Immortality

[Leafy]

Would you want to die, or live forever?

Discuss.

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

Well, depends, If I knew I could better help the world by leading it for Eternity, then maybe yes.

[Bacon]

Living forever without the option of death may be the most torturous predicament anyone could be in. Assuming the person can retain their sanity or has no prior attachments thus far, most people would have to live and watch their loved ones pass away one by one. Even though they won't die, their culture fades away, empires crumble,and everything you held dear both symbolically and physically would fade away.

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

Unless one only enjoys order and thus seeks it through Eternal peace.

[Bacon]

Esplain what chu mean. e.e

[sasu_girl]

i would want to die. you can look back on history and most things end up repeating themselves. i wouldn't want to live through people making the same mistakes over, and over, and over...

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

Esplain what chu mean. e.e
Well, Say you want peace on the Earth, have the perfect plan and all, but once you die chaos will ensure and the order will change, if you could keep working your ideas and plans for the rest of time, you would mantain peace.
i would want to die. you can look back on history and most things end up repeating themselves. i wouldn't want to live through people making the same mistakes over, and over, and over...
I wonder if it would even be worth it.

[sasu_girl]

Well, Say you want peace on the Earth, have the perfect plan and all, but once you die chaos will ensure and the order will change, if you could keep working your ideas and plans for the rest of time, you would mantain peace.

I wonder if it would even be worth it.
world peace is worth wanting, but most people who want it are hypocrites.

[White Zetsu]

assuming space travel is possible when the earth A. nukes itself B. the sun exlodes or C. all life but you dies then maybe, but there would be a large chance of going insane, seeing youre whole culture die before you. then youre planet

[Leafy]

Living forever without the option of death may be the most torturous predicament anyone could be in. Assuming the person can retain their sanity or has no prior attachments thus far, most people would have to live and watch their loved ones pass away one by one. Even though they won't die, their culture fades away, empires crumble,and everything you held dear both symbolically and physically would fade away.

My answer is more or less like this. The only way I would be able to stay sane is if I had friends who were also Immortal, but I would still wonder what's after death...That right there would make me just want to kill myself. lol

@Twilight: That's a good idea, to an extent. What happens when your plan fails?

[Chiku]

die... i dont even want to know how bratty and stupid all those future generations will be...>.>

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

My answer is more or less like this. The only way I would be able to stay sane is if I had friends who were also Immortal, but I would still wonder what's after death...That right there would make me just want to kill myself. lol

@Twilight: That's a good idea, to an extent. What happens when your plan fails?
make more plans I guess, you've got Eternity after all. XD Or....until the Universe expands so much outward it ceases to exsist and you arrive in Oblivion. o.o

[Bacon]

My answer is more or less like this. The only way I would be able to stay sane is if I had friends who were also Immortal, but I would still wonder what's after death...That right there would make me just want to kill myself. lol

@Twilight: That's a good idea, to an extent. What happens when your plan fails?
HAHA, but your question is immortality for thy self. :3 But yes, wondering what's beyond this earthly existence and not ever finding out would be a bish. e.e

Well, Say you want peace on the Earth, have the perfect plan and all, but once you die chaos will ensure and the order will change, if you could keep working your ideas and plans for the rest of time, you would mantain peace.

I wonder if it would even be worth it.
Implementing world peace is an idealist fantasy,but I suppose it would occupy yourself. Afterall, people are not constants, new variables come into the fold every generation.
world peace is worth wanting, but most people who want it are hypocrites.
It's not that they are hypocrites, but rather their need to survive over yours and also the broad definition of world peace. What exactly would it be?

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

HAHA, but your question is immortality for thy self. :3 But yes, wondering what's beyond this earthly existence and not ever finding out would be a bish. e.e


Implementing world peace is an idealist fantasy,but I suppose it would occupy yourself. Afterall, people are not constants, new variables come into the fold every generation.

It's not that they are hypocrites, but rather their need to survive over yours and also the broad definition of world peace. What exactly would it be?
However, control the enviroment, control the people through psychology, true order and peace shall come.

[Bacon]

To control the world to such a degree would require sci-fi technology, infinite resources, and maddening book keeping skills. No matter how perfect your plan may be, people aren't and that in itself could lead to internal corruption.

