, 09:58 PM   #44
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

I'll side with Shikamaru, and not because that's my name.

Shikamaru has more impressive foot speed features compared to Neji.

In any case, that wouldn't matter much. Neji has no long range attacks, while Shikamaru's shadows can split into dozens of single shadows. It wouldn't be difficult to capture Neji, especially considering he caught Hidan with ease. Kaiten can't physically block a shadows, meaning Neji has no chance at dodging them from afar.

Shikamaru is not useless in close range, either. He's dodged attacks from multiple giant summons, Temari's blitz, Hidan, a direct charge from Kakuzu, and the lightning heart. Which is why I consider his foot speed to be superior compared to Neji's.

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Old 03-29-2010, 10:14 PM   #45
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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Originally Posted by e710 View Post
and air palms suck
If Empty Palm can send Kisame flying back, it can kill the crap out of Suckamaru.
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Old 03-29-2010, 10:19 PM   #46
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

it probably could seeing as how shikamaru durability sucks
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Old 03-29-2010, 10:36 PM   #47
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

Ugh, this is such a difficult battle. I really do not know who would win. I would need to look at some statistics and analyze the battle situation and terrain.
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Old 03-29-2010, 10:52 PM   #48
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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Originally Posted by Kazumi Saitama View Post
Ugh, this is such a difficult battle. I really do not know who would win. I would need to look at some statistics and analyze the battle situation and terrain.
What?

Neji has no counter for shadows.

He caught Hidan 3 times, Neji has no chance.
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Old 03-29-2010, 11:19 PM   #49
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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Originally Posted by [Shikamaru] View Post
What?

Neji has no counter for shadows.

He caught Hidan 3 times, Neji has no chance.
I must disagree. Statistic wise, Neji is stronger than Shikamaru. Almost all of Shikamaru's attacks are long ranged and take a moment to actually activate. On the other hand, most of Neji's attacks are close ranged, quick to activate and he does possess two jutsus that are indeed long ranged and can be used if needed. Neji's foot speed is almost twice as fast Shikamaru's. So hypothetically speaking, all Neji must do is dodge Shikamaru's shadows, which move fast but not too fast, as to where they are unable to be dodged. Shikamaru's jutsu also require a lot of chakra. Neji is a master at chakra control. Now, depending on the terrain and the time of day, Shikamaru could be at a great advantage or a great disadvantage. Shikamaru is very brilliant, so this may give him the upper hand for a moment against Neji, but Neji is also very smart. Hand to hand combat, Shikamaru would totally lose, especially if Neji uses his Gentle Fist. One hit could cut off Shikamaru's chakra completely, ultimately leading in a defeat. Since Shikamaru's shadow jutsus work better long range, all Neji needs to do is get close enough to Shikamaru and it's game over.
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Old 03-29-2010, 11:38 PM   #50
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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Originally Posted by Kazumi Saitama View Post
I must disagree. Statistic wise, Neji is stronger than Shikamaru. Almost all of Shikamaru's attacks are long ranged and take a moment to actually activate. On the other hand, most of Neji's attacks are close ranged, quick to activate and he does possess two jutsus that are indeed long ranged and can be used if needed. Neji's foot speed is almost twice as fast Shikamaru's. So hypnotically speaking, all Neji must do is dodge Shikamaru's shadows, which move fast but not too fast where they are unable to be dodged. Shikamaru's jutsu also require a lot of chakra. Neji is a master at chakra control. Now, depending on the terrain and the time of day, Shikamaru could be at a great advantage or a great disadvantage. Shikamaru is very brilliant, so this may give him the upper hand for a moment against Neji, but Neji is also very smart. Hand to hand combat, Shikamaru would totally lose, especially if Neji uses his Gentle Fist. One hit could cut off Shikamaru's chakra completely, ultimately leading in a defeat. Since Shikamaru's shadow jutsus work better long range, all Neji needs to do is get close enough to Shikamaru and it's game over.
Lol, no.

His foot speed is not faster than Shikamaru's. Shikamaru has shown features that out rank anything Neji has shown.

He possesses dozens of shadows. Hidan had problems dodging them alone, and with chakra blades, it should be relatively easy to capture Neji.

You make absolutely no sense, you typed a paragraph for no reason. You gave no features in which Neji is faster than Shikamaru, let alone has better dodging abilities than Hidan, who is considered extremely acrobatic and swift, Shikamaru caught him, alone.

