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geogreymon123
07-22-2010, 07:46 PM
Ok we all know that Mario and Sonic are game Legends. And ever since they both came out People decidied which 1 was better. And we shall know right now! Who will win Mario or Sonic! Who is better! HEre is some stuff Mario and Sonic can use to fight (no real fighting but a list of powerups that would help win)
Mario:
Mushroom
Superstar
Fireflower
Iceflower
Cloudmario
BooMario
RockMario
Yoshi
SuperMario
RacoonMario
DrillMario
Metal Mario

Sonic:
7chaos emralds
Master emrald
Wherehog Sonic
Sonic with Caliburn!
Sonic with Excalibur
Darkspine sonic
SOnic on his Hoverboard

SO WHO WILL WIN!

Twilit Lion (Leo)
07-22-2010, 08:03 PM
god this is debated on soooo much, but i always pick sonic

deidara330
07-22-2010, 08:23 PM
Shouldn't this be moved to the Battlegrounds?

And I don't play enough Mario and Sonic games to know who would win, but I'm just guessing that Sonic could speedblitz Mario with his super-speed.

sage mangekyo
07-22-2010, 08:34 PM
But Mario would fireblast him before he had the chance.

vampire Lycan
07-22-2010, 08:53 PM
lol mario would win. super star mario is all he needs. one touch and sonic is dead`

Twilit Lion (Leo)
07-22-2010, 08:58 PM
lol mario would win. super star mario is all he needs. one touch and sonic is dead`
2 words: Super Sonic

DSPR7
07-23-2010, 08:27 AM
Ok we all know that Mario and Sonic are game Legends. And ever since they both came out People decidied which 1 was better. And we shall know right now! Who will win Mario or Sonic! Who is better! HEre is some stuff Mario and Sonic can use to fight (no real fighting but a list of powerups that would help win)
Mario:
Mushroom
Superstar
Fireflower
Iceflower
Cloudmario
BooMario
RockMario
Yoshi
SuperMario
RacoonMario
DrillMario
Metal Mario

Sonic:
7chaos emralds
Master emrald
Wherehog Sonic
Sonic with Caliburn!
Sonic with Excalibur
Darkspine sonic
SOnic on his Hoverboard

SO WHO WILL WIN!

Mario takes this with little to no difficulty. Class 100+ strength, higher durability, and hypersonic+ reaction times means MArio wins even without items. Cloud Mario wouldn't be too useful, but Boo Mario is intangible, Racoon Mario can fly/hover, Rock Mario flattens him while they're both rollling, and Fire/Ice Mario is basically overkill. Sonic hasn't been shown to tank much more heat than Mario, and far less than Bowser, but Fireballs hurt the B man. Who has tanked supernovas, lava, and a star.

Sonic isn't fast enough to blitz and lacks the power to do any real damage. Werehog is more of a weakened version, in all honesty. Super Sonic is his best bet, but with these power ups Mario can avoid it easily. Intangibility, invincibility, hiding underground, etc etc etc...

Miles Edgeworth
07-23-2010, 05:21 PM
7 Chaos Emeralds? LOL Sonic blitzes with FTL speed.

Mario takes this with little to no difficulty. Class 100+ strength, higher durability, and hypersonic+ reaction times means MArio wins even without items. Cloud Mario wouldn't be too useful, but Boo Mario is intangible, Racoon Mario can fly/hover, Rock Mario flattens him while they're both rollling, and Fire/Ice Mario is basically overkill. Sonic hasn't been shown to tank much more heat than Mario, and far less than Bowser, but Fireballs hurt the B man. Who has tanked supernovas, lava, and a star.

Sonic isn't fast enough to blitz and lacks the power to do any real damage. Werehog is more of a weakened version, in all honesty. Super Sonic is his best bet, but with these power ups Mario can avoid it easily. Intangibility, invincibility, hiding underground, etc etc etc...

Little to no difficulty? How in the world is that so?

Class 100 strength is nothing if he can't hit Sonic.

Durability is good and all but Sonic's power along with all that speed backing him up would definitely overpower Mario.

Hypersonic+ speed is nothing against Super Sonic.

Boo Mario hasn't shown any attacks and becomes regular after hitting light or making contact with an enemy, and can only be intangible for a short period of time.

Rock Mario gets lol blitzed.

Super Sonic solo'd Chaos at his strongest, and Chaos was city busting, and through powerscaling was a life wiper. With help he also defeated the Finalhazard and Metal Overlord.

DSPR7
07-24-2010, 03:54 AM
7 Chaos Emeralds? LOL Sonic blitzes with FTL speed.



Little to no difficulty? How in the world is that so?

Class 100 strength is nothing if he can't hit Sonic.

Durability is good and all but Sonic's power along with all that speed backing him up would definitely overpower Mario.

Hypersonic+ speed is nothing against Super Sonic.

Boo Mario hasn't shown any attacks and becomes regular after hitting light or making contact with an enemy, and can only be intangible for a short period of time.

Rock Mario gets lol blitzed.

Super Sonic solo'd Chaos at his strongest, and Chaos was city busting, and through powerscaling was a life wiper. With help he also defeated the Finalhazard and Metal Overlord.

See Below.

Did you miss the part about "Hypersonic reaction time" Or how about "FTL reaction time"?

Sonic's power... lol at City Block Busting attacks against Mario. Who tanked a Black Hole, Sub Orbital Fall (after getting beaten up by Bowser), a Castle Busting Explosion, and a Big Bang. Nothing Sonic can do is hurting Mario.

How fast is Hypersonic? I heard he's FTL, but I'm gonna need to see proof of feat here. Most I've ever seen him do is move high Hypersonic at best.

Good thing I didn't say anything about attacks then, huh?

Not likely outside of Super Sonic. Rock Mario busts through giant crystals with ease, whereas Sonic busts through weak rock and the occasional piece of metal. Rock Mario vs Rolling Sonic=Hedgehog Pancake. The most Sonic can do is dodge.

And Mario with almost no power took down the Shadow Queen, who is definitely a city buster and could probably life wipe. And that's when Mario was fairly weak. Super Sonic is, at best, a Life Wiper. Mario tanking black holes and big bangs spits on that.

Mario may not be able to HURT Super Sonic, but all he has to do is wait. Super Sonic is horribly draining; as soon as Sonic comes out he's going to be an even easier fight. And this is assuming that Sonic uses Super right off the bat, because otherwise he dies.

I love Sonic fans. They don't go five replies into a debate before going "LOL Super Sonic". :/ No offense to you, Miles.

