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mrsticky005
04-29-2010, 09:58 PM
Onoki is the 3rd Tsuchikage and he fought Madara at one point.
The question is when did he fight Madara? I think he fought Madara
between the time Madara left Konoha and when Madara returned
to fight Hashirama. Onoki thought Madara was dead and probably
thought like everyone else that he died fighting against Hashirama.
If he fought afterward then Onoki who had been using Akatsuki
should have figured out Madara was the true leader. Since Kakuzu
had greatly damaged the Hidden Waterfall by killing it's elders before Kakuzu fled, Onoki probably saw that as an opportunity to annex it and make the Hidden Rock even stronger. Not only that but Onoki probably heard rumors that the Hidden Waterfall knew the secret of The Sage of The Six Paths. That secret, unbeknown to Onoki was the stone tablet. Madara fought and defeated Onoki who withdrew from battle thinking that the rumors were just rumors and if he had to fight Madara it wasn't worth it. The Hidden Waterfall considered Madara their hero and gave him the
secret stone tablet. Since the tablet can only be read using the Sharnigan,
Mangekyo, (maybe Eternal MS), and Rinnegan the Hidden Waterfall probably thought that the tablet was just an artifact or something.
Madara took the tablet and learned that he could use the MS to
control the Nine Tails. Madara returned to the village thinking he would
now be able to defeat Hashirama. Before doing so, Madara probably
went to the Nakano Shrine and left the tablet there just so Hashirama
wouldn't get if he was defeated by him.

zerosameri
04-29-2010, 11:52 PM
Onoki is the 3rd Tsuchikage and he fought Madara at one point.
The question is when did he fight Madara? I think he fought Madara
between the time Madara left Konoha and when Madara returned
to fight Hashirama. Onoki thought Madara was dead and probably
thought like everyone else that he died fighting against Hashirama.
If he fought afterward then Onoki who had been using Akatsuki
should have figured out Madara was the true leader. Since Kakuzu
had greatly damaged the Hidden Waterfall by killing it's elders before Kakuzu fled, Onoki probably saw that as an opportunity to annex it and make the Hidden Rock even stronger. Not only that but Onoki probably heard rumors that the Hidden Waterfall knew the secret of The Sage of The Six Paths. That secret, unbeknown to Onoki was the stone tablet. Madara fought and defeated Onoki who withdrew from battle thinking that the rumors were just rumors and if he had to fight Madara it wasn't worth it. The Hidden Waterfall considered Madara their hero and gave him the
secret stone tablet. Since the tablet can only be read using the Sharnigan,
Mangekyo, (maybe Eternal MS), and Rinnegan the Hidden Waterfall probably thought that the tablet was just an artifact or something.
Madara took the tablet and learned that he could use the MS to
control the Nine Tails. Madara returned to the village thinking he would
now be able to defeat Hashirama. Before doing so, Madara probably
went to the Nakano Shrine and left the tablet there just so Hashirama
wouldn't get if he was defeated by him.I really don't know how to spond to this. but one thing tho, the table never left the Leaf not even once, and it was a top secret thing that only a hand full of Uchiha's knew about.

mrsticky005
04-30-2010, 12:04 AM
I really don't know how to spond to this. but one thing tho, the table never left the Leaf not even once, and it was a top secret thing that only a hand full of Uchiha's knew about.

Well this isn't saying it left the leaf. It says that the origins are from
Hidden Waterfall. (Another guess would be Hidden Rain.)

Anywho, I think Madara learned the tablet's secrets during the time
he fled Konoha and before he returned to fight Hashirama---because
when he returned he had Nine Tails at his beck and call. If Madara
had Nine Tails the whole time then why go into exile? He could have
just fought Hashirama right there and then. I don't think Madara knew
he could control Nine Tails until he read that tablet.

Though something to ponder is Hashirama was said to have control
over the Tailed Beasts...yet Madara used Nine Tails against him. How?

I think Onoki vs Madara may have something to do with this.

zerosameri
04-30-2010, 12:18 AM
Well this isn't saying it left the leaf. It says that the origins are from
Hidden Waterfall. (Another guess would be Hidden Rain.)

Anywho, I think Madara learned the tablet's secrets during the time
he fled Konoha and before he returned to fight Hashirama---because
when he returned he had Nine Tails at his beck and call. If Madara
had Nine Tails the whole time then why go into exile? He could have
just fought Hashirama right there and then. I don't think Madara knew
he could control Nine Tails until he read that tablet.

Though something to ponder is Hashirama was said to have control
over the Tailed Beasts...yet Madara used Nine Tails against him. How?

I think Onoki vs Madara may have something to do with this.
But it origonated in Konaha, from Rikudo Sennin.

