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JashinSama
03-22-2012, 09:34 AM
I'm going to assume since everyone is thinking that Nature Chakra is the source of all Jutsu, that that is the reason Orochimaru was searching for the perfect body.

Not only to learn the way of the snake at Ryuchidou, but learn the way of the toad at Mount Myoboku and the way of the slug at the other place as well. I think he wanted to find the perfect body to become a Master Sage and create new jutsu out of thin air, as did the Sage of the Six Paths with his ultimate body. He would do this by having the perfect body, becoming a master sage, then using Creation of All Things and become the ultimate villain.

Anyone else think that So6P mastered all 3 types of Sage Training and that's how he was able to use Creation of All Things?

I'm starting to think Naruto has the perfect body, his hair is the same as So6P and he's already mastered Toad Sage Mode... Who's to say he won't go training to become the new Sage? I think that that's the reason Tobi wants Naruto's body. He is a descendant of the Sage afterall.

Jakropha
03-22-2012, 11:27 AM
This is why Orochimaru is an idiot

He had the freaking perfect body the entire time, he was just have an Eyegasm.
God! He even came to him! Much more often than Sasuke.

All he had to do, was incapacitate him for a while, and then use his body, he gets Kyuubi, Perfect body, and near unlimited Chakra to use all of his newfound Jutsu!

Orochimaru even at one point said that Naruto was completely useless.
Goes to show you all that Orochimaru was one of the weaker villains... Even Kabuto saw Naruto's full potential, even before he got his arse whooped by him.

Even to this day Kabs see's nothing in Sasuke, and a bit more in Naruto, this is why Kabuto is 10x more intelligent than Oro.
Ignorance is a tumor.

Kyūbi no Yōko
03-22-2012, 01:10 PM
He was probably under Shisui's Kotoamatsukami (once) and that made him obsessed to the Sharingan.
Stupid Oro.

Kioroshi.
03-22-2012, 03:22 PM
You say oro is stupid...I don't know if I understood well but he had something to do with madara's body,danzo's right arm....And we don't even know what did Jugo and Suigetsu found.Well we don't even know does naruto have perfect body you are just assuming.Sasuke is related to sage too he is an uchiha that can get Rinnegan if you ask me he has better chances of a "Perfect Body" than Naruto.

slyfoxx
03-22-2012, 06:47 PM
hell oro did all the work and kabuto is the fruit of his labor. but i thought that was inazagi and u needed senju and uchiha dna

Hidden Ninja45
03-22-2012, 08:24 PM
This is why Orochimaru is an idiot

He had the freaking perfect body the entire time, he was just have an Eyegasm.
God! He even came to him! Much more often than Sasuke.

All he had to do, was incapacitate him for a while, and then use his body, he gets Kyuubi, Perfect body, and near unlimited Chakra to use all of his newfound Jutsu!

Orochimaru even at one point said that Naruto was completely useless.
Goes to show you all that Orochimaru was one of the weaker villains... Even Kabuto saw Naruto's full potential, even before he got his arse whooped by him.

Even to this day Kabs see's nothing in Sasuke, and a bit more in Naruto, this is why Kabuto is 10x more intelligent than Oro.
Ignorance is a tumor.

Excuse me, but WAT? What does that have to do with anything?

Fuuin
03-22-2012, 11:37 PM
I think you need the summoning contracts to acquire Sage training from a Kuchiyose species?

Maruko
03-23-2012, 12:57 AM
Yup,you do need.

K3nsh!n
03-23-2012, 03:56 AM
I'm going to assume since everyone is thinking that Nature Chakra is the source of all Jutsu, that that is the reason Orochimaru was searching for the perfect body.
I have no idea how others reached this conclusion...
I for one, believe that Rikudo himself was also a Sage(nature chakra user)...
It's good enough of a reason for Kabuto to learn the sage mode since he wants to attain Rikudo's power, and being a Sage is a part of it...

Not only to learn the way of the snake at Ryuchidou, but learn the way of the frog at Mount Myoboku and the way of the slug at the other place as well. I think he wanted to find the perfect body to become a Master Sage and create new jutsu out of thin air, as did the Sage of the Six Paths with his ultimate body. He would do this by having the perfect body, becoming a master sage, then using Creation of All Things and become the ultimate villain.
I don't get this part...
What do you mean by "creating new jutsu out of thin air"?

