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deathraiser
11-14-2010, 04:10 PM
This is the yusuke from the end of yyh,who win?

Devil's Lawyer
11-14-2010, 04:16 PM
Yusuke has shown the better power feats speed is also faster than raditz.

deathraiser
11-14-2010, 04:20 PM
No yusuke have never shown any impressive speed feats and raditz is a casual mountain buster.

Devil's Lawyer
11-14-2010, 04:24 PM
Yusuke is a casual mountain buster. He was a mountain buster ever since he fought Sensui. Matter of fact you can compare that fight to the Goku vs Vegeta fight.

deathraiser
11-14-2010, 04:29 PM
Would you mind proving it like showing a scan or something,still raditz is too fast for yusuke.

Devil's Lawyer
11-14-2010, 04:46 PM
Would you mind proving it like showing a scan or something,still raditz is too fast for yusuke.

Go to ch 150 in the manga and read it. It shows the entire fight. then read the fight raditz and Goku and compare. I gurantee yusuke is better.

cnorwood
11-14-2010, 05:59 PM
yusuke wins this but it will be a good fight

Miles Edgeworth
11-14-2010, 08:12 PM
I thought Raditz multi-mountain busted, which is stronger than anything Yusuke ever showed.

I'm pretty sure Raditz is faster too, not necessarily by enough to blitz but his feats were more impressive from what I recall.

I would say Raditz takes it with some difficulty.

cnorwood
11-14-2010, 09:54 PM
I thought Raditz multi-mountain busted, which is stronger than anything Yusuke ever showed.

I'm pretty sure Raditz is faster too, not necessarily by enough to blitz but his feats were more impressive from what I recall.

I would say Raditz takes it with some difficulty.
yea raditz blew up like 5 or 6 mountains with that casual blast, one of those might end yusuke

Miles Edgeworth
11-14-2010, 10:55 PM
They probably would.

Imo, a more interesting match would be Raditz vs Yomi or Raizen.

Devil's Lawyer
11-14-2010, 11:10 PM
Not quite sure the battle goes to raditz yet. A couple of reasons why Yuske wasn't that far behind powers department or speed. Also there is a blatant weakness raditz has. Can anybody take a guess to what that is?

cnorwood
11-15-2010, 01:41 AM
Not quite sure the battle goes to raditz yet. A couple of reasons why Yuske wasn't that far behind powers department or speed. Also there is a blatant weakness raditz has. Can anybody take a guess to what that is?
his tail ko'd krillin so you have to be pretty strong to weaken it, raditz can cut it off at any point, thats why goku didnt grab his tail the second time, and its not like yusuke is going to know his weakness. try again

SimpleGenin
11-15-2010, 04:11 AM
One of Yusuke's most impressive feats was when he beat 40-50 A to S class demons in a second. S class demons are about as strong as Sensui. Sensui is a casual mountain buster. Yusuke also has the ability to heal due to Genkai's spirit wave orb. Raditz was one of the minor antagonist thus having less feats then someone like Yusuke who's the main protagonist. By feats, I give this to Yusuke but by manga logic, I'm leaning more on raditz. There is just too much behind the whole idea of a saiyan. Yuyu Hakusho seems a little more fragile then Dbz characters.

Yusuke's dad in his prime could probibly piss on Raditz any day. Just saying.

cnorwood
11-15-2010, 04:56 AM
One of Yusuke's most impressive feats was when he beat 40-50 A to S class demons in a second. S class demons are about as strong as Sensui. Sensui is a casual mountain buster. Yusuke also has the ability to heal due to Genkai's spirit wave orb. Raditz was one of the minor antagonist thus having less feats then someone like Yusuke who's the main protagonist. By feats, I give this to Yusuke but by manga logic, I'm leaning more on raditz. There is just too much behind the whole idea of a saiyan. Yuyu Hakusho seems a little more fragile then Dbz characters.

Yusuke's dad in his prime could probibly piss on Raditz any day. Just saying.
-raditz busted 5 or 6 mountains with a casual blast, thats a better feat than yusuke has ever shown.
-and with raizen, your using baseless hype filled powerscaling, we have never seen raditz full potential, but handling post 23rd budokai goku and piccolo like children is pretty huge
-and i might be wrong but the 50-60 sclass demon thing was just in the anime i think

SimpleGenin
11-15-2010, 06:26 AM
-raditz busted 5 or 6 mountains with a casual blast, thats a better feat than yusuke has ever shown.
-and with raizen, your using baseless hype filled powerscaling, we have never seen raditz full potential, but handling post 23rd budokai goku and piccolo like children is pretty huge
-and i might be wrong but the 50-60 sclass demon thing was just in the anime i think

With multiverse, I find it kinda important to powerscalr. If we don't things would be out of wack. Raditz showed some pretty impressive feats that krillen in the frieza saga never accomplished. That's because of the inconsistancy of the manga. If we compared the feats shown by Frieza and by andriod 19, it's obvious that Frieza showed much more impressive feats but it doesn't mean that Frieza is stronger. This is where the manga logic and power scaling comes in.

Raizen was hit point blank with a full powered spirit gun and it did nothing to him. Remember that this happened when Raizen was pratically dying. Again that's where manga logic comes in. Raizen might have not shown much feats but it doesn't take away the fact that in his prime, he was the strongest of the three kings.

Miles mentioned something about Yomi vs Raditz being a good match but didn't Yusuke almost beat Yomi. The only reason Yomi won was because his son yelled and woke him up before collapsing. So logically, Yusuke is about ad strong as Yomi.

The preliminary match happened. It was when 50 something peple had to fight until one was standing to advance on in the contest.