JD Uchiha
07-24-2010, 09:11 AM
The battle between Mario and Sonic will be a long one, but the winner of the battle will be Sonic. Sonic will win only becaues of the Master Emerald. The Master Emerald has the power over the Chaos Emeralds, thus giving more power to Super Sonic. This will allow Sonic to stay in Super form longer and gives him an extream power and speed boost. Mario would not stand a chance against that much power. If Sonic did not have the Master Emerald, then he will lose.

DSPR7
07-24-2010, 10:25 AM
The battle between Mario and Sonic will be a long one, but the winner of the battle will be Sonic. Sonic will win only becaues of the Master Emerald. The Master Emerald has the power over the Chaos Emeralds, thus giving more power to Super Sonic. This will allow Sonic to stay in Super form longer and gives him an extream power and speed boost. Mario would not stand a chance against that much power. If Sonic did not have the Master Emerald, then he will lose.

How does Super Sonic hurt Mario?

Mario tanked a black hole, a Big Bang, and thousands of other high end feats, including a dimension being erased from existence. He surives FTL travel and Class 100+ hits on a regular basis. He's duked it out with Multiverse+ threats and lived.

Sonic can glow and sparkle all he wants, you can't beat what you can't hurt. :/

Miles Edgeworth
07-24-2010, 10:27 AM
See Below.

Did you miss the part about "Hypersonic reaction time" Or how about "FTL reaction time"?

Sonic's power... lol at City Block Busting attacks against Mario. Who tanked a Black Hole, Sub Orbital Fall (after getting beaten up by Bowser), a Castle Busting Explosion, and a Big Bang. Nothing Sonic can do is hurting Mario.

How fast is Hypersonic? I heard he's FTL, but I'm gonna need to see proof of feat here. Most I've ever seen him do is move high Hypersonic at best.

Good thing I didn't say anything about attacks then, huh?

Not likely outside of Super Sonic. Rock Mario busts through giant crystals with ease, whereas Sonic busts through weak rock and the occasional piece of metal. Rock Mario vs Rolling Sonic=Hedgehog Pancake. The most Sonic can do is dodge.

And Mario with almost no power took down the Shadow Queen, who is definitely a city buster and could probably life wipe. And that's when Mario was fairly weak. Super Sonic is, at best, a Life Wiper. Mario tanking black holes and big bangs spits on that.

Mario may not be able to HURT Super Sonic, but all he has to do is wait. Super Sonic is horribly draining; as soon as Sonic comes out he's going to be an even easier fight. And this is assuming that Sonic uses Super right off the bat, because otherwise he dies.

I love Sonic fans. They don't go five replies into a debate before going "LOL Super Sonic". :/ No offense to you, Miles.

When in the world has Mario ever demonstrated FTL reaction time? Feats, now. Base Mario has in no way ever shown speed feats superior to Base Sonic, and especially not Super Sonic. Also, give me proof of these feats, for all we know you could just be listing some random things, and there are things like pseudo-black holes and the like, which pale in comparison to actual black holes.

Sonic has much more than city block busting if he was able to take out Final Form Chaos, Final Hazard, and Metal Overlord. Plus the fact that Final Form Chaos, who casually city busted, couldn't kill Super Sonic.

Rock Mario not only has difficulty turning, but also has very, VERY few speed feats. Yeah, the moment Sonic dodges Rock Mario's gonna have a lot of trouble trying to get back to Sonic. Also, do note that if it's Super Sonic we're talking about here, Rock Mario gets fodderized.

Feats please. And when in the world has Mario tanked black holes and big bangs?

So Sonic is just going to wait while Mario hopes for him to drain? Sonic is going to be attacking him, and FTL attacks are not going to be easy for Mario to tank.

So how exactly does Mario stomp when he has absolutely no way of reacting to Sonic and currently lacks the feats that his best versions may have?

How does Super Sonic hurt Mario?

Mario tanked a black hole, a Big Bang, and thousands of other high end feats, including a dimension being erased from existence. He surives FTL travel and Class 100+ hits on a regular basis. He's duked it out with Multiverse+ threats and lived.

Sonic can glow and sparkle all he wants, you can't beat what you can't hurt. :/

Now why don't you actually give proof of these things? For all we know Mario could have had PIS on his side, in no way can Mario possibly solo all of these things without some sort of help, Mario has never demonstrated that kind of power.

Kingsnoke
07-24-2010, 10:35 AM
To add to Miles' point, Base Sonic has also used Chaos Control. With a Fake Emerald. Mario can't lay a finger on Sonic. Any time he tried Sonic would warp.

Miles Edgeworth
07-24-2010, 10:36 AM
/Facepalm. Totally forgot about that, thanks for adding to that Kingsnoke.

Yeah, with Chaos Control, Sonic can stop time as well as warp. That really lowers Mario's chances of winning.

Sumaru
07-24-2010, 10:36 AM
Dude this is a NARUTO forum, so take your mario & sonic somewhere else.`#(`#(`#(

Kingsnoke
07-24-2010, 10:39 AM
Dude this is a NARUTO forum, so take your mario & sonic somewhere else.`#(`#(`#(

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/Kingsnoke/Naruto%20Forum/Battlegrounds.png
Read idiot. Any Fictional Character is allowed at the battlegrounds.

Akatsuki X
07-24-2010, 10:44 AM
Even with all his fancy feats, I don't see how Mario is going to beat sonic when Sonic freezes time.

Mario's only chance is invincability star, which he would not be able to use considering their speed difference.

Miles Edgeworth
07-24-2010, 10:52 AM
The star issue is a strange one.

Mario is supposedly invincible in that state, although he can still be killed by lava and by falling into the pits (although the latter is relatively unimportant because that doesn't apply here). Honestly I'd say Super Sonic is much more potent than lava. =P

Kingsnoke
07-24-2010, 10:54 AM
Sonic uses Chaos Control to warp Mario into the center of a Star.

Miles Edgeworth
07-24-2010, 10:55 AM
Or a simple solution, Sonic warps Mario out somewhere random and teleports back to the arena, Sonic wins by default via BFR.

Although that's a cheap tactic and Sonic has no need to resort to it, but options are options.

Akatsuki X
07-24-2010, 10:56 AM
Lava kills him because it's all encompassing.
It covers, and disintegrates his whole body.

Super Sonic may be fast, but unless he has any attacks to cover all of Mario's body, the star Mario could take him.

That is, if Mario can use invincibility before being horribly blitzed.