Anyone else think that So6P mastered all 3 types of Sage Training and that's how he was able to use Creation of All Things
I am betting Rikudo had his own Sage mode(no animal characteristics)...
Creation of All Things was the ability granted to the Sage because of his Dojutsu(mistaken to be the rinnegan)

slyfoxx
03-23-2012, 05:19 AM
i thinkk oro was on the same level as jirya and because of naruto lifeforce and charka he was able to blend it better therefor become a better sage. Kabuto spliced his way by taking dna from karin and juuego who's body naturally takes in natural energy. people have been saying that kabuto is better than naruto but hes transformed naruto stays more human and dont give kabuto to much credit he hasnt won yet. Sasuke know all of taka weakness, kabuto just showing us what he can do next chapter he going to get owned and trys his talk no jutsu and reveal the 580 big secret.

TatsumiTora
03-23-2012, 07:33 AM
Wait... So Tobi wants Naruto's body? O.o

itachipeintobi
03-23-2012, 09:10 AM
thats scary

JashinSama
03-24-2012, 12:43 PM
You say oro is stupid...I don't know if I understood well but he had something to do with madara's body,danzo's right arm....And we don't even know what did Jugo and Suigetsu found.Well we don't even know does naruto have perfect body you are just assuming.Sasuke is related to sage too he is an uchiha that can get Rinnegan if you ask me he has better chances of a "Perfect Body" than Naruto.

You're an idiot.

Senju (cousin of Uzumaki) were the Perfect Body.

Uchiha (cousin of Hyuuga) were the Perfect Eyes.

Again, you're an idiot.

So tell me, who has the better chance?

JashinSama
03-24-2012, 12:46 PM
hell oro did all the work and kabuto is the fruit of his labor. but i thought that was inazagi and u needed senju and uchiha dna

All Jutsu was created from Creation of All Things. This has been stated.

Izanagi was Sharingan Jutsu, the Sharingan is not the beginning of jutsu.

Nature Chakra, if my theory is correct, (also since So6p is a Sage) is the beginning of jutsu.

The Sage wanted to make a way to make jutsu from the inside of the body, rather than using chakra from nature. And so he used Creation of All Things (from the 3 types of Nature Chakra).

JashinSama
03-24-2012, 12:47 PM
Wait... So Tobi wants Naruto's body? O.o

Yes, this has also been stated, multiple times on the forums, by other people.

Tobi doesn't just want Kurama, he wants Naruto's body for something having to do with the Juubi.

JashinSama
03-24-2012, 12:52 PM
I don't get this part...
What do you mean by "creating new jutsu out of thin air"?
Rikudou created all jutsu use, such as ninjutsu and genjutsu from Creation of All Things. They didn't exist before he used that power.

I am betting Rikudo had his own Sage mode(no animal characteristics)...
Creation of All Things was the ability granted to the Sage because of his Dojutsu(mistaken to be the rinnegan) So, Naruto's eyes, and Kabuto's eyes changed when they used their Sage powers, so who's to say when you master all 3 types of Sage chakra, you don't get these "mistaken for Rinnegan eyes" that you speak of? Then he used Creation of All Things and created jutsu "out of thin air".



In Red.

Kyūbi no Yōko
03-24-2012, 02:17 PM
Rikudou created all jutsu use, such as ninjutsu and genjutsu from Creation of All Things. They didn't exist before he used that power.

Not a fact. Not stated anywhere.
It is said that Izanagi is based on this technique although it isn't stated if all Jutsus were created from this.

Kioroshi.
03-24-2012, 06:34 PM
You're an idiot.

Senju (cousin of Uzumaki) were the Perfect Body.

Uchiha (cousin of Hyuuga) were the Perfect Eyes.

Again, you're an idiot.

So tell me, who has the better chance?



wow you must be retarded I thought "perfect body" means to achieve what rikudou did to have eyes and body.

So if Sasuke can learn sage mode he has better body than naruto overall he can could use sage mode and sharingan thats what Oro truly wanted.He wasn't just after the sharingan obviously.

JashinSama
03-25-2012, 07:46 PM
wow you must be retarded I thought "perfect body" means to achieve what rikudou did to have eyes and body.

So if Sasuke can learn sage mode he has better body than naruto overall he can could use sage mode and sharingan thats what Oro truly wanted.He wasn't just after the sharingan obviously.

Senju have a strong body and lifeforce, Uchiha have powerful eyes.

Tell me please what you mean by, Uchiha have more power?

Why would Danzo or Madara experiment on themselves with Senju DNA when (according to you) all they needed was to learn Sage Mode?

Kioroshi.
03-26-2012, 09:20 AM
Senju have a strong body and lifeforce, Uchiha have powerful eyes.

Tell me please what you mean by, Uchiha have more power?

Why would Danzo or Madara experiment on themselves with Senju DNA when (according to you) all they needed was to learn Sage Mode?