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

Yes, but you see, We'd still have the punishment, and police, everywhere, you slip up and you get punishment. You do good, you get rewards. A way for everyone to gain experience and form knowledge to pass on.

[Leafy]

However, control the enviroment, control the people through psychology, true order and peace shall come.

It isn't true order and peace if you're forcing people through brainwash.

[ILIKEPIE]

well an endless cycle of dieing and then rebirth while retaining memories of your past lives would also be a form of Immortality that allows you to understand everything in the world better

[Bacon]

Good and bad are broad definitions leo, sounds like you'd rule with an iron fist. :lol:

well an endless cycle of dieing and then rebirth while retaining memories of your past lives would also be a form of Immortality that allows you to understand everything in the world better
interesting,but retaining your memories still preserves the madman who lost his culture and family factor.

[Leafy]

well an endless cycle of dieing and then rebirth while retaining memories of your past lives would also be a form of Immortality that allows you to understand everything in the world better

I take it that you believe in reincarnation?

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

It isn't true order and peace if you're forcing people through brainwash.
Eh true. more like psychology though, not really brainwash.
Good and bad are broad definitions leo, sounds like you'd rule with an iron fist. :lol:


interesting,but retaining your memories still preserves the madman who lost his culture and family factor.
Uh, Yea ruling the world with order. The madess of law and what not. XD

[Super Sanin 3]

what if you freeze to death (not literally) and physically can't feel anything or notice anything? Or burn yourself to ash? :D what do you mean by immortal?

[HIDAN346]

i would want to die. future aint looking good in america.

[Bacon]

Eh true. more like psychology though, not really brainwash.

Uh, Yea ruling the world with order. The madess of law and what not. XD
Law is maddening,but it is what keeps america stable. >.>
what if you freeze to death (not literally) and physically can't feel anything or notice anything? Or burn yourself to ash? :D what do you mean by immortal?
Haha,a body which doesn't age must be incredibly augmented when compared with normal people. I'd assume it could withstand fire. xD Good point.

[Leafy]

what if you freeze to death (not literally) and physically can't feel anything or notice anything? Or burn yourself to ash? :D what do you mean by immortal?

If you get frozen...then you'll just stay there till the ice melts. Unimaginable boredom ensues. :lol: If you burn to ashes then you'll regenerate.

But yeah, being stuck in a place (like jail, or the bottom of the sea) if you were immortal would be terrible...

[Super Sanin 3]

If i was truly immortal i'd die anyways, the earth's gonna end sooner or later >.> plus i can get a super painful headache that can't be cured D:
Or if the sun burns the earth and i float in space for eternity, freezing my butt off (or burn like hell depending)

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

Law is maddening,but it is what keeps america stable. >.>

Haha,a body which doesn't age must be incredibly augmented when compared with normal people. I'd assume it could withstand fire. xD Good point.
Thus is what keeps everything stable, enforcing the same law throughout the world via widespread police companies and what not.

[ILIKEPIE]

I take it that you believe in reincarnation?
I don't know what I believe it's all so compicated

[sagemaster777]

everyone has to die sometime. Its the price for living, then based on your beliefs what happens after happens.

[Bacon]

Thus is what keeps everything stable, enforcing the same law throughout the world via widespread police companies and what not.
But that much control over such a wide area is almost unfeasible. Even with the United states, the feds struggle because they do not use military force to enforce their law.
I don't know what I believe it's all so compicated
It sounds like hinduism, just pointing it out because I was reading on this stuff earlier for a speech. xD

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

But that much control over such a wide area is almost unfeasible. Even with the United states, the feds struggle because they do not use military force to enforce their law.

It sounds like hinduism, just pointing it out because I was reading on this stuff earlier for a speech. xD
I wouldn't say so with todays technology, even more so if you got others to govern the different parts, if they step outta place replace them.

[sagemaster777]

now were talking about peace? XD

[Leafy]

everyone has to die sometime. Its the price for living, then based on your beliefs what happens after happens.

So you're saying that if I believe in Heaven then I will go there, or if I believe in the Shadow World then I will go there? :lol:

Your statement is flawed.

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

now were talking about peace? XD
I was from the start...........

[sagemaster777]

So you're saying that if I believe in Heaven then I will go there, or if I believe in the Shadow World then I will go there? :lol:

Your statement is flawed.
No, in fact that's not what i meant at all :lol:

maybe i should re-word that...............