Neji is in no way capable of dodging Shikamaru's shadows, let alone landing attacks on him. Twice as fast? Lmao yeah show the facts. Striking speed is striking speed, not foot speed.
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Old 03-29-2010, 11:48 PM   #51
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

Suckamaru's shadows are actually stronger the closer the target is.
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Old 03-29-2010, 11:50 PM   #52
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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Originally Posted by [Shikamaru] View Post
Lol, no.

His foot speed is not faster than Shikamaru's. Shikamaru has shown features that out rank anything Neji has shown.

He possesses dozens of shadows. Hidan had problems dodging them alone, and with chakra blades, it should be relatively easy to capture Neji.

You make absolutely no sense, you typed a paragraph for no reason. You gave no features in which Neji is faster than Shikamaru, let alone has better dodging abilities than Hidan, who is considered extremely acrobatic and swift, Shikamaru caught him, alone.

Neji is in no way capable of dodging Shikamaru's shadows, let alone landing attacks on him. Twice as fast? Lmao yeah show the facts. Striking speed is striking speed, not foot speed.
According to the 3rd Data-Book of Naruto, Neji's speed is 4.5 while Shikamaru's speed is only 2.5. Not exactly twice, but pretty close. Nonetheless, Neji is much faster than Shikamaru. Neji also has his 8-Trigram Palm Rotation, which advanced further in Shippuden. The 8-Trigram Palm Rotation can be used as a defense or offensive. What is Shikamaru going to do? Squeeze Neji's 8-Trigram with shadows? Neji also has his 8-Trigram Empty Palm and 8-Trigram Mountain Crusher, both long ranged attacks. Neji would blow Shikamaru into DBZ with either attack, especially his 8-Trigram Mountain Crusher. Shikamaru's chakra depletes quickly, depending on the type of jutsu he uses. The more powerful the jutsu, the longer distance it travels, the fasters it moves, the more chakra it cost. Neji specializes in Chakra control, far more superior to Shikamaru. Shikamaru would run out of Chakra before Neji's drained to a quarter.
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Old 03-29-2010, 11:57 PM   #53
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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Originally Posted by Kazumi Saitama View Post
According to the 3rd Data-Book of Naruto, Neji's speed is 4.5 while Shikamaru's speed is only 2.5. Not exactly twice, but pretty close. Nonetheless, Neji is much faster than Shikamaru. Neji allows has his 8-Trigram Palm Rotation, which advanced further in Shippuden. The 8-Trigram Palm Rotation can be used as a defense or offensive. What is Shikamaru going to do? Squeeze Neji's 8-Trigram with shadows? Neji allows has his 8-Trigram Empty Palm and 8-Trigram Mountain Crusher, both long ranged attacks. Neji would blow Shikamaru into DBZ with either attack, especially his 8-Trigram Mountain Crusher. Shikamaru's chakra depletes quickly, depending on the type of jutsu he uses. The more powerful the jutsu, the longer distance it travels, the fasters it moves, the more chakra it cost. Neji specializes in Chakra control, far more superior to Shikamaru. Shikamaru would run out of Chakra before Neji's drained to a quarter.
Data books?

Name a time in the manga where Neji has dodged a blitz from someone faster than Kakuzu, or blitzed and captured someone faster than Hidan. Neji has absolutely no speed feats. The only features he has is striking speed, which is in close range, I'd like to see him get near Shikamaru while dodging dozens of shadows.

Are you kidding me?

Shikamaru can use shadow seweing for quite a while. The chances Neji has the ability to dodge the shadow for minutes on end is complete insanity.

Hidan was caught in seconds, Neji is slower.

Bottom line, Neji cannot dodge dozens of shadows at once, with chakra blades raining at him from afar. It's not happening. Even if Neji can see everything, he can't dodge it.

If Neji even came close to Shikamaru, his shadows would impale him, killing him instantly.

Superior chakra control doesn't matter, once he's caught Shikamaru can impale his body within a splint second, he's not breaking the jutsu that quickly.
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:07 AM   #54
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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Originally Posted by [Shikamaru] View Post
Data books?

Name a time in the manga where Neji has dodged a blitz from someone faster than Kakuzu, or blitzed and captured someone faster than Hidan. Neji has absolutely no speed feats. The only features he has is striking speed, which is in close range, I'd like to see him get near Shikamaru while dodging dozens of shadows.

Are you kidding me?

Shikamaru can use shadow seweing for quite a while. The chances Neji has the ability to dodge the shadow for minutes on end is complete insanity.

Hidan was caught in seconds, Neji is slower.