Danzo was planning to control Kyuubi.If I remember right.

and Madara obviously red the uchiha tablet and wanted Senju power to unlock rinnengan and taste a little of Sage's power (sage of six paths)

Now I am pretty sure Oro planned to use sasuke's body to learn sage mode and + he got the sharingan thats the true reason he wanted sasuke.


I didn't mean to say Senju are only wanted cuz of sage mode.They obviously are among 2 most powerfull clans cuz they are descendens (not spelled right) of the Sage of six paths.

and have strong life force and body.

I wanted to say that uchiha with sage mode and sharingan is more powerfull than a mere senju.

Jakropha
03-26-2012, 01:00 PM
You are both thinking through Flawed Logic

The Senju have the Perfect 'Torso'
Since the Senju have the so called perfect body, they should in terms have other perfect organs, including the eyes!

So lets just call it a perfect Torso.

JashinSama
03-26-2012, 01:01 PM
@Kioroshi: Mere Senju? You do know that Hashirama was a Senju right? And that he beat Madara, and Madara not only had his EMS, but he also had Kurama by his side.

So... Mere Senju is a worthless argument I'm not going to have with you.

Uzumaki are known for their huge lifeforce, Kushina lived even though Kurama was ripped from her stomach in an instant. Any other human besides a Senju or an Uzumaki would die from that, including an Uchiha.

JashinSama
03-26-2012, 01:02 PM
You are both thinking through Flawed Logic

The Senju have the Perfect 'Torso'
Since the Senju have the so called perfect body, they should in terms have other perfect organs, including the eyes!

So lets just call it a perfect Torso.

How about Perfect Lifeforce. = Body (organs aside)

Whereas Uchiha have Perfect Power. = Eyes.

Jakropha
03-26-2012, 01:08 PM
Then does that mean Naruto has perfect lifeforce + the Perfect Heart - the Perfect Brain?

Kioroshi.
03-26-2012, 02:19 PM
@Kioroshi: Mere Senju? You do know that Hashirama was a Senju right? And that he beat Madara, and Madara not only had his EMS, but he also had Kurama by his side.

So... Mere Senju is a worthless argument I'm not going to have with you.

Uzumaki are known for their huge lifeforce, Kushina lived even though Kurama was ripped from her stomach in an instant. Any other human besides a Senju or an Uzumaki would die from that, including an Uchiha.



By mere senju I do not think Hashirama he was the strongest senju that has Mokuton.By mere senju I mean average senju of their clan like a mere uchiha.That only has normal sharingan.


Madara was not a mere uchiha and hashirama was not a mere senju.They were the most powerfull members of their clans and still would be if they lived.

(at least hashirama)


By mere senju I think average strenght people of senju clan.

Rikudo Sage
03-26-2012, 02:49 PM
I'm going to assume since everyone is thinking that Nature Chakra is the source of all Jutsu, that that is the reason Orochimaru was searching for the perfect body.

Not only to learn the way of the snake at Ryuchidou, but learn the way of the toad at Mount Myoboku and the way of the slug at the other place as well. I think he wanted to find the perfect body to become a Master Sage and create new jutsu out of thin air, as did the Sage of the Six Paths with his ultimate body. He would do this by having the perfect body, becoming a master sage, then using Creation of All Things and become the ultimate villain.

Anyone else think that So6P mastered all 3 types of Sage Training and that's how he was able to use Creation of All Things?

I'm starting to think Naruto has the perfect body, his hair is the same as So6P and he's already mastered Toad Sage Mode... Who's to say he won't go training to become the new Sage? I think that that's the reason Tobi wants Naruto's body. He is a descendant of the Sage afterall.

I dont want to go against with your theory that the Rikudo being the Sage ( Nature energy user ) I like that theory and in fact I created the same thread couple of months ago..

What I just wanted to point out is that Creation of All things is Yin-Yang release..

Yin - relates to one's spiritual energy
Yang - relates to one's physical energy

The Yin and Yang are the Two Elements of Normal Chakra, Spiritual Energy and Physical Energy. Thats why it has been said that with this 2 types of energy Ninjutsu, Genjutsu etc. were born..

The Nature chakra is totally different from Yin ( spiritual ) and Yang ( physical ) energy.. It's confirmed during Naruto sage mode training..

now with that being said.. the Creation of All things is not Nature chakra release..

Anyone else think that So6P mastered all 3 types of Sage Training and that's how he was able to use Creation of All Things?

In my opinion... The Rikudo's Yin-Yang release mastery level reached to the highest level that no one can imagine + kekkei genkai which gave him access to use Creation of all things jutsu..