By the time Yusuke beat Sensui, he was already a mutli mountain buster. Again using manga logic, Genkai being a C class fighter was capable of reducing a hill to rubbles. She then said "there was a time when that blast would have gone for miles." she was talking about the time she was at her prime with Toguro. Toguro was a B class fighter. Now using logic,

Genkai (B class) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Yusuke (S+)

Devil's Lawyer
11-15-2010, 08:45 AM
his tail ko'd krillin so you have to be pretty strong to weaken it, raditz can cut it off at any point, thats why goku didnt grab his tail the second time, and its not like yusuke is going to know his weakness. try again

Yusuke is an extremely dirty fighter reference the fact he tied his shirt to Sensui arm and beat the hell out of him. Yusuke would grab his tail for defnsive prurposes. Also Yusuke almost destroyed one of those floating Islands doing his fight with Yomi. That proves raditz isn't that far ahead of him in a fight. With his tail as a weakness he would lose.

cnorwood
11-15-2010, 12:35 PM
Yusuke is an extremely dirty fighter reference the fact he tied his shirt to Sensui arm and beat the hell out of him. Yusuke would grab his tail for defnsive prurposes. Also Yusuke almost destroyed one of those floating Islands doing his fight with Yomi. That proves raditz isn't that far ahead of him in a fight. With his tail as a weakness he would lose.
yusuke grabs his tail and raditz cuts it off, then what? raditz is above moon level durabilty so yusuke better have some sort of drilling attack like piccolo (and he doesnt)

Devil's Lawyer
11-15-2010, 12:51 PM
yusuke grabs his tail and raditz cuts it off, then what? raditz is above moon level durabilty so yusuke better have some sort of drilling attack like piccolo (and he doesnt)

Raditz is completely vulnerable when his tail is grabbed. Gohanwasnt a moon buster at the time but a mountain buster. Yusuke spirit gun almost destroyed a island with one shot during his fight with Yomi.

Nyruss
11-15-2010, 01:52 PM
Sensui was not S-class level. No way no how.

SimpleGenin
11-15-2010, 02:03 PM
Sensui was an S class fighter and that was mentioned many times. It was mentioned by Hiei, Kurama, Koenma, King Enma's special force and Sensui himself. It was because of his sacred energy.

Nyruss
11-15-2010, 02:20 PM
That must be why Raizen casually wiped the floor with him without even trying despite being nearly dead. :notrust

Devil's Lawyer
11-15-2010, 02:23 PM
That little bald head monk in raizen army was S class and Raizen would have droppped him. S class is just a power rank.

SimpleGenin
11-15-2010, 02:50 PM
Raizen was S class even when he was dying. It was actually Raizen who beat sensui. That was confirmed by Yusuke himself. Most of the fighters by the last season were S class. But with that said, there are sub division. S- mid S class and S+. most fighters were S+. Raizen's friends were all S+. So a fight between Two S+ fighters is kinda hard to determine

cnorwood
11-15-2010, 03:07 PM
Raditz is completely vulnerable when his tail is grabbed. Gohanwasnt a moon buster at the time but a mountain buster. Yusuke spirit gun almost destroyed a island with one shot during his fight with Yomi.
i see your forgetting that piccolo busted the moon with a casual blast the same night he fought raditz, and a similar blast had no effect on raditz

deidara330
11-15-2010, 03:09 PM
Actually, about Sensui's S-Class ranking, it was stated that the actual power levels of demons range vastly from the Spirit World's ranking. In that regard, Shusui could be S-Class and still be stomped easily by another S-Class.

Devil's Lawyer
11-15-2010, 03:20 PM
i see your forgetting that piccolo busted the moon with a casual blast the same night he fought raditz, and a similar blast had no effect on raditz

Not forgetting it was the same move that killed raditz. But you are forgetting when gohan hit raditz with his attack. The same attack which busted a mountain. Raditz was hurt by it. It was the only reason they were allowed to get to raditz tail. The moon buster was just over the top.

Miles Edgeworth
11-15-2010, 06:16 PM
Not quite sure the battle goes to raditz yet. A couple of reasons why Yuske wasn't that far behind powers department or speed. Also there is a blatant weakness raditz has. Can anybody take a guess to what that is?

Raditz has better power showings than Yusuke and I'm pretty sure he's faster.

Hard to utilize a weakness you don't know of.

One of Yusuke's most impressive feats was when he beat 40-50 A to S class demons in a second. S class demons are about as strong as Sensui. Sensui is a casual mountain buster. Yusuke also has the ability to heal due to Genkai's spirit wave orb. Raditz was one of the minor antagonist thus having less feats then someone like Yusuke who's the main protagonist. By feats, I give this to Yusuke but by manga logic, I'm leaning more on raditz. There is just too much behind the whole idea of a saiyan. Yuyu Hakusho seems a little more fragile then Dbz characters.

Yusuke's dad in his prime could probibly piss on Raditz any day. Just saying.

Sensui didn't "casually" mountain bust. It took his strongest form to mountain bust, he never came close outside of it.

Even Raditz's poor amount of feats are superior than what Yusuke has shown.

With multiverse, I find it kinda important to powerscalr. If we don't things would be out of wack. Raditz showed some pretty impressive feats that krillen in the frieza saga never accomplished. That's because of the inconsistancy of the manga. If we compared the feats shown by Frieza and by andriod 19, it's obvious that Frieza showed much more impressive feats but it doesn't mean that Frieza is stronger. This is where the manga logic and power scaling comes in.

Raizen was hit point blank with a full powered spirit gun and it did nothing to him. Remember that this happened when Raizen was pratically dying. Again that's where manga logic comes in. Raizen might have not shown much feats but it doesn't take away the fact that in his prime, he was the strongest of the three kings.

Miles mentioned something about Yomi vs Raditz being a good match but didn't Yusuke almost beat Yomi. The only reason Yomi won was because his son yelled and woke him up before collapsing. So logically, Yusuke is about ad strong as Yomi.

The preliminary match happened. It was when 50 something peple had to fight until one was standing to advance on in the contest.

By the time Yusuke beat Sensui, he was already a mutli mountain buster. Again using manga logic, Genkai being a C class fighter was capable of reducing a hill to rubbles. She then said "there was a time when that blast would have gone for miles." she was talking about the time she was at her prime with Toguro. Toguro was a B class fighter. Now using logic,

Genkai (B class) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Yusuke (S+)

Yomi winning by a hair was only depicted in the anime. None of that was shown in the manga, all we know is that Yomi beat Yusuke.

Prove Yusuke ws a multi-mountain buster after beating Sensui. He was a large hill buster if anything, not a "multi mountain" buster.