Miles Edgeworth
07-24-2010, 10:58 AM
I'm pretty sure that Mario just bounces off the lava so it doesn't really cover his body. Even in the original platformers, Mario touches it before bouncing up and completely falling in, so technically he already died before his whole body could be covered in it.

Akatsuki X
07-24-2010, 11:10 AM
I think were taking this much to seriously Miles,
for it being a videogame.

Kingsnoke
07-24-2010, 11:11 AM
I think were taking this much to seriously Miles,
for it being a videogame.

And taking a comic to seriously is different..?

Akatsuki X
07-24-2010, 11:13 AM
Yes, because it's far more difficult for a Comic to have haxed toon abilities without readers giving up on it.

Kingsnoke
07-24-2010, 11:14 AM
Yes, because it's far more difficult for a Comic to have haxed toon abilities without readers giving up on it.

*coughMANGEKYOUSHARINGANcough*

Miles Edgeworth
07-24-2010, 11:24 AM
I think were taking this much to seriously Miles,
for it being a videogame.

This is the BG, you gotta take everything seriously. :P

The BG is serious business......er, maybe not. Meh, I take it seriously. xD

Akatsuki X
07-24-2010, 11:31 AM
Sigh*

What I meant is that videogame verse's
especially platform games like Sonic and Mario are hard to debate because there are many versions of the games.

Any second the character's can gain some new hax ability, which you automatically expect to happen, considering that its a common occurrence in such games.

Now I'm not saying that doesn't happen in manga's too.
Its just when a character gets an insane new ability, often we don't even consider it canon in our debates because manga are more realistic then gameverse's, so it is less believable.

Miles Edgeworth
07-24-2010, 11:36 AM
Sigh*

What I meant is that videogame verse's
especially platform games like Sonic and Mario are hard to debate because there are many versions of the games.

Any second the character's can gain some new hax ability, which you automatically expect to happen, considering that its a common occurrence in such games.

Now I'm not saying that doesn't happen in manga's too.
Its just when a character gets an insane new ability, often we don't even consider it canon in our debates because manga are more realistic then gameverse's, so it is less believable.

There are indeed many versions of each character so it's hard to quantify. Video games are filled with inconsistencies and all sorts of random junk, so it's really hard to say. Generally current versions have to be used by default.

Video game debates are always problematic in some sort of way, it's hard to quantify feats and some games don't have enough cutscenes, so it's hard to judge whether something is an actual feat or if it's a game mechanic. This is why so many people find it hard to believe that, say, Sora can bullet time. I would provide feats if I could, but I'm way too lazy to watch every single blasted cutscene or fight in the game and I don't have time to play Kingdom Hearts and Kingdom Hearts 2 solely to debate.

Kingsnoke
07-24-2010, 11:39 AM
Ah but if you play Kingdom Hearts only to debate, we know you have a problem..

Miles Edgeworth
07-24-2010, 11:41 AM
Ah but if you play Kingdom Hearts only to debate, we know you have a problem..

Who said I did? I played KH LOOOOONGGGGGG before I ever got into this forum.

DSPR7
07-24-2010, 12:35 PM
When in the world has Mario ever demonstrated FTL reaction time? Feats, now. Base Mario has in no way ever shown speed feats superior to Base Sonic, and especially not Super Sonic. Also, give me proof of these feats, for all we know you could just be listing some random things, and there are things like pseudo-black holes and the like, which pale in comparison to actual black holes.

Sonic has much more than city block busting if he was able to take out Final Form Chaos, Final Hazard, and Metal Overlord. Plus the fact that Final Form Chaos, who casually city busted, couldn't kill Super Sonic.

Rock Mario not only has difficulty turning, but also has very, VERY few speed feats. Yeah, the moment Sonic dodges Rock Mario's gonna have a lot of trouble trying to get back to Sonic. Also, do note that if it's Super Sonic we're talking about here, Rock Mario gets fodderized.

Feats please. And when in the world has Mario tanked black holes and big bangs?

So Sonic is just going to wait while Mario hopes for him to drain? Sonic is going to be attacking him, and FTL attacks are not going to be easy for Mario to tank.

So how exactly does Mario stomp when he has absolutely no way of reacting to Sonic and currently lacks the feats that his best versions may have?



Now why don't you actually give proof of these things? For all we know Mario could have had PIS on his side, in no way can Mario possibly solo all of these things without some sort of help, Mario has never demonstrated that kind of power.

Didn't we JUST discuss this on a different forum? When Mario is flying between planets/galaxies in SMG, he not only reacts to the surrounding Star Bits, but also manages to land with ease and an acrobatic flip. And this black hole took out Rosalina's ship, which was FTL. Not to mention everything around it, which goes without saying. (see below for clip) And in Super Paper Mario, Mario was seen outrunning sound attacks. That, my dear sir, could possibly be Supersonic+. At the very least, Sonic.
(keep in mind, this guy is kind of bad at this game) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXeJavGTfts

Yes, in SUPER Sonic form. Who is far above Base Sonic. Who only has City Block busting attacks at best.

The moment Sonic dodges Mario gets out of Rock form. I'm pretty sure a guy smart enough to make a time machine realizes that he can't necessarily outmaneuver Sonic. :/ My scenario was, if they were rolling at each other, Rock Mario would win.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXGfjyPmCac Right there.

See above. Mario travels FTL routinely. Now give me feats for Super Sonic being FTL please. In the games I've played, he's barely High Hypersonic.

^^See above the above. I can also point out in Paper Mario, Mario survived a fall from Sub Orbital heights after getting beaten by Bowser with the Star Rod, then struck by magic lightning. He also survived a Universe being erased in Super Paper Mario (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbEQtHNWBBE&feature=related), a Castle Busting explosion in Super Mario World (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rw7Ezd75yg&feature=PlayList&p=BD038912F2451061&playnext=1&index=39), and has often faced giant monsters, without help, that are easily multi city block busters+.

Giant Bloopers
Giant Bowser(s)
Giant Thwomps
Giant Plants
Etc. And that's not counting the Dragons and such he fought in Thousand Year Door, where he didn't really need his partners help to fight them.

Sorry about the quality of some of those videos, I rushed to find them.