JashinSama
03-26-2012, 06:22 PM
Then does that mean Naruto has perfect lifeforce + the Perfect Heart - the Perfect Brain?

I said organs ASIDE.

JashinSama
03-26-2012, 06:28 PM
I dont want to go against with your theory that the Rikudo being the Sage ( Nature energy user ) I like that theory and in fact I created the same thread couple of months ago..

What I just wanted to point out is that Creation of All things is Yin-Yang release..

Yin - relates to one's spiritual energy
Yang - relates to one's physical energy

The Yin and Yang are the Two Elements of Normal Chakra, Spiritual Energy and Physical Energy. Thats why it has been said that with this 2 types of energy Ninjutsu, Genjutsu etc. were born..

The Nature chakra is totally different from Yin ( spiritual ) and Yang ( physical ) energy.. It's confirmed during Naruto sage mode training..

now with that being said.. the Creation of All things is not Nature chakra release..



In my opinion... The Rikudo's Yin-Yang release mastery level reached to the highest level that no one can imagine + kekkei genkai which gave him access to use Creation of all things jutsu..

Maybe the Sage created the jutsu (I wouldn't call it a jutsu, it's more of a super power) after he was able to experience the might of all three types of Nature Chakra, I'mma assume that the elder sages (elder toad, snake, slug) each know secrets of how in-body (yin-yang) chakra was first created.

I'm sure it had something to do with becoming nature then becoming a master of the body.

The Sage had access to every jutsu and every power. He was a God among men... He created the Moon. He defeated the Juubi.

Great guy I hear...

Kyūbi no Yōko
03-27-2012, 02:35 AM
Jashin, do not double / triple / quad post cause it is annoying.
Just put them all in one, if it's long, use SPOILERS around.

And you must know that Jak is just trollin', you hatin' :P

JashinSama
03-27-2012, 08:17 AM
^But Jak loves me... He wouldn't do that :3

^NOT IN A SEXUAL WAY

TetsuShatarii
03-27-2012, 08:22 AM
I don't know where it says that Tobi wants Naruto's body. In fact it seems like he doesn't care about him at all. He said he was just a pawn for Sasuke.

JashinSama
03-27-2012, 10:14 AM
^It doesn't, but a lot of theories I've read have stated that very sentence.

Namikaze_Naruto
03-27-2012, 05:10 PM
and Madara obviously red the uchiha tablet and wanted Senju power to unlock rinnengan and taste a little of Sage's power (sage of six paths)

It hasn't been officially confirmed that an Uchiha gaining Senju DNA (or vice versa) will lead to Rinnegan. Having gained Hashirama DNA after their battle, but lived for an extended period after this (educated assumption based off known timeline) only to gain Rinnegan shortly before death goes against this. Madara didn't gain perfection with Uchiha/Senju split until he was edo tensei'ed. It is alluded to, but not confirmed. And the likes of Tobi are not reliable sources.

Now I am pretty sure Oro planned to use sasuke's body to learn sage mode and + he got the sharingan thats the true reason he wanted sasuke.

How would he be able to learn Sage Mode after taking Sasuke's body? Wasn't it just stated it requires a certain body to be able to utilize nature chakra and gain Sage mastery? And Fukusaku stating that only the likes of Jiraiya and Naruto could learn Sage Mode from Konoha?

I didn't mean to say Senju are only wanted cuz of sage mode.They obviously are among 2 most powerfull clans cuz they are descendens (not spelled right) of the Sage of six paths.

We don't know of any Senju that have Sage Mode.

I wanted to say that uchiha with sage mode and sharingan is more powerfull than a mere senju.

Just like a Senju or Uzumaki with a MS is more powerful than a mere Uchiha? Exactly what point are you trying to make here?

We know nothing about mere Senju, but we know that mere Uchiha do not gain Sharingan (it has been stated that only a select few in the clan are able to awaken it). You can't make a comparison against an unknown.

Kioroshi.
03-27-2012, 05:36 PM
It hasn't been officially confirmed that an Uchiha gaining Senju DNA (or vice versa) will lead to Rinnegan. Having gained Hashirama DNA after their battle, but lived for an extended period after this (educated assumption based off known timeline) only to gain Rinnegan shortly before death goes against this. Madara didn't gain perfection with Uchiha/Senju split until he was edo tensei'ed. It is alluded to, but not confirmed. And the likes of Tobi are not reliable sources.



How would he be able to learn Sage Mode after taking Sasuke's body? Wasn't it just stated it requires a certain body to be able to utilize nature chakra and gain Sage mastery? And Fukusaku stating that only the likes of Jiraiya and Naruto could learn Sage Mode from Konoha?