I thought Genkai busted a large boulder, not a hill. If anything, Genkai at her strongest was like a city block buster.

Yusuke is an extremely dirty fighter reference the fact he tied his shirt to Sensui arm and beat the hell out of him. Yusuke would grab his tail for defnsive prurposes. Also Yusuke almost destroyed one of those floating Islands doing his fight with Yomi. That proves raditz isn't that far ahead of him in a fight. With his tail as a weakness he would lose.

Again, how would he know to grab the tail? This is assuming he can even grab it in the first place.

Pretty sure that the nigh-island busting was anime only. If not, I need a chapter and page.

Devil's Lawyer
11-15-2010, 07:30 PM
Raditz has better power showings than Yusuke and I'm pretty sure he's faster.

Hard to utilize a weakness you don't know of.



Sensui didn't "casually" mountain bust. It took his strongest form to mountain bust, he never came close outside of it.

Even Raditz's poor amount of feats are superior than what Yusuke has shown.



Yomi winning by a hair was only depicted in the anime. None of that was shown in the manga, all we know is that Yomi beat Yusuke.

Prove Yusuke ws a multi-mountain buster after beating Sensui. He was a large hill buster if anything, not a "multi mountain" buster.

I thought Genkai busted a large boulder, not a hill. If anything, Genkai at her strongest was like a city block buster.



Again, how would he know to grab the tail? This is assuming he can even grab it in the first place.

Pretty sure that the nigh-island busting was anime only. If not, I need a chapter and page.

Speed is not that much of a difference unless you can prove they are really worlds apart. I don't see the difference. As I said before Yusuke is an extreme dirty fighter if it comes down to it he would pull his tail just to get leverage.

You are right the nigh island buster is anime only I just checked. But he still an mountain buster. That type of power is sufficient against Raditz. Reference Gohan attack to prove it.

I just realize something the manga sucks compared to the anime. They didn't even really show the yomi fight. Manga Yusuke sucks,

Miles Edgeworth
11-15-2010, 10:40 PM
Speed is not that much of a difference unless you can prove they are really worlds apart. I don't see the difference. As I said before Yusuke is an extreme dirty fighter if it comes down to it he would pull his tail just to get leverage.

You are right the nigh island buster is anime only I just checked. But he still an mountain buster. That type of power is sufficient against Raditz. Reference Gohan attack to prove it.

I just realize something the manga sucks compared to the anime. They didn't even really show the yomi fight. Manga Yusuke sucks,

Raditz blitzing the heck out of 23rd Budokai Goku and Piccolo is better than anything I've seen from Yusuke. Can't get exact speed calcs, but I don't recall Yusuke showing anything of extensive speed in terms of movement, mostly reactions. Also, Raditz is aware of his weakness, unless Yusuke were to have significant enough speed, Raditz would in no way give him a chance to grab the tail.

Problem is Spirit Gun is really conspicuous and isn't exactly instant, so Raditz could certainly dodge.

Indeed, I was pretty disappointed with the Demon World Tournament in the manga, most of it wasn't shown. The anime made it a lot more interesting. I don't watch nearly as much anime as I do manga anymore, but I liked the YYH anime a lot more than the manga.

SimpleGenin
11-16-2010, 12:24 AM
Actually, about Sensui's S-Class ranking, it was stated that the actual power levels of demons range vastly from the Spirit World's ranking. In that regard, Shusui could be S-Class and still be stomped easily by another S-Class.

in the anime it didn't say that at all. I know because I have all the episodes and I watch it almost daily. There was no body in the human world or spirit world that even came close to an S class. That was mentioned by one of the captain of the special defense force.

Yes Sensui can lose to another S- not because there's a difference between the ranking of the different world but because the gap between S- and S are big. But that's going by the anime.

In the fight with sensui, Yusuke was moving in a speed faster then what Raditz has shown. Devil is right. Yusuke's fight with Sensui can be compared to the fight of Goku and Vegeta. In the fight between Yusuke and Sensui, there energy was so strong that it destroyed the platue of the beheaded with them even trying to do so. Raditz never showed the ability to do that.

Ok Yes it was a boulder but it was fairly bigger then regular ones. Notice how the spirit gun continued even after impact. She is atleast a city block buster. Now logically the higher the rank the stronger the fighter. If Genkai busted a block, what can an S class do? Yes in this forum feats are what's important but manga logic is as important. It's necessary to get accurate results when deciding a fight.

Yusuke was able to knock out one of those psychics simply by the shock wave of his punch. Consider two things. He did this when he was about as strong as younger Toguro and that he was only using a mere fraction of his real energy.

Show me that Raditz is capable in moving the same phase as Yusuke in the fight with Sensui.

Yomi beat Yusuke but it was no rape. Yomi had a hard time. Either way, manga or anime, it means Yusuke us clods to Yomi's power level.

deidara330
11-16-2010, 03:26 PM
in the anime it didn't say that at all. I know because I have all the episodes and I watch it almost daily. There was no body in the human world or spirit world that even came close to an S class. That was mentioned by one of the captain of the special defense force. Actually, I believe it was stated that both Sensui and Yusuke were S-Class during their final battle. It should've been mentioned tons of times that Sensui was S-Class. I also have the entire anime collection of YYH and marathoned the series from start to finish this past Summer. I think that captain you're talking about actually said Yusuke was S-Class, and since Sensui and Yusuke were evenly matched, Sensui was also probably S-Class, even if it was never mentioned anyways.

SimpleGenin
11-16-2010, 04:26 PM
It was mentioned many times that Sensui was an S class. The captain explained to his crew that since the kakai barrier held back A class and S class from entering the spirit world and human world, they didnt have to know and worry about them. They were surprised that someone could be as powerful Sensui. To add, sacred energy gave Sensui a n S class power level.

Dudemeister - Raizen died an S class. So his power level was higher then Sensui even at his death bed.

Devil's Lawyer
11-16-2010, 04:46 PM
Class S is the highest rank even though Raizen could have stomp the majority of them he was still class S.

Raditz blitzing the heck out of 23rd Budokai Goku and Piccolo is better than anything I've seen from Yusuke. Can't get exact speed calcs, but I don't recall Yusuke showing anything of extensive speed in terms of movement, mostly reactions. Also, Raditz is aware of his weakness, unless Yusuke were to have significant enough speed, Raditz would in no way give him a chance to grab the tail.