Miles Edgeworth
07-24-2010, 01:24 PM
Didn't we JUST discuss this on a different forum? When Mario is flying between planets/galaxies in SMG, he not only reacts to the surrounding Star Bits, but also manages to land with ease and an acrobatic flip. And this black hole took out Rosalina's ship, which was FTL. Not to mention everything around it, which goes without saying. (see below for clip) And in Super Paper Mario, Mario was seen outrunning sound attacks. That, my dear sir, could possibly be Supersonic+. At the very least, Sonic.
(keep in mind, this guy is kind of bad at this game) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXeJavGTfts

Yes, in SUPER Sonic form. Who is far above Base Sonic. Who only has City Block busting attacks at best.

The moment Sonic dodges Mario gets out of Rock form. I'm pretty sure a guy smart enough to make a time machine realizes that he can't necessarily outmaneuver Sonic. :/ My scenario was, if they were rolling at each other, Rock Mario would win.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXGfjyPmCac Right there.

See above. Mario travels FTL routinely. Now give me feats for Super Sonic being FTL please. In the games I've played, he's barely High Hypersonic.

^^See above the above. I can also point out in Paper Mario, Mario survived a fall from Sub Orbital heights after getting beaten by Bowser with the Star Rod, then struck by magic lightning. He also survived a Universe being erased in Super Paper Mario (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbEQtHNWBBE&feature=related), a Castle Busting explosion in Super Mario World (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rw7Ezd75yg&feature=PlayList&p=BD038912F2451061&playnext=1&index=39), and has often faced giant monsters, without help, that are easily multi city block busters+.

Giant Bloopers
Giant Bowser(s)
Giant Thwomps
Giant Plants
Etc. And that's not counting the Dragons and such he fought in Thousand Year Door, where he didn't really need his partners help to fight them.

Sorry about the quality of some of those videos, I rushed to find them.

Game mechanics. Also, that doesn't prove his reactions are FTL speed.

PIS. Peach was there too, do you claim that Peach can survive a black hole as well?

Sonic has the 7 chaos emeralds, he transforms into super form. GG Mario.

Mario may have more power than Base Sonic in rock form, but less speed and much less control over his movement.

The ending of SMG proved in no way that Mario could travel at FTL speed. At all.

As for Super Sonic being light speed, Base Sonic is able to use limited light speed movement with light speed dash. Base Sonic cannot constantly travel at light speed, but he can to a small extent. Super Sonic, in every way possible, is much, much faster than anything we have seen from Base Sonic and fighting with enemies such as the Finalhazard and Metal Overlord only proves Super Sonic's superiority in speed compared to his base form. Do note that I have not been updated on the newest Sonic games because a lot of them are crap, he may have better feats that I do not know of. Even if Super Sonic was not FTL, he is still leagues above Mario's speed and I have not been given any evidence that proves otherwise.

By surviving the fall, you mean took ages to wake up and failed to show any sort of high durability feat. He did survive, but the fact remains that he was utterly incapacitated for a long period of time.

As for the giant monsters, a lot of them get fodderized by Sonic. Even Base Sonic could probably take them out, I mean he could solo things like the Egg Golem from SA2B and with the help of Tails and Knuckles take out Eggman's robots like the Egg Albatross and the Egg Emperor.

EDIT: Just finished seeing those vids. Watched the SPM one, I can't say I really get much of it since I have never played SPM in my life, but how does that qualify as a universe buster? If the area they were in was a universe it was a pretty small one, and even then I can't say for sure that it qualifies as a durability feat since Mario was out cold anyway. If you're incapacitated in the BG you lose anyway, and it certainly didn't seem like a definitive universal durability feat.

As for tanking the castle explosion, it can count as a feat but I don't see how it changes things since all it shows is that Mario can tank a building buster, which he'd better be able to if he hopes to stand a chance against Sonic.

DSPR7
07-24-2010, 02:00 PM
Game mechanics. Also, that doesn't prove his reactions are FTL speed.

PIS. Peach was there too, do you claim that Peach can survive a black hole as well?

Sonic has the 7 chaos emeralds, he transforms into super form. GG Mario.

Mario may have more power than Base Sonic in rock form, but less speed and much less control over his movement.

The ending of SMG proved in no way that Mario could travel at FTL speed. At all.

As for Super Sonic being light speed, Base Sonic is able to use limited light speed movement with light speed dash. Base Sonic cannot constantly travel at light speed, but he can to a small extent. Super Sonic, in every way possible, is much, much faster than anything we have seen from Base Sonic and fighting with enemies such as the Finalhazard and Metal Overlord only proves Super Sonic's superiority in speed compared to his base form. Do note that I have not been updated on the newest Sonic games because a lot of them are crap, he may have better feats that I do not know of. Even if Super Sonic was not FTL, he is still leagues above Mario's speed and I have not been given any evidence that proves otherwise.

By surviving the fall, you mean took ages to wake up and failed to show any sort of high durability feat. He did survive, but the fact remains that he was utterly incapacitated for a long period of time.

As for the giant monsters, a lot of them get fodderized by Sonic. Even Base Sonic could probably take them out, I mean he could solo things like the Egg Golem from SA2B and with the help of Tails and Knuckles take out Eggman's robots like the Egg Albatross and the Egg Emperor.

EDIT: Just finished seeing those vids. Watched the SPM one, I can't say I really get much of it since I have never played SPM in my life, but how does that qualify as a universe buster? If the area they were in was a universe it was a pretty small one, and even then I can't say for sure that it qualifies as a durability feat since Mario was out cold anyway. If you're incapacitated in the BG you lose anyway, and it certainly didn't seem like a definitive universal durability feat.

As for tanking the castle explosion, it can count as a feat but I don't see how it changes things since all it shows is that Mario can tank a building buster, which he'd better be able to if he hopes to stand a chance against Sonic.

Bullcrap. Do you know how hard it is to land softly when moving at high speeds? Ask a gymnast about landing while falling from a short distance at HUMAN speeds. Flipping hard, and it definitely needs good reaction time.

Yep. She's one of the Seven Star Babies, along with DK, Mario, Luigi, Wario, and Yoshi. (I'm not sure if it's Daisy or Bowser who is the final one) She's been through a lot of what Mario has been anyway, so why not? She's a powerful magician, a dangerous fighter, and superhuman in almost every respect. Why shouldn't she survive? The only reason Bowser can kidnap her is because he is far more powerful, and she has routinely managed to weaken/outsmart him.

Funny enough, you have yet to prove how Super Sonic damage Mario at all. Black Hole/Big Bang>>>>>>>>>>>Super Sonic. Even if he IS FTL, which you have failed to prove.

Which was not my point at all, but whatever. If you insist on talking about speed and maneuverability while I was merely talking about power, go right ahead.