No it was befor that. When Madara was the leader of the uchiha clan he keept it top secret. So he knew about it befor the fight. He probaly did that so he could be ready and make sure he wont be found out/loses. But he probaly didn't have it right when he fought Hashirama, or he didn't want to use it; but rember even though he fough the 1st and was said to have died don't forget that the 3rd and the leaders knew that Madara was alive at the time and after he help Itachi he was said to have gone missing. And that that time he was pissded that his clan was all killed so he wanted to 'give thanks' to them by attacking them.

He problay didn't know how to controll it or he was training so he wouldn't losses controll of it.

I don't even know how he could possibly controll the Kyuubi if you really think about it. Because it's said that only the Sharinagan and controll it and well he didn't have it. Though maby they ment by sealing/surpressing it like Yamato does.
Madadara never used it against the 1st but Minato.

mrsticky005
04-30-2010, 12:33 AM
But it origonated in Konaha, from Rikudo Sennin.

No it was befor that. When Madara was the leader of the uchiha clan he keept it top secret. So he knew about it befor the fight. He probaly did that so he could be ready and make sure he wont be found out/loses. But he probaly didn't have it right when he fought Hashirama, or he didn't want to use it; but rember even though he fough the 1st and was said to have died don't forget that the 3rd and the leaders knew that Madara was alive at the time and after he help Itachi he was said to have gone missing. And that that time he was pissded that his clan was all killed so he wanted to 'give thanks' to them by attacking them.

He problay didn't know how to controll it or he was training so he wouldn't losses controll of it.

I don't even know how he could possibly controll the Kyuubi if you really think about it. Because it's said that only the Sharinagan and controll it and well he didn't have it. Though maby they ment by sealing/surpressing it like Yamato does.
Madadara never used it against the 1st but Minato.

You just MIGHT want to look at Volume 43 chapter 399 page 180.
It's a big double page spread.

zerosameri
04-30-2010, 01:10 AM
You just MIGHT want to look at Volume 43 chapter 399 page 180.
It's a big double page spread.
oh. I fill stupid stupid now, you have no clue how manny time I used book 43 for my thread and I just now realized that page XD

But on page 182 Madara said "I was erased from history and folks' memorys".. that right there is a lie or a plot hole because the 3rd, and the elders knew that Madara was alive. Because The elders and the Hokage sent Madara to help Itachi finish the Job.

mrsticky005
04-30-2010, 02:08 AM
oh. I fill stupid stupid now, you have no clue how manny time I used book 43 for my thread and I just now realized that page XD

But on page 182 Madara said "I was erased from history and folks' memorys".. that right there is a lie or a plot hole because the 3rd, and the elders knew that Madara was alive. Because The elders and the Hokage sent Madara to help Itachi finish the Job.

Actually remember Itachi was the one who found out about Madara.
Danzo, Hiruzen, Homura and Koharu were thought to be the only
ones who knew the truth about Itachi...but Madara knew too.
Madara knew because he helped Itachi kill the clan.

Though how Madara did that without Danzo, Hiruzen, Homura, or Koharu knowing is strange. Given that Danzo and Madara have met before I
think Danzo DID know that Danzo kept quiet about it though.

Somehow Itachi found out about Madara...but how?

I think the answer is Shisui.

RicenChicken
04-30-2010, 02:11 AM
and all types of sharingan can read it, just each higher level can read more of it and rinnegan can read all of it.

EDIT: which could possibly mean EMS + Rinnegan combined = like eternal rinnegan sharingan.

mrsticky005
04-30-2010, 03:31 AM
and all types of sharingan can read it, just each higher level can read more of it and rinnegan can read all of it.

EDIT: which could possibly mean EMS + Rinnegan combined = like eternal rinnegan sharingan.

I was thinking of something. If Naruto and Sasuke are Senju and Uchiha...

Then does that mean they can form a power equal to or even stronger
than the Sage of the Six Paths?

zerosameri
04-30-2010, 03:49 PM
Actually remember Itachi was the one who found out about Madara.
Danzo, Hiruzen, Homura and Koharu were thought to be the only
ones who knew the truth about Itachi...but Madara knew too.
Madara knew because he helped Itachi kill the clan.

Though how Madara did that without Danzo, Hiruzen, Homura, or Koharu knowing is strange. Given that Danzo and Madara have met before I
think Danzo DID know that Danzo kept quiet about it though.

Somehow Itachi found out about Madara...but how?

I think the answer is Shisui.
But of corse, they would also know because thet asked Itachi to do so.

But the 3rd Hokage and the elders knew that Madara did not die when he fought the 1st. But they didn't know what happened to him after he helped Itachi.


Itachi knows'a everything, so it's not a suprized that Itachi knew about Madara.