Problem is Spirit Gun is really conspicuous and isn't exactly instant, so Raditz could certainly dodge.

Indeed, I was pretty disappointed with the Demon World Tournament in the manga, most of it wasn't shown. The anime made it a lot more interesting. I don't watch nearly as much anime as I do manga anymore, but I liked the YYH anime a lot more than the manga.

I don't know Yusuke power still seems stronger. Yusuke was busting mountains with his fist doing his fight with Sensui. Nobody in DB was doing that before Goku and Vegeta fought. Yes there ki blasts was that strong but not their punches. That definetly gives Yusuke an edge in the fight against Raditz.

cnorwood
11-16-2010, 05:40 PM
Class S is the highest rank even though Raizen could have stomp the majority of them he was still class S.



I don't know Yusuke power still seems stronger. Yusuke was busting mountains with his fist doing his fight with Sensui. Nobody in DB was doing that before Goku and Vegeta fought. Yes there ki blasts was that strong but not their punches. That definetly gives Yusuke an edge in the fight against Raditz.
what about the part where at the start of the fight raditz flies a few hundred feet in the air and starts raining mulit mountain busters on yusuke

Devil's Lawyer
11-16-2010, 05:43 PM
What about the part were Yusuke tanks mountain busting punches. The fact that Raditz isn't faster until proven. Also the fact that Raditz catches a shotgun from Yusuke to the face.

cnorwood
11-16-2010, 05:56 PM
What about the part were Yusuke tanks mountain busting punches. The fact that Raditz isn't faster until proven. Also the fact that Raditz catches a shotgun from Yusuke to the face.
raditz is eaisly over mach 14 and multi mountain=/= mountain, raditz fires off about 100 of those and yusuke is dead

Devil's Lawyer
11-16-2010, 06:00 PM
raditz is eaisly over mach 14 and multi mountain=/= mountain, raditz fires off about 100 of those and yusuke is dead

Since when has raditz hit mach 14 stop exagerating. Yusuke is every bit a match for Raditz. And he doesn't have a bs weakness like raditz with his tail. Which would get grabbed since that is how Yusuke fights.

SimpleGenin
11-16-2010, 07:36 PM
14 mach? Haha where do ppl get this random calculations? Haha

cnorwood
11-16-2010, 08:54 PM
wrong calc, hold on im tryin to find it

cnorwood
11-16-2010, 08:59 PM
14 mach? Haha where do ppl get this random calculations? Haha
its based off tao paipai's pillar feat, who raditz is wayyyyyy above, the calc is above

SimpleGenin
11-16-2010, 08:59 PM
This is so sad. Calculation in manga and anime are bs. It's just impossible no matter how good you think you might be in math.

cnorwood
11-16-2010, 09:08 PM
This is so sad. Calculation in manga and anime are bs. It's just impossible no matter how good you think you might be in math.
well then raditz is ftl based on the funi dub

SimpleGenin
11-16-2010, 09:25 PM
Again Yusuke was fighting faster then eye can see with Sensui. It was the time they turned the platue of the beheaded into a pile by the shockwaves of there movement not the impact itself.

And if were still talking about speed,look at what Yusuke did when Kuwabara was hurt by Toguro. Look at how fast he closed the distance between them. It wasn't even a sec

cnorwood
11-16-2010, 09:33 PM
Again Yusuke was fighting faster then eye can see with Sensui. It was the time they turned the platue of the beheaded into a pile by the shockwaves of there movement not the impact itself.

And if were still talking about speed,look at what Yusuke did when Kuwabara was hurt by Toguro. Look at how fast he closed the distance between them. It wasn't even a sec
a bullet is faster than the eye can see and can close a big distance in less than a sec, your speed statements arent impressing me, kid goku dissapeared infront of a Crowd of people, including a few casual bullet timers, and raditz leagues above him

Devil's Lawyer
11-16-2010, 10:10 PM
Still doesn't excuse the fact that Yusuke tanks mountain busting punches, Something raditz has never shown to be capable of. Speed Yusuke is way past casual bullet timer. Ever since he was dodging sensui sniper. But again Yusuke busts mountains with hi fist not just his energy.

cnorwood
11-16-2010, 10:17 PM
Still doesn't excuse the fact that Yusuke tanks mountain busting punches, Something raditz has never shown to be capable of. Speed Yusuke is way past casual bullet timer. Ever since he was dodging sensui sniper. But again Yusuke busts mountains with hi fist not just his energy.
how is yusuke going to reach raditz if he is 800 feet in the air

Devil's Lawyer
11-16-2010, 10:27 PM
Haha Yusuke can fly ever since the fight with Sensui. I told you to read ch 150. You know I didn't realize raditz couldn't bust mountains with his fist until this thread.

cnorwood
11-16-2010, 11:13 PM
Haha Yusuke can fly ever since the fight with Sensui. I told you to read ch 150. You know I didn't realize raditz couldn't bust mountains with his fist until this thread.
they were only flying in the anime IIRC, in the manga they were jumping and fighting, hence yusuke not flying to raizens castle he had to run for 3 days straight

Miles Edgeworth
11-16-2010, 11:45 PM
Still doesn't excuse the fact that Yusuke tanks mountain busting punches, Something raditz has never shown to be capable of. Speed Yusuke is way past casual bullet timer. Ever since he was dodging sensui sniper. But again Yusuke busts mountains with hi fist not just his energy.

Proof? Last I recall, Sensui never busted a mountain with just a punch. If anything it might have been a hill, big whoop.

Yusuke is past casual bullet timer but so is Raditz. Kid Goku solo'd the Red Ribbon Army and Raditz>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>him.

Last time I checked, Yusuke was having trouble against Hagiri and would've lost if not for Hiei's intervention. Not that he can't bullet time, but I had to point that out.

Again, I need proof that he mountain busts with his fist. Even if he does, there hasn't been any concrete proof that shows Yusuke is significantly faster so Raditz could easily just spam blasts if Yusuke tried to punch him, GG. Unless, of course, Yusuke suddenly has multi-mountain durability.