Sorry, I planned for that video to show the Warp Stars and his landing, but they were too long. My bad. :D Want me to find another one?

That ain't light speed, sorry. 1) It requires rings. 2) It's no where near powerful enough to actually be light speed. 3) If he can do that, why doesn't he just run into Eggman every game? Like, at the beginning. To quote C. Hook on a totally different forum. "Either it isn't lightspeed or Sonic is an idiot for not using it. Pick your poison." And I never said Mario was faster, just that his reaction time could concievably keep up with Sonic.

He just got the fudge kicked out of him by Bowser wielding the power of a Multiverse threat level magical staff. He was knocked out before that, in other words. The feat was, he woke up in a fairly short amount of time, with no visible damage, and Eldstar mentioned his wounds were MINOR. And within a few more minutes of waking up, he fell again, this time off a considerably high cliff. And had no damage taken. Now, you were saying. :/

Most of them get fodderized by Mario too. But the Giant Blooper beats him, Bowser rapes him, and the dragons could presumably destroy him from the air. Shadow Queen rapes him, Cortez destroys him utterly, and Fracktail eliminates him 55% of the time.

No offense, but are you stupid? Do you assume that only what you see is all that exists within a universe? Since I've only played level one of Sonic 1, does that mean that Sonic's universe consists only of Green Hill Zone? No. Because if it has a sky, a sun, and a background, we can assume there is more to the universe. A sun indicates stars, which indicates various other celestial bodies. Also note, many of the Sammer Guy's names mention things like Stars. If it weren't for the fact that you haven't played the game, I would be much more upset about this little comment. Could Sonic have even survived it? I think not. That's all I'm saying.

That Castle is a heck of a lot bigger than a building. That Castle is easily the size of a few city blocks, probably more. It's also as strength feat, as he beat the living crap out of several of those castles bare handed.

FlyingThunderGod
07-24-2010, 02:05 PM
Mario will just get his Kart and use bullet Ben... plain and simple

Miles Edgeworth
07-24-2010, 02:19 PM
Bullcrap. Do you know how hard it is to land softly when moving at high speeds? Ask a gymnast about landing while falling from a short distance at HUMAN speeds. Flipping hard, and it definitely needs good reaction time.

Yep. She's one of the Seven Star Babies, along with DK, Mario, Luigi, Wario, and Yoshi. (I'm not sure if it's Daisy or Bowser who is the final one) She's been through a lot of what Mario has been anyway, so why not? She's a powerful magician, a dangerous fighter, and superhuman in almost every respect. Why shouldn't she survive? The only reason Bowser can kidnap her is because he is far more powerful, and she has routinely managed to weaken/outsmart him.

Funny enough, you have yet to prove how Super Sonic damage Mario at all. Black Hole/Big Bang>>>>>>>>>>>Super Sonic. Even if he IS FTL, which you have failed to prove.

Which was not my point at all, but whatever. If you insist on talking about speed and maneuverability while I was merely talking about power, go right ahead.

Sorry, I planned for that video to show the Warp Stars and his landing, but they were too long. My bad. :D Want me to find another one?

That ain't light speed, sorry. 1) It requires rings. 2) It's no where near powerful enough to actually be light speed. 3) If he can do that, why doesn't he just run into Eggman every game? Like, at the beginning. To quote C. Hook on a totally different forum. "Either it isn't lightspeed or Sonic is an idiot for not using it. Pick your poison." And I never said Mario was faster, just that his reaction time could concievably keep up with Sonic.

He just got the fudge kicked out of him by Bowser wielding the power of a Multiverse threat level magical staff. He was knocked out before that, in other words. The feat was, he woke up in a fairly short amount of time, with no visible damage, and Eldstar mentioned his wounds were MINOR. And within a few more minutes of waking up, he fell again, this time off a considerably high cliff. And had no damage taken. Now, you were saying. :/

Most of them get fodderized by Mario too. But the Giant Blooper beats him, Bowser rapes him, and the dragons could presumably destroy him from the air. Shadow Queen rapes him, Cortez destroys him utterly, and Fracktail eliminates him 55% of the time.

No offense, but are you stupid? Do you assume that only what you see is all that exists within a universe? Since I've only played level one of Sonic 1, does that mean that Sonic's universe consists only of Green Hill Zone? No. Because if it has a sky, a sun, and a background, we can assume there is more to the universe. A sun indicates stars, which indicates various other celestial bodies. Also note, many of the Sammer Guy's names mention things like Stars. If it weren't for the fact that you haven't played the game, I would be much more upset about this little comment. Could Sonic have even survived it? I think not. That's all I'm saying.

That Castle is a heck of a lot bigger than a building. That Castle is easily the size of a few city blocks, probably more. It's also as strength feat, as he beat the living crap out of several of those castles bare handed.

We're talking about fiction here. And again, game mechanics.

So PIS aside, when in the world have Mario or Peach truly tanked anything of universal level?

And you have never proved Mario has "tanked" these black holes or big bangs, all you have done is shown game mechanics and PIS events to try and prove your point. Also, you haven't given any more proof as to how in the world Mario has FTL reactions, so your argument is moot because you have proven absolutely nothing.

Super Sonic's power>>>>>>>>>>>>>Rock Mario.

He can't do that because it would be massively broken, and if you read my post in actuality you would have noticed that I said it was limited. Very limited, but nonetheless better than anything from Mario. Also, just because you deny its speed doesn't mean it isn't that fast.

Prove the Star Rod is multiversal, it has never demonstrated that level of power. Also, you do realize that surviving a fall off a cliff is not an impressive feat, right? Shadow fell from outer space into Earth, he still survived. Sonic and Shadow are basically equals, so this whole blabber about Mario having such exceptional durability is meaningless.

I'd like to see how in the world the Giant Blooper can possibly defeat Sonic, who has solo'd much more menacing enemies than that thing on a daily basis.

Now can you actually prove something without insulting me? Do note that I could easily infract you, but I'm in a good mood today, so I suggest you don't push it.

You fail to prove that is a universe, and unless you can actually give evidence of this I fail to see how that is a durability feat on Mario's part.

A few city blocks? Those castles are small city blocks at best.

Impressive strength won't help with a guy he cannot react to.

DSPR7
07-24-2010, 02:41 PM
We're talking about fiction here. And again, game mechanics.

So PIS aside, when in the world have Mario or Peach truly tanked anything of universal level?

And you have never proved Mario has "tanked" these black holes or big bangs, all you have done is shown game mechanics and PIS events to try and prove your point. Also, you haven't given any more proof as to how in the world Mario has FTL reactions, so your argument is moot because you have proven absolutely nothing.