Bottom line, Neji cannot dodge dozens of shadows at once, with chakra blades raining at him from afar. It's not happening. Even if Neji can see everything, he can't dodge it.

If Neji even came close to Shikamaru, his shadows would impale him, killing him instantly.

Superior chakra control doesn't matter, once he's caught Shikamaru can impale his body within a splint second, he's not breaking the jutsu that quickly.
I am sorry, I disagree with you. Shikamaru has gotten more screen time than Neji, so we have been able to see more of Shikamaru's attacks verses Neji's. For all that we know, Neji could have battled someone just as fast and agile as Hidan. Neji is a Jounin, the only of his year. I do not think Shikamaru could defeat him that easily. Yes, I think Shikamaru has some amazing attacks, but I do not think he could defeat Neji. The terrain, weather and time of day also affects the outcome. Unless I am mistaken, Shikamaru can not form shadows unless shadows are present. You have made some good points, but I do not agree.
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:14 AM   #55
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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I am sorry, I disagree with you. Shikamaru has gotten more screen time than Neji, so we have been able to see more of Shikamaru's attacks verses Neji's. For all that we know, Neji could have battled someone just as fast and agile as Hidan. Neji is a Jounin, the only of his year. I do not think Shikamaru could defeat him that easily. Yes, I think Shikamaru has some amazing attacks, but I do not think he could defeat Neji. The terrain, weather and time of day also affects the outcome. Unless I am mistaken, Shikamaru can not form shadows unless shadows are present. You have made some good points, but I do not agree.
What is shown in the manga is their features.

We go with what was shown.

Shikamaru has shown superior features in foot speed.

Why would somebody make a thread in which Shikamaru couldn't use his shadows? That's nonsense.

Ranks have nothing to do with physical skill.

It's clear Shikamaru out ranks Neji, in foot speed, intelligence, and Ninjutsu. Which is why everyone consistently says "You could be hokage"

Now you're switching your arugment from "Neji can dodge the shadows until Shikamaru runs out of chakra" to "Shikamaru might not even be able to use shadows because of the time of day"

The terrain and time wasn't specified, meaning we'd consider him able to use his ninjutsu. If their were restrictions, the creator of the thread would have clearly stated them.

Shikamaru wins with shadow ninjutsu, I don't care if you disagree, the facts are there. If you post another paragraph with NO FACTS backing your theories, then I'll simply down rep you.
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:26 AM   #56
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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What is shown in the manga is their features.

We go with what was shown.

Shikamaru has shown superior features in foot speed.

Why would somebody make a thread in which Shikamaru couldn't use his shadows? That's nonsense.

Ranks have nothing to do with physical skill.

It's clear Shikamaru out ranks Neji, in foot speed, intelligence, and Ninjutsu. Which is why everyone consistently says "You could be hokage"

Now you're switching your arugment from "Neji can dodge the shadows until Shikamaru runs out of chakra" to "Shikamaru might not even be able to use shadows because of the time of day"

The terrain and time wasn't specified, meaning we'd consider him able to use his ninjutsu. If their were restrictions, the creator of the thread would have clearly stated them.

Shikamaru wins with shadow ninjutsu, I don't care if you disagree, the facts are there. If you post another paragraph with NO FACTS backing your theories, then I'll simply down rep you.
I mentioned the time of day in my first or second post, so that has always been present. Neji can dodge Shikamaru's attacks until he runs out of chakra, which would not be long. There are some exceptions to the rule, but for the most part, skill determines rank. You think they would promote an idiot to Jounin? No, they would not. The most intellectual and gifted are promoted. Not saying that Shikamaru is an idiot, because we clearly know he is a genius. He is smarter than Neji, but Neji is not some idiot. Ninjutsu wise, Neji's Ninjutsu is also higher than Shikamaru. The Data-Books are based off of data collected from the anime and manga. Like I stated before, what is Shikamaru going to do? Squeeze, crush, impale his 8-Trigram? I think not. Anyway, this argument is pointless now because we are both fans of the opposite character, so we are always going to see it their way regardless. You refuse to admit that I am right and vice versa.
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:30 AM   #57
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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I mentioned the time of day in my first or second post, so that has always been present. Neji can dodge Shikamaru's attacks until he runs out of chakra, which would not be long. There are some exceptions to the rule, but for the most part, skill determines rank. You think they would promote an idiot to Jounin? No, they would not. The most intellectual and gifted are promoted. Not say that Shikamaru is an idiot, because we clearly know he is a genius. He is smarter than Neji, but Neji is not some idiot. Ninjutsu wise, Neji's Ninjutsu is also higher than Shikamaru. The Data-Books are based off of data collected from the anime and manga. Like I stated before, what is Shikamaru going to do? Squeeze, crush, impale his 8-Trigram? I think not. Anyway, this argument is pointless now because we are both fans of the opposite character, so we are always going to see it their way regardless. You refuse to admit that I am right and vice versa.
8 trigram requires Neji lowering into a stance, and getting into melee range.