SimpleGenin
11-16-2010, 11:47 PM
a bullet is faster than the eye can see and can close a big distance in less than a sec, your speed statements arent impressing me, kid goku dissapeared infront of a Crowd of people, including a few casual bullet timers, and raditz leagues above him

Yusuke was moving faster then eye could see after Genkai's training. It was when Hiei tested Yusuke's power. Kuwabara described it as flashes of light. That was when Yusuke was only a low C class.

Devil's Lawyer
11-16-2010, 11:48 PM
Ch 150 pg 14 he was flying. Sensui was flying the whole chapter. Yusuke ran in both the anime and manga thats just part of the story.
Proof? Last I recall, Sensui never busted a mountain with just a punch. If anything it might have been a hill, big whoop.

Yusuke is past casual bullet timer but so is Raditz. Kid Goku solo'd the Red Ribbon Army and Raditz>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>him.

Last time I checked, Yusuke was having trouble against Hagiri and would've lost if not for Hiei's intervention. Not that he can't bullet time, but I had to point that out.

Again, I need proof that he mountain busts with his fist. Even if he does, there hasn't been any concrete proof that shows Yusuke is significantly faster so Raditz could easily just spam blasts if Yusuke tried to punch him, GG. Unless, of course, Yusuke suddenly has multi-mountain durability.

Its hard to tell in the manga but those were mountains he and Sensui were destroying in chapter 150. Those rock formations were as big as the one Gohan destroyed when piccolo threw him. They did that with their fists. Raditz has yet to show that type of power physically with no Ki.

I never said he was faster than Raditz I said they were in the same speed range. The thing about Yu Yu is their speeds jump drastically instead of gradually like Db.

cnorwood
11-17-2010, 12:31 AM
Proof? Last I recall, Sensui never busted a mountain with just a punch. If anything it might have been a hill, big whoop.

Yusuke is past casual bullet timer but so is Raditz. Kid Goku solo'd the Red Ribbon Army and Raditz>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>him.

Last time I checked, Yusuke was having trouble against Hagiri and would've lost if not for Hiei's intervention. Not that he can't bullet time, but I had to point that out.

Again, I need proof that he mountain busts with his fist. Even if he does, there hasn't been any concrete proof that shows Yusuke is significantly faster so Raditz could easily just spam blasts if Yusuke tried to punch him, GG. Unless, of course, Yusuke suddenly has multi-mountain durability.
this, plus remember kid goku was a multi machine gun bullet timer, and raditz>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>him

SimpleGenin
11-17-2010, 12:42 AM
Obviously the speed of the two is not too big. Both sides can find certain prof that proves there point. Now who could pack more punch?

cnorwood
11-17-2010, 12:48 AM
Obviously the speed of the two is not too big. Both sides can find certain prof that proves there point. Now who could pack more punch?
when has yusuke shown to multiple machine gun bullet timing speeds, or multiple multi mountain busting blasts

SimpleGenin
11-17-2010, 01:01 AM
What the hell. Just because someone hasn't shown something doesn't mean they aren't capable of doing it. Watch Yusuke's fight with Sensui and then tell me that he isn't capable of dodging machine guns.

Like I said, Show me prof that Raditz is capable of fighting in the same phase as Yusuke in his fight with Sensui.

cnorwood
11-17-2010, 01:06 AM
What the hell. Just because someone hasn't shown something doesn't mean they aren't capable of doing it. Watch Yusuke's fight with Sensui and then tell me that he isn't capable of dodging machine guns.

Like I said, Show me prof that Raditz is capable of fighting in the same phase as Yusuke in his fight with Sensui.
by casually busting 8-12 mountains with 2 casual blasts? blitzing post 23rd budokai goku and piccolo who are both above mach 14, flight. need i go on, raditz flies 200 feet in the air and throws 15 multi mountain busters, yusuke wont survive it

SimpleGenin
11-17-2010, 01:22 AM
Again you fail to show actual speed feats from Raditz himself. All you managed to do is list a bunch of power scaling theories. With some bs mach theory.

Yusuke was fast enough to move from several meters away to Toguro in an instant. Toguro himself didn't see this happen. Who are you to decide that Raditz actual speed feats is equal to that?

cnorwood
11-17-2010, 01:37 AM
Again you fail to show actual speed feats from Raditz himself. All you managed to do is list a bunch of power scaling theories. With some bs mach theory.

Yusuke was fast enough to move from several meters away to Toguro in an instant. Toguro himself didn't see this happen. Who are you to decide that Raditz actual speed feats is equal to that?
what you said about yusuke is the same thing a gun can do, raditz bullet timed with a shotgun, a bullet can move at 340 m/s that means at half a second it can move over a football field, and again raditz bullet timed, sooooooooooo

SimpleGenin
11-17-2010, 01:58 AM
Ok that proves Raditz reaction feats. Yusuke reacted to one too in the very beginning of the series but it doesn't mean Yusuke was as fast as Raditz at that moment.

And with the mountain busting capability, it really isn't as important as u make it seem. The spirit bomb that hit Vegeta was not a mountain buster yet it almost killed him. Vegeta >>>>>>> Raditz. That proves that mountain busting ability isn't that important. After all, a full powered spirit gun is not an attack that is made to bust cities. It's an attack that slams into the opponent causing heavy damage.

If you want more example, android 18 was hit with a blast that was no where near mountain busting capability yet it damaged her alot. This happened when she tried to confront 17 in GT. And I think you'll agree with me when I say 18 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Raditz

cnorwood
11-17-2010, 11:23 AM
Ok that proves Raditz reaction feats. Yusuke reacted to one too in the very beginning of the series but it doesn't mean Yusuke was as fast as Raditz at that moment.

And with the mountain busting capability, it really isn't as important as u make it seem. The spirit bomb that hit Vegeta was not a mountain buster yet it almost killed him. Vegeta >>>>>>> Raditz. That proves that mountain busting ability isn't that important. After all, a full powered spirit gun is not an attack that is made to bust cities. It's an attack that slams into the opponent causing heavy damage.