Super Sonic's power>>>>>>>>>>>>>Rock Mario.

He can't do that because it would be massively broken, and if you read my post in actuality you would have noticed that I said it was limited. Very limited, but nonetheless better than anything from Mario. Also, just because you deny its speed doesn't mean it isn't that fast.

Prove the Star Rod is multiversal, it has never demonstrated that level of power. Also, you do realize that surviving a fall off a cliff is not an impressive feat, right? Shadow fell from outer space into Earth, he still survived. Sonic and Shadow are basically equals, so this whole blabber about Mario having such exceptional durability is meaningless.

I'd like to see how in the world the Giant Blooper can possibly defeat Sonic, who has solo'd much more menacing enemies than that thing on a daily basis.

Now can you actually prove something without insulting me? Do note that I could easily infract you, but I'm in a good mood today, so I suggest you don't push it.

You fail to prove that is a universe, and unless you can actually give evidence of this I fail to see how that is a durability feat on Mario's part.

A few city blocks? Those castles are small city blocks at best.

Impressive strength won't help with a guy he cannot react to.

What's your point. Now prove that. :/ How is it up to YOU to decide game mechanics? Perhaps Shadow's fall was PIS and the light speed dash was a game mechanic. If it's shown, it's a feat, unless it's something totally ridiculously idiotic or random. Something Toon Forcish, like Mario's shape shifting in Super Mario RPG. What was shown was clearly relevant.

Super Paper Mario, Super Mario Galaxy. I believe I have already said that.

So Mario flying into a Black Hole that was then reversed into a Big Bang, and surviving, is nothing? So Shadow surviving that fall you mentioned is PIS now, is it? Mario is flying face first at a planet at FTL speeds. When he is about to land, he flips and lands in a gymnastic fashion. He can also gather Star Bits while flying at FTL speeds. You have to react to do those things. Unless you want to call those game mechanics or PIS too. He also survives impact with giant crystals and such at that speeds, as a note of interest.

Which is, awesomely enough, not the issue here. Yay irrelevancy! :D

Well no duh, Sonic's known for his speed. That's a given. I never said Mario could match Sonic's movement speed. :/ So your argument is, it's a game mechanic. Wow, look at that...

It can grant any wish, it's at least Multiversal. Just because plot didn't let Bowser take over means nothing except there would have been no game if he did. And I never said it was. It's impressive that Mario got beat up by Bowser w/Star Rod, hit by lightning, fell from sub orbital heights, woke up, and proceeded to casually fall from that height with no damage in a decently short period of time that's impressive. Shadow is an android who is widely considered superior to Sonic. BY YOUR OWN TIER LIST. And that's clearly PIS, btw. -_-*

Giant Blooper is underwater. Sonic can't swim. It was a joke, lighten up. Sheesh...

I believe I did. Right in that post. Read the whole thing, not just the insult. 1) The Sammer Guy's have names that include the word "star". That indicates other celestials. This logically indicates galaxies, which indicates a Universe, blah blah blah. You get it. And even if it isn't a Universe/Galaxy (it is) then it is at least a planet. Which makes the Chaos Heart a Planet Buster at it's lowest estimate. Which is higher than Base Sonic's durability.

Some of them are several thousand feet long, filled with water, dungeons, and monsters. We don't even see most of the higher levels of them. Far bigger than a few city blocks.

He can most definitely react to Base Sonic, and since you have yet to prove if Super Sonic is FTL, I'm afraid he can react to him as well. See higher up.

Miles Edgeworth
07-24-2010, 02:56 PM
What's your point. Now prove that. :/ How is it up to YOU to decide game mechanics? Perhaps Shadow's fall was PIS and the light speed dash was a game mechanic. If it's shown, it's a feat, unless it's something totally ridiculously idiotic or random. Something Toon Forcish, like Mario's shape shifting in Super Mario RPG. What was shown was clearly relevant.

Super Paper Mario, Super Mario Galaxy. I believe I have already said that.

So Mario flying into a Black Hole that was then reversed into a Big Bang, and surviving, is nothing? So Shadow surviving that fall you mentioned is PIS now, is it? Mario is flying face first at a planet at FTL speeds. When he is about to land, he flips and lands in a gymnastic fashion. He can also gather Star Bits while flying at FTL speeds. You have to react to do those things. Unless you want to call those game mechanics or PIS too. He also survives impact with giant crystals and such at that speeds, as a note of interest.

Which is, awesomely enough, not the issue here. Yay irrelevancy! :D

Well no duh, Sonic's known for his speed. That's a given. I never said Mario could match Sonic's movement speed. :/ So your argument is, it's a game mechanic. Wow, look at that...

It can grant any wish, it's at least Multiversal. Just because plot didn't let Bowser take over means nothing except there would have been no game if he did. And I never said it was. It's impressive that Mario got beat up by Bowser w/Star Rod, hit by lightning, fell from sub orbital heights, woke up, and proceeded to casually fall from that height with no damage in a decently short period of time that's impressive. Shadow is an android who is widely considered superior to Sonic. BY YOUR OWN TIER LIST. And that's clearly PIS, btw. -_-*

Giant Blooper is underwater. Sonic can't swim. It was a joke, lighten up. Sheesh...

I believe I did. Right in that post. Read the whole thing, not just the insult. 1) The Sammer Guy's have names that include the word "star". That indicates other celestials. This logically indicates galaxies, which indicates a Universe, blah blah blah. You get it. And even if it isn't a Universe/Galaxy (it is) then it is at least a planet. Which makes the Chaos Heart a Planet Buster at it's lowest estimate. Which is higher than Base Sonic's durability.

Some of them are several thousand feet long, filled with water, dungeons, and monsters. We don't even see most of the higher levels of them. Far bigger than a few city blocks.

He can most definitely react to Base Sonic, and since you have yet to prove if Super Sonic is FTL, I'm afraid he can react to him as well. See higher up.

So it's not a game mechanic because you don't believe it to be? Far as I'm concerned, Mario landing like that IS a game mechanic because it's required for the game to work and allows for the gameplay to be quick and convenient.

I could say Mario surviving the fall was PIS just as much as Shadow's surviving so that argument goes nowhere.

Rosalina saved Mario from it, there is no way that Mario could have survived that on his own, Mario has never demonstrated such feats.