I've said, repeatedly, Neji has absolutely no chance of dodging Shikamaru's shadows, or getting anywhere near him, if Hidan could not.

Yet you continuously state the same thing over and over again.

I've asked you to show me a feature in which Neji has shown that has surpassed Hidan's speed, or Shikamaru's at that.

You took a statistic from a random data book, taken by random people. That's not debating, you need to state an instance in which he's show superior speed compared to Hidan, whom couldn't dodge Shikamaru's shadows, let alone get anywhere near him. You need to be EXTREMELY swift to dodge his shadows until he runs out of chakra, especially considering he can launch ranged chakra blades at you, exerting more shadows from them.

This is called debating, not citing from a data book, which is completely illogical most of the time.

State a moment where he's surpassed Hidan's foot speed and acrobatic ability, if you can't, then I won.

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Old 03-30-2010, 12:35 AM   #58
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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8 trigram requires Neji lowering into a stance, and getting into melee range.

I've said, repeatedly, Neji has absolutely no chance of dodging Shikamaru's shadows, or getting anywhere near him, if Hidan could not.

Yet you continuously state the same thing over and over again.

I've asked you to show me a feature in which Neji has shown that has surpassed Hidan's speed, or Shikamaru's at that.

You took a statistic from a random data book, taken by random people. That's not debating, you need to state an instance in which he's show superior speed compared to Hidan, whom couldn't dodge Shikamaru's shadows, let alone get anywhere near him.
I keep repeating myself because it will not sink into your thick skull. The Data-Books were made and published by Misashi Kishimoto. What, you think you know the characters better than the actual creator? I can not show you actual footage because Neji does not have as much screen time as Shikamaru. I can not stress that enough. You will find Shikamaru fighting and using Jutsus more frequently than Neji. And I apologize, I meant to say 8-Trigram Palm Rotation, not just 8-Trigram. For that, I apologize. Statistic do not lie.
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:37 AM   #59
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

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Originally Posted by Kazumi Saitama View Post
I keep repeating myself because it will not sink into your thick skull. The Data-Books were made and published by Misashi Kishimoto. What, you think you know the characters better than the actual creator? I can not show you actual footage because Neji does not have as much screen time as Shikamaru. I can not stress that enough. You will find Shikamaru fighting and using Jutsus more frequently than Neji. And I apologize, I meant to say 8-Trigram Palm Rotation, not just 8-Trigram. For that, I apologize. Statistic do not lie.
The data books mean nothing on this forum, and nothing to me. I debate on what WAS shown in the manga.

If you debate based on data books, half of the debates on this forum would be overturned.

You cannot state any features that Neji has shown that would suggest he has superior speed compared to Hidan and Shikamaru? That means he's not. Yes, Neji is not 4.5 speed ranked, because he has not shown this ability in the manga.

Your entire argument is based on a statistic you can't even back up personally. Here's some advice, don't even look at the data books. Because they're trash.

Last edited by [Shikamaru]; 03-30-2010 at 12:39 AM.
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:50 AM   #60
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Default Re: Neji vs. Shikamaru

Quote:
Originally Posted by [Shikamaru] View Post
The data books mean nothing on this forum, and nothing to me. I debate on what WAS shown in the manga.

If you debate based on data books, half of the debates on this forum would be overturned.

You cannot state any features that Neji has shown that would suggest he has superior speed compared to Hidan and Shikamaru? That means he's not. Yes, Neji is not 4.5 speed ranked, because he has not shown this ability in the manga.

Your entire argument is based on a statistic you can't even back up personally. Here's some advice, don't even look at the data books. Because they're trash.
Oh my goodness. The books are made by the creator of the freaking anime and manga. I think he knows his characters a little better than you do, since he is the one that made their story-lines, their jutsus, the anime and manga. I am pretty sure he doesn't pull these statistics out of his rear. They are based off of data collected from the series, like any statistic. You sound very immature right now. Oh and Hidan is slower than Neji. I just checked, 3.5 to be exact.
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