If you want more example, android 18 was hit with a blast that was no where near mountain busting capability yet it damaged her alot. This happened when she tried to confront 17 in GT. And I think you'll agree with me when I say 18 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Raditz
thye didnt bullet time but they aimed dodged, they said "its not hard to dodge when your pointing your guns", and the spirirt bomb isnt an attack, its an evil destroying attack so it doesnt need to be a mountain buster, and please dont use gt, besides not being cannon its so inconsistent with the story and some powers its not even funny

Devil's Lawyer
11-17-2010, 02:24 PM
Still haven't proved Raditz can handle multiple mountain busting hits. Thats the only way he wins this. No one in db had that type of power before Goku and Vegeta fights. Their Ki blasts were country busters and moon busters but not their fists.

SimpleGenin
11-17-2010, 03:09 PM
Ok was Jeice or Burter killed with a mountain buster or Racoome? Many many people died from a attacks less then a mountain buster. There are many many inconsistancy in Dbz. Who are you to decide that Gt has "too" many inconsistancy. that's like saying you know better then the creators of GT and Dbz. Heck there are tons of inconsistancy in Yuyu Hakusho aswell but you don't see me complaining.

Remember 18 was hit by a regular blast from cell and it damaged her more then the blast from Super Saiyen Vegeta. The blast from cell was similar to that of a spirit gun but smaller. If that could damage her, it could certainly damage a much much weaker opponent.

And if you remember sniper, Hiei was dodging the bullet pretty casually and that was when he was a B class. Keep in mind two things, Yusuke has no problem keeping up with Hiei and S class Yusuke is faster then the A class Hiei in the Sensui fight. Hiei admitted this himself.

Watch Yusuke's fight with Sensui and then tell me his incapable of beating Raditz. Raditz did not show the ability to fight like Yusuke. Raditz might have more mountain busting move but that alone can't winthe battle.

Another example is when Toguro punched the ground and created a big creator. Yusuke is many times stronger then Toguro so logically he can atleast do the same. Do you think Raditz can survive a punch from something that can cause a hole to the ground? He never showed the ability in doing so.

Miles Edgeworth
11-17-2010, 05:57 PM
Still haven't proved Raditz can handle multiple mountain busting hits. Thats the only way he wins this. No one in db had that type of power before Goku and Vegeta fights. Their Ki blasts were country busters and moon busters but not their fists.

I just read chapter 150, those are not mountains. If anything they are small mountains, Raditz casually busted multiple mountains with simple ki blasts. Look more like large hill level to me.

Whether or not their fists can bust mountains is irrelevant because Yusuke never showed more than mountain busting.

Ok was Jeice or Burter killed with a mountain buster or Racoome? Many many people died from a attacks less then a mountain buster. There are many many inconsistancy in Dbz. Who are you to decide that Gt has "too" many inconsistancy. that's like saying you know better then the creators of GT and Dbz. Heck there are tons of inconsistancy in Yuyu Hakusho aswell but you don't see me complaining.

Remember 18 was hit by a regular blast from cell and it damaged her more then the blast from Super Saiyen Vegeta. The blast from cell was similar to that of a spirit gun but smaller. If that could damage her, it could certainly damage a much much weaker opponent.

And if you remember sniper, Hiei was dodging the bullet pretty casually and that was when he was a B class. Keep in mind two things, Yusuke has no problem keeping up with Hiei and S class Yusuke is faster then the A class Hiei in the Sensui fight. Hiei admitted this himself.

Watch Yusuke's fight with Sensui and then tell me his incapable of beating Raditz. Raditz did not show the ability to fight like Yusuke. Raditz might have more mountain busting move but that alone can't winthe battle.

Another example is when Toguro punched the ground and created a big creator. Yusuke is many times stronger then Toguro so logically he can atleast do the same. Do you think Raditz can survive a punch from something that can cause a hole to the ground? He never showed the ability in doing so.

An attack doesn't have to be large scale to kill somebody. Someone may have extreme durability but die from, say, drowning, or a concentrated attack to a vital area.

GT's non canon. Plus the power inconsistency is the fact that even though SS4 is supposed to be really powerful, the feats are crappy and you wouldn't think of SS4 Goku as so strong if DBZ feats weren't around to begin with.

Except the difference between Cell and Yusuke is, so to speak, over 9000.

Even with Yusuke's speed, I still don't see how he's fast enough to outdo Raditz with the lack of power to compare. Through powerscaling Raditz can moon bust since Piccolo did it with a casual energy blast and Raditz curbstomped him. Heck, Raditz tanked one of Piccolo's energy blasts too and would've killed him if he didn't sense Goku.

I've seen Yusuke vs Sensui countless times, still don't see how he beats Raditz, especially with as much ease as you claim.

Through your logic, Sakura>Raditz since she can bust the ground with her punches. Also, Yusuke never showed more physical strength than Toguro from what I recall. More overall power certainly, but in the physical strength department I cannot think of a single thing that puts Yusuke above him.

Devil's Lawyer
11-17-2010, 08:06 PM
Again I bring up Gohans attack against raditz. That attack was at mountain busting or less. It severely hurt Raditz giving Goku a chance to Grab his tail. But that attack weakened him. Raditz cannot tank Yusuke blows. While Raditz has to powerup Yusuke rushes him.

cnorwood
11-17-2010, 08:13 PM
Again I bring up Gohans attack against raditz. That attack was at mountain busting or less. It severely hurt Raditz giving Goku a chance to Grab his tail. But that attack weakened him. Raditz cannot tank Yusuke blows. While Raditz has to powerup Yusuke rushes him.
gohan hit raditz and goku held him, he didnt grab his tail. in dragonball the higher you are in power in relation to the other person, the weaker attack you have to use (ie. how trunks killed king cold), roshi had a mountain buster, and raditz doesnt know ki control so he always is at full power so he doesnt need to power up. again raditz files a few feet in the air and spams 50 multi mountain busters

Miles Edgeworth
11-17-2010, 08:17 PM
Again I bring up Gohans attack against raditz. That attack was at mountain busting or less. It severely hurt Raditz giving Goku a chance to Grab his tail. But that attack weakened him. Raditz cannot tank Yusuke blows. While Raditz has to powerup Yusuke rushes him.