I like how you haven't proven that Mario is truly flying at FTL speeds. And the fact remains that those ARE game mechanics, no matter how much you try. Last I checked it was the cursor that collected the Star Bits, not Mario, do you see Mario grabbing them himself? I think not.

No limits fallacy. We can argue as much as we want about it, but there is no definitive proof that it is truly multiversal. Arguably, but that is conjecture and we can't say much more about it.

You do realize that tier list is completely outdated and that I haven't taken updates seriously in a year, right?

So how exactly do names prove that there is in fact a universe? I can't argue too much about it since I do not have the game, but you haven't proven to me that it was a universe, and that Mario's durability could at all have accounted in that event.

The whole Mario castle issue is weird, the exteriors are small, but the interiors are filled with things. I still don't see how they are truly multiple city blocks worth of size though, with some exceptions.

And what proof have you given of Mario's reaction feats? None. Super Sonic has shown speed feats that by far surpass anything Mario has reacted to, in multiple games. In no way can Mario keep up with or fight off the Final Hazard or Metal Overlord. Mario has never shown the power to defeat them, nor the speed feats to keep up.

Mario defeating monsters fails to compare to Super Sonic soloing Perfect Chaos, who basically has the equivalent to logia-intangibility and could casually destroy a city, with no effort whatsoever. Can most of Mario's opponents truly match up to that? Star Rod Bowser no doubt, but that's an entirely different matter.

DSPR7
07-24-2010, 03:39 PM
So it's not a game mechanic because you don't believe it to be? Far as I'm concerned, Mario landing like that IS a game mechanic because it's required for the game to work and allows for the gameplay to be quick and convenient.

I could say Mario surviving the fall was PIS just as much as Shadow's surviving so that argument goes nowhere.

Rosalina saved Mario from it, there is no way that Mario could have survived that on his own, Mario has never demonstrated such feats.

I like how you haven't proven that Mario is truly flying at FTL speeds. And the fact remains that those ARE game mechanics, no matter how much you try. Last I checked it was the cursor that collected the Star Bits, not Mario, do you see Mario grabbing them himself? I think not.

No limits fallacy. We can argue as much as we want about it, but there is no definitive proof that it is truly multiversal. Arguably, but that is conjecture and we can't say much more about it.

You do realize that tier list is completely outdated and that I haven't taken updates seriously in a year, right?

So how exactly do names prove that there is in fact a universe? I can't argue too much about it since I do not have the game, but you haven't proven to me that it was a universe, and that Mario's durability could at all have accounted in that event.

The whole Mario castle issue is weird, the exteriors are small, but the interiors are filled with things. I still don't see how they are truly multiple city blocks worth of size though, with some exceptions.

And what proof have you given of Mario's reaction feats? None. Super Sonic has shown speed feats that by far surpass anything Mario has reacted to, in multiple games. In no way can Mario keep up with or fight off the Final Hazard or Metal Overlord. Mario has never shown the power to defeat them, nor the speed feats to keep up.

Mario defeating monsters fails to compare to Super Sonic soloing Perfect Chaos, who basically has the equivalent to logia-intangibility and could casually destroy a city, with no effort whatsoever. Can most of Mario's opponents truly match up to that? Star Rod Bowser no doubt, but that's an entirely different matter.

No, but it's not a game mechanic because you want it to be either. It isn't required he land like that, you know. They could have done thousands of other things then that. But Mario IS a super athlete, so he IS capable of doing things like that, so they put it in.

-_-*

No she didn't. The Lumas reversed the black hole, then Rosalina appeared to him while he was knocked out. That be it, comrade.

He flies between galaxies from warp pads. Galaxies are, yep, light years apart. Even in the Mario world. In order to fly light years in a few seconds, you have to be going FTL. You also don't see Mario grabbing coins, Sonic grabbing rings, or Link grabbing rupees, but it happens, amirite? Just because they can't/don't animate something doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Since everyone says YOU, as in MARIO, has to collect/has collected star bits, we can assume that Mario collects them.

So instead of disproving it, you avoid the issue. Nice.

What's your point?

How the mother eating blood sucking chicken biter would a race of beings know about stars if STARS DID NOT EXIST WITHIN THEIR WORLD? And you can take it along the line of reasoning I've already listed. Stars=Galaxies=Universe. Logically.

You better be joking. I just read up on them, and they were crap! Sonic required help in both instances. In one, he was in super form WITH Shadow, in the other he had Knuckles and Tails with him. Wasn't Final Hazard incinerated in the atmosphere? That makes him lower than Shadow/Mario/etc in durability. That's pathetic. :/ You've done nothing in this post but wank Sonic, something I did not expect from you.

The thing is, the exteriors are small due to graphic limitations at the time. The NSMBWii game has small castles as a tribute to the old games. That's why it's so impressive.

In Super Mario Baseball, he reacts to Hypersonic speed baseballs. In Super Mario Galaxy, he reacts to landing. In the RPGs, he casually defends against/avoids/outruns sound based attacks. Proof enough, or do I have to go get videos for you?

Count Bleck, Dimentio, Shadow Queen, Bowser in several incarnations, The Dark Star/Dark Star X, Smithy, Elder Princess Shroob, Culex, Cackletta's Soul, Shrowser, Sir Grodus, Super Peach Castle, and Zombone. That enough? And you keep saying SUPER Sonic. What about Mario with HIS powers? You keep comparing Super Sonic to Base Mario, I don't think that's fair... and anyway, Mario didn't really get any good powerups in this fight. He's got four different ways to freeze time, among other things.

Miles Edgeworth
07-24-2010, 04:04 PM
No, but it's not a game mechanic because you want it to be either. It isn't required he land like that, you know. They could have done thousands of other things then that. But Mario IS a super athlete, so he IS capable of doing things like that, so they put it in.

-_-*

No she didn't. The Lumas reversed the black hole, then Rosalina appeared to him while he was knocked out. That be it, comrade.

He flies between galaxies from warp pads. Galaxies are, yep, light years apart. Even in the Mario world. In order to fly light years in a few seconds, you have to be going FTL. You also don't see Mario grabbing coins, Sonic grabbing rings, or Link grabbing rupees, but it happens, amirite? Just because they can't/don't animate something doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Since everyone says YOU, as in MARIO, has to collect/has collected star bits, we can assume that Mario collects them.

So instead of disproving it, you avoid the issue. Nice.

What's your point?

How the mother eating blood sucking chicken biter would a race of beings know about stars if STARS DID NOT EXIST WITHIN THEIR WORLD? And you can take it along the line of reasoning I've already listed. Stars=Galaxies=Universe. Logically.