We don't know of any Senju that have Sage Mode.



Just like a Senju or Uzumaki with a MS is more powerful than a mere Uchiha? Exactly what point are you trying to make here?

We know nothing about mere Senju, but we know that mere Uchiha do not gain Sharingan (it has been stated that only a select few in the clan are able to awaken it). You can't make a comparison against an unknown.



Well after reading last chapter its only logical for me to think that Oro wanted a strong body for training in Ryuchidou.So my first guess was "isn't sasuke's body strong and stuff so Oro musrve planned to train in ryuchidou with it"


Just like a Senju or Uzumaki with a MS is more powerful than a mere Uchiha? Exactly what point are you trying to make here?



Exactly






wow my memory must be awful,I forgot this.



We don't know of any Senju that have Sage Mode.



Isn't naruto a descendant of senju?aren't uzumaki and senju related?

JashinSama
03-27-2012, 08:38 PM
^Orochimaru wanted Sasuke's body sure, but the only reason he chose Sasuke is because he didn't have access to Itachi anymore and Sasuke was a KID, easily influenced by Orochimaru to 'gain power' so that he could one day achieve the Sharingan. If Sasuke didn't have the Sharingan, I doubt that Orochimaru would have had any interest in him.

And we don't know Jiraiya's last name... BUT we do know he flirted with Tsunade Senju so... he's probably not a Senju... Maybe an Uzumaki? Nah, he was born in Konoha. (at least raised)

An irrelevant name I guess.

EYE OF AGES
04-02-2012, 05:18 PM
Then does that mean Naruto has perfect lifeforce + the Perfect Heart - the Perfect Brain?
That's a bit insulting, the main protagonist is usually an air head, look at goku? look at ichigo's so called orange haired girl(maybe not an airhead who knows)? naruto too appears to be kinda light headed, but in truth with all that vast experience from so many clones, you do get godlike mind through critical system failure.

To put it another way the infinite monkey theorem, given an infinity of monkeys or time to a monkey typing at random all works of man and god emerge out of sheer randomness.
The infinite monkey theorem states that a monkey hitting keys at random on a typewriter keyboard for an infinite amount of time will almost surely type a given text, such as the complete works of William Shakespeare.In this context, "almost surely" is a mathematical term with a precise meaning, and the "monkey" is not an actual monkey, but a metaphor for an abstract device that produces a random sequence of letters and symbols ad infinitum. The probability of a monkey exactly typing a complete work such as Shakespeare's Hamlet is so tiny that the chance of it occurring during a period of time even a hundred thousand orders of magnitude longer than the age of the universe is extremely low, but not actually zero.Variants of the theorem include multiple and even infinitely many typists, and the target text varies between an entire library and a single sentence. The history of these statements can be traced back to Aristotle's On Generation and Corruption and Cicero's De natura deorum, through Blaise Pascal and Jonathan Swift, and finally to modern statements with their iconic typewriters. In the early 20th century,-wikipedia

JashinSama
04-02-2012, 10:21 PM
^Is Wikipedia just your source of all information?

Where is Wikipedia's source? You tell me that.

Maruko
04-03-2012, 01:26 AM
Interesting...

JashinSama
04-03-2012, 06:47 AM
Interesting...

I saw your name was the one who posted latest and I was hoping for a better answer...

Maruko
04-03-2012, 01:29 PM
I saw your name was the one who posted latest and I was hoping for a better answer...
So i did disappoint...

OK,let's give a clever answer.

I think that EYE OF AGES uses only information that he/she can find online. You should use your head a bit more,it's actually good for you.
I can browse wiki for hours and see a completely different thing in Naruto manga tomorrow-it's not 100% legit,users edit it!

I like Jashin's theory on Jiraiya's surname,i hope he's an Uzumaki! `:shock:

@Kiorshi
''I wanted to say that uchiha with sage mode and sharingan is more powerfull than a mere senju''!

Just why? A ''mere Senju''?
There's not such thing as ''mere Senju'',they're called ''Thousand skill clan'' for a reason and that reason is obvious,your argument is invalid.

JashinSama
04-03-2012, 03:10 PM
@Uchiha Maruko

Imagine this, Wikipedia says that Ben Franklin was staying in America for many years of his life.

Not true, he was only there for 3 months of his life. The rest of his life he was spending his time in France and a few other places in Europe.

Maruko
04-03-2012, 11:32 PM
@JashinSama
That's a nice example,anyone can create an account and edit entries.

JashinSama
04-04-2012, 07:21 AM
^Also, I like how we both have epic Sasuke avatars :3

Maruko
04-04-2012, 10:32 AM
^
:3
It makes you look badas* :D