Gohan suddenly being able to own the crap out of Raditz like that was basically plot. Not only did Gohan randomly get a major power boost, but Raditz stood there doing nothing when he could easily have countered.

Goku grabbed Raditz around the arms because he knew Raditz could just remove his tail, he didn't grab the tail that time, that's why Goku got hit by Special Beam Cannon.

Raditz doesn't need to charge in order to deal out blows that overpower Yusuke. Yusuke has not shown amazing durability, Raditz could just overwhelm him with energy blasts and Yusuke would never get in close enough to actually deal good blows. Spirit Gun is no good if it never hits Raditz either.

What's keeping Raditz from flying into the air and charging his blast anyway? It's not like Yusuke can blitz him right away if he flies high enough to get some distance.

SimpleGenin
11-17-2010, 11:59 PM
@ Miles - If you watched the Sensui vs Yusuke fight then you should have seen that Yusuke is more then capable of killing Raditz. Raditz hasn't even shown the ability to fight in the same intensity as Yusuke. Basically it's up to the individual to decide who is stronger based on his or her views. I've watched Yuyu Hakusho and Dbz for years and by doing so I've basically memorized certain scenes that showed great feats from both anime. Yes Dbz showed more speed feats overall. It's because it actually started in the Dragonball and continued on to Dbz. But what's seen in Yuyu Hakusho is more then enough to be compared to the beginning of DBZ. You also contradict your self in some things. Yusuke not only showed greater strength feats then Toguro but his also a few classes above Toguro. Logically Yusuke can do whatever Toguro could do strength wise. 80% Toguro (B class) could create a creater with a punch why not Yusuke (S class). No doubt one of those punch can hurt Raditz pretty badly. And with speed, there are many instances in the beginning of the Yuyu Hakusho series where a character is said to be moving faster then eyes could see. Keep in mind that no one in the dark tournament are above B class. Logically Yusuke would have gotten much much faster when he reached S class. So in the end Raditz and Yusuke are not really that far from each other. You said it yourself, you don't need moon busting blast to kill. I'm betting one of Yusuke's spirit gun that was used on Sensui could definantly kill or atleast hurt him badly.

cnorwood
11-22-2010, 01:20 AM
sorry for the necro. but i just read the sensui saga again and yusuke never flew in the manga, and he has nothing that could take out raditz, 1 mountain range buster should do the job

SimpleGenin
11-22-2010, 01:26 AM
Haha I didn't think Yusuke was flying. He was merely in the air for an extended period of time. Saying that Yusuke can't do nothing against Raditz is bull in so many ways.

cnorwood
11-22-2010, 01:36 AM
Haha I didn't think Yusuke was flying. He was merely in the air for an extended period of time. Saying that Yusuke can't do nothing against Raditz is bull in so many ways.
well yea yusuke could grab his tail, but raditz would have to be sleeping or something has to be distracting him so much that he wouldnt pay attention to yusuke. but then again if yusuke grabs his tail, all raditz has to do is cut it off and fire a multi mountain buster in his face

SimpleGenin
11-22-2010, 01:49 AM
Haha your arguement ignores everything Yusuke has shown. Your arguement is short sided. You really must be a hardcore dbz fan haha typical. I won't even bother.

cnorwood
11-22-2010, 02:09 AM
Haha your arguement ignores everything Yusuke has shown. Your arguement is short sided. You really must be a hardcore dbz fan haha typical. I won't even bother.
what has yusuke shown that will hurt raditz? you obviously dont know what raditz can do and how strong he really is, he might be low tier in dbz but again he is really strong, i can name a number of characters that can solo dragonball but anyone from yu yu hakusho isnt getting past saiyan saga vegeta

Frost ninja
11-22-2010, 05:43 AM
1) Raditz can fly. Couldn't he just fly to upper-atmosphere levels and pew-pew... basically the entire world?

2) If yusuke grabs his tail, Raditz isn't going to cut it off. Namely because the pain is crippling. Bigger problem comes from "How will he know about the tail being a weakness?" Theres no prev knowledge.

3) If we are going by default then its bloodlusted 50 meters. Raditz pumps a mountian buster or just makes his own moon. I think Ape mode Raditz might over-power yusuke maybe possibly? idk honestly, just throwing things out.

4) Simplegenin, just hear cnorwood out more before you shoot him down as a fanboy. He states a pretty good case, and to be honest its all on who moves how fast. How fast is S class vs DB/DBZ type rankings? Inconsistancies in the series don't matter, as its been stated that they have effect.

18 was hurt more by a cell blast than a SSJ Vageta blast. Ok, thats dandy. Maybe it was a more concentrated blast i.e. like yamcha's spirit ball. Maybe it hit a particular area. Who knows?

As far as Jeice, Burter, and Racoome go... I don't honestly remember how Jeice died, Burter got his throat crushed in, and Racoome was basically on pwnt street anyways. Vegeta, barring Jeice, basically didn't even have to try to kill the two. The mountian buster was unnecessary.

As for punching the ground, who cares honestly? Tanking multiple mountian busters via a punch is next to nothing in DBZ where they casually throw each other through mountians for s**ts and giggles.

That said, Raditz likely wins. Random BL gohan headbutt only cracked his armor a small bit, and iirc the power level behind the hit was only like 300 less than the amount used for special beam cannon, which the single hit amounted to more than Raditz power level. The fact that a casual moon-busting type technique was necessary to kill Raditz (while he was held down for about 15 minutes of filler) makes me semi-confident in his tanking ability.

This, and he can fly. Yusuke can maybe jump really high, but Raditz can maintain the flight with next to no trouble. Mountian buster spam from on high. imo this is a win.

ShadowSanin
11-27-2010, 02:05 PM
:D Dude this is really a fair one. I like this thread. But i have to say raditz at the begining of DBZ versus Yusuke at the end no competition. Yusuke would Anihilate him he's really strong at the end of YYH.

J-Sun Tasogare
11-27-2010, 02:09 PM
1) Raditz can fly. Couldn't he just fly to upper-atmosphere levels and pew-pew... basically the entire world?