You better be joking. I just read up on them, and they were crap! Sonic required help in both instances. In one, he was in super form WITH Shadow, in the other he had Knuckles and Tails with him. Wasn't Final Hazard incinerated in the atmosphere? That makes him lower than Shadow/Mario/etc in durability. That's pathetic. :/ You've done nothing in this post but wank Sonic, something I did not expect from you.

The thing is, the exteriors are small due to graphic limitations at the time. The NSMBWii game has small castles as a tribute to the old games. That's why it's so impressive.

In Super Mario Baseball, he reacts to Hypersonic speed baseballs. In Super Mario Galaxy, he reacts to landing. In the RPGs, he casually defends against/avoids/outruns sound based attacks. Proof enough, or do I have to go get videos for you?

Count Bleck, Dimentio, Shadow Queen, Bowser in several incarnations, The Dark Star/Dark Star X, Smithy, Elder Princess Shroob, Culex, Cackletta's Soul, Shrowser, Sir Grodus, Super Peach Castle, and Zombone. That enough? And you keep saying SUPER Sonic. What about Mario with HIS powers? You keep comparing Super Sonic to Base Mario, I don't think that's fair... and anyway, Mario didn't really get any good powerups in this fight. He's got four different ways to freeze time, among other things.

So because you find it convenient to, you count it as him landing because it's required for the game somehow meaning he has FTL reaction speed.

Well if the Lumas reversed it, then we can throw any sort of wank claiming Mario survived this black hole out of the window.

Never said Mario's travel with the launch stars wasn't FTL, but in no way does that mean his movement or reactions are FTL. Also, your analogy is simply wrong because touching the items and grabbing them is logical common sense in video games, in no way could Mario go "lol I'ma grab some star bits that I clearly can't reach" mid flight without game mechanics.

I like how you still haven't proven Mario to have FTL reactions yourself outside of game mechanics, which you can only deny by saying that I'm claiming something that is BLATANTLY a game mechanic not to be.

So knowing about stars means that they without a doubt exist? Stop avoiding the issue, you still haven't proven that it was a universe that was erased.

Except Super Sonic was able to solo Chaos, who as far as I can tell is >Metal Overlord via feats and the only thing restricting Super Sonic from soloing Finalhazard is time since the rings go away, otherwise he'd run out of it, and even then that's a game mechanic because that's the only way you can possibly die in that battle.

So you accuse me of wank when you can't disprove anything I've said? Is that your excuse when all you can do is wank Mario by saying he can tank big bangs and black holes when he never did those in the slightest? You say I'm wanking, but you keep on saying that Mario has FTL reactions and that he can tank universal attacks when he has never, EVER, done these things.

That doesn't prove how he can react to Super Sonic, maybe Base, but not Super.

ALL of the people you listed are significantly stronger than Mario alone. Mario needed help from Luigi, other partners, multiple items that he was not given for those fights, as well as some PIS to defeat pretty much all of those you listed. Mario gets none of those in this fight.

You don't think it's fair? Boohoo, go ask the OP to change it since he gave Mario such crap powers so that he had no way to actually stand a chance against Sonic in this fight. By giving Sonic all the chaos emeralds alone, he eliminated pretty much every chance of Mario winning this fight.

If Mario had some actual good powers in this fight, I would say he could win. It's just too bad he doesn't have them in this fight, so any wank to claim otherwise is completely worthless.

Kakuzu
07-24-2010, 05:17 PM
One item Mario should be able to use is his trusty hammer. I don't recall seeing that on the list.

Aww! Mario doesn't have any 1-ups or Stars!:lol: Mario turns into Metal Mario and becomes nearly invincible. Sonic proceeds to attack him in his normal form, but would not do much since he doesn't have much of any physical strength. If Sonic goes Super Sonic, he has a slight advantage in speed and strength, however, the Super Sonic form does NOT leave him invincible. Proof from Sonic Adventure 2 Battle and Sonic Heroes show that Sonic can still be stunned or in other words, still flinches when confronted with weapons, enemies, projectiles, etc. Time is also a factor for Super Sonic since he constantly needs rings to maintain his Super Sonic form. Since Sonic is on his own, there's nobody to collect rings for him (like Shadow in Adventure 2 Battle). Mario simply just needs to stall him and go in for the kill as Metal Mario. There's no need to have anything else. All he really needs is a Metal Cap, Hammer, and Mushrooms.

Heck, if worst comes to worst, sacrifice Yoshi.:lol:

All in all, speed is not everything and Mario takes a well-earned, close match-up victory for the Mushroom Kingdom.

Miles Edgeworth
07-24-2010, 08:15 PM
One item Mario should be able to use is his trusty hammer. I don't recall seeing that on the list.

Aww! Mario doesn't have any 1-ups or Stars!:lol: Mario turns into Metal Mario and becomes nearly invincible. Sonic proceeds to attack him in his normal form, but would not do much since he doesn't have much of any physical strength. If Sonic goes Super Sonic, he has a slight advantage in speed and strength, however, the Super Sonic form does NOT leave him invincible. Proof from Sonic Adventure 2 Battle and Sonic Heroes show that Sonic can still be stunned or in other words, still flinches when confronted with weapons, enemies, projectiles, etc. Time is also a factor for Super Sonic since he constantly needs rings to maintain his Super Sonic form. Since Sonic is on his own, there's nobody to collect rings for him (like Shadow in Adventure 2 Battle). Mario simply just needs to stall him and go in for the kill as Metal Mario. There's no need to have anything else. All he really needs is a Metal Cap, Hammer, and Mushrooms.

Heck, if worst comes to worst, sacrifice Yoshi.:lol:

All in all, speed is not everything and Mario takes a well-earned, close match-up victory for the Mushroom Kingdom.

The problem with Metal Mario is that he's very, very slow. Even with all of those other reaction feats, Metal Mario just doesn't have much speed, and even though he's powerful he's up against a huge speedster, even in base.

Sonic doesn't have much lifting strength, but Sonic can casually plow through cars and solo robots, so even though Mario has the strength advantage, it's not like he can tank everything Sonic has.

As for the ring issue, Super Sonic still has plenty of time and in most I've played Sonic games he tends to start out with around 50 or so. Dunno how he starts with 50 rings, or any for that matter, but that's how it is. This gives him ample time to take out Metal Mario, or really any Mario form that has been listed in this particular battle. Adding on the fact that Mario would have almost no way of hitting Super Sonic or distracting him enough to let the Super form run out.