2) If yusuke grabs his tail, Raditz isn't going to cut it off. Namely because the pain is crippling. Bigger problem comes from "How will he know about the tail being a weakness?" Theres no prev knowledge.

3) If we are going by default then its bloodlusted 50 meters. Raditz pumps a mountian buster or just makes his own moon. I think Ape mode Raditz might over-power yusuke maybe possibly? idk honestly, just throwing things out.

4) Simplegenin, just hear cnorwood out more before you shoot him down as a fanboy. He states a pretty good case, and to be honest its all on who moves how fast. How fast is S class vs DB/DBZ type rankings? Inconsistancies in the series don't matter, as its been stated that they have effect.

18 was hurt more by a cell blast than a SSJ Vageta blast. Ok, thats dandy. Maybe it was a more concentrated blast i.e. like yamcha's spirit ball. Maybe it hit a particular area. Who knows?

As far as Jeice, Burter, and Racoome go... I don't honestly remember how Jeice died, Burter got his throat crushed in, and Racoome was basically on pwnt street anyways. Vegeta, barring Jeice, basically didn't even have to try to kill the two. The mountian buster was unnecessary.

As for punching the ground, who cares honestly? Tanking multiple mountian busters via a punch is next to nothing in DBZ where they casually throw each other through mountians for s**ts and giggles.

That said, Raditz likely wins. Random BL gohan headbutt only cracked his armor a small bit, and iirc the power level behind the hit was only like 300 less than the amount used for special beam cannon, which the single hit amounted to more than Raditz power level. The fact that a casual moon-busting type technique was necessary to kill Raditz (while he was held down for about 15 minutes of filler) makes me semi-confident in his tanking ability.

This, and he can fly. Yusuke can maybe jump really high, but Raditz can maintain the flight with next to no trouble. Mountian buster spam from on high. imo this is a win.
Raditz can't make his own moon, and if I recall never showed any mountain busting techniques.

Devil's Lawyer
11-27-2010, 02:14 PM
Though it may have been random or plot Gohan Headbutt was a mountain buster. That was proven a couple chapters later when Piccolo threw him at one. Did it not hurt Raditz? Thats my point Yusuke throws punches like that in the hundreds or more I beleive.

cnorwood
11-27-2010, 07:22 PM
and if I recall never showed any mountain busting techniques.
well thats because you never read dragonball
Though it may have been random or plot Gohan Headbutt was a mountain buster. That was proven a couple chapters later when Piccolo threw him at one. Did it not hurt Raditz? Thats my point Yusuke throws punches like that in the hundreds or more I beleive.
yusuke never threw a mountain busting punch in the manga, it took a culmination of them fighting to bust that mesa, and in dragonball the closer you are in powerlevel, the weaker the attacks you can use to hurt a character

Devil's Lawyer
11-27-2010, 07:27 PM
Thats why I don't like the amnga in the Anime it clearly shows Yusuke busting mountains with his fist. Anyways even if it was a culmination of them fighting. Goku and Raditz fight didn't even show half that type of power. Raditz energy blasts are higher but I still maintain Yusuke close in would dominate.

cnorwood
11-27-2010, 08:14 PM
Thats why I don't like the amnga in the Anime it clearly shows Yusuke busting mountains with his fist. Anyways even if it was a culmination of them fighting. Goku and Raditz fight didn't even show half that type of power. Raditz energy blasts are higher but I still maintain Yusuke close in would dominate.
the anime wanks their power clearly out of the orginal artists intentions, 1 mesa buster<<<<6 mountain

Devil's Lawyer
11-27-2010, 08:26 PM
I wouldn't call it wank I call it actually showing a fight. Yu Yu is one of the few anime that clearly is better than their manga counterpart. They don't fights don't show any real detail in the manga. But they did show him busting that rock formation.

cnorwood
11-27-2010, 08:32 PM
I wouldn't call it wank I call it actually showing a fight. Yu Yu is one of the few anime that clearly is better than their manga counterpart. They don't fights don't show any real detail in the manga. But they did show him busting that rock formation.
idk about that, i enjoyed the manga way better than the anime, the manga has a better stoy, and gets to the point without so much filler. in the manga they destroyed the mesa, but not with a single punch, it took a culmitation of them fighting. so yusuke doest throw mountain busting punches

Devil's Lawyer
11-27-2010, 08:40 PM
idk about that, i enjoyed the manga way better than the anime, the manga has a better stoy, and gets to the point without so much filler. in the manga they destroyed the mesa, but not with a single punch, it took a culmitation of them fighting. so yusuke doest throw mountain busting punches

The fighting was way more detailed in the anime. Manga the boss fighters like Toguro was getting trashed in like a sec with hardly anything shown. Anyways it took both Sensui and Yusuke a short time period to level it. So that feat still stands. He was mainly responsible because he was the on the attack mainly. Either mountain busting punches or mountain busting energy you pic. Also the energy used by Raizon to defeat Sensui was Yusuke power he was using.

cnorwood
11-27-2010, 09:07 PM
The fighting was way more detailed in the anime. Manga the boss fighters like Toguro was getting trashed in like a sec with hardly anything shown. Anyways it took both Sensui and Yusuke a short time period to level it. So that feat still stands. He was mainly responsible because he was the on the attack mainly. Either mountain busting punches or mountain busting energy you pic. Also the energy used by Raizon to defeat Sensui was Yusuke power he was using.
when you say mountain busting punches it sounds like your saying a single punch by yusuke will bust a mountain. but yes a culmination of punches will bust a mountain, but any dbz character raditz and above can do similar things

Donquixote Doflamingo
11-27-2010, 09:14 PM
Yusuke Speedblitz Finger blast GG Raditz

Devil's Lawyer
11-27-2010, 09:46 PM
when you say mountain busting punches it sounds like your saying a single punch by yusuke will bust a mountain. but yes a culmination of punches will bust a mountain, but any dbz character raditz and above can do similar things

No Raditz cannot they didn't all start showing that type of powers until after Raditz. Their energy attacks were on that level but not physical attacks. Yusuke energy punches could take out one of those mini mountains. You don't realize how many were getting destroyed by that fight. They were destroying that entire area. Raditz wasn't putting out that type of power. Only Vegeta and Goku took it to that level.