IM TO LAZY!

@Leo: i know o-o

Our human minds stop us from accomplishing peace, sadly.

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

No, in fact that's not what i meant at all :lol:

maybe i should re-word that...............

IM TO LAZY!

@Leo: i know o-o

Our human minds stop us from accomplishing peace, sadly.
Thus if I were immortal and used psychology to change said mind set, peace comes.

[sagemaster777]

Thus if I were immortal and used psychology to change said mind set, peace comes.
XD you probably would try to pull that off if you were immortal, no doubt about it.

[Leafy]

No, in fact that's not what i meant at all :lol:

maybe i should re-word that...............

IM TO LAZY!

@Leo: i know o-o

Our human minds stop us from accomplishing peace, sadly.

Valid arguement. lol

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

XD you probably would try to pull that off if you were immortal, no doubt about it.
Would be the ultimate challenge, and the psychology would be fun. XD

[Bacon]

I wouldn't say so with todays technology, even more so if you got others to govern the different parts, if they step outta place replace them.
Even so, it's hard for me to picture such a world because I've grown up with the bill of rights. This world you speak of would have to alter that doctrine completely. :D
now were talking about peace? XD
Well, we are talking about what you would do when you're immortal, as a way to justify being so.

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

Even so, it's hard for me to picture such a world because I've grown up with the bill of rights. This world you speak of would have to alter that doctrine completely. :D

Well, we are talking about what you would do when you're immortal, as a way to justify being so.
Perhaps, I shall create a new set of laws, if I were actually to do this impossible goal.

[Leafy]

Yay! Successful debate thread is successful.

[sagemaster777]

Hmmm...I'd probably Join leo in his Quest, we have the same ideals and goals, at least most. (80%)

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

maybe you should join the dollars then. XD

[Vornmusion]

I used to say I'd rather die than live forever without the ability to die. However I have changed my stance. I would want to be immortal. After living for hundreds of millions of years I think it likely I would of evolved my mind more than a few times and ceased being human, instead becoming something far greater. Shedding myself of humanities tiresome traits and focusing my efforts on understanding the real universe would be delightful.

Who knows, living for potentially hundreds of billions of years one might even evolve into a god-like being. You would certainly have near infinite knowledge of the universe at that point in anycase. I could dig that.

[Leafy]

I used to say I'd rather die than live forever without the ability to die. However I have changed my stance. I would want to be immortal. After living for hundreds of millions of years I think it likely I would of evolved my mind more than a few times and ceased being human, instead becoming something far greater. Shedding myself of humanities tiresome traits and focusing my efforts on understanding the real universe would be delightful.

Who knows, living for potentially hundreds of billions of years one might even evolve into a god-like being. You would certainly have near infinite knowledge of the universe at that point in anycase. I could dig that.

So it's the "age=experience" times a thousand. :lol: I like your idea though.

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

It is true though, experience creates knowledge.

[Super Sanin 3]

Too many things could happen that would make me miserable for all those years to come >.<

[Leafy]

Maybe if you believe in 42, you can achieve immortality...
/ponders

[Kunoichi]

I'd rather die. It would be so much easier.

[MinatoXNaruto]

I would want to live until I'm ready to die. So I guess what I'm saying is, I would want to live as long as i want, but die when i wanted to

[sagemaster777]

maybe you should join the dollars then. XD:lol: funny you should say that..

I used to say I'd rather die than live forever without the ability to die. However I have changed my stance. I would want to be immortal. After living for hundreds of millions of years I think it likely I would of evolved my mind more than a few times and ceased being human, instead becoming something far greater. Shedding myself of humanities tiresome traits and focusing my efforts on understanding the real universe would be delightful.

Who knows, living for potentially hundreds of billions of years one might even evolve into a god-like being. You would certainly have near infinite knowledge of the universe at that point in anycase. I could dig that.
^ Yes, exactly what i was thinking.

[Twilit Lion (Leo)]

:lol: funny you should say that..


^ Yes, exactly what i was thinking.
Oh. o.O

[AgentShayd]

I would want to die. I would hate to watch all those around me that I love and care about pass on while I am stuck in this wretched planet. Talk about a complete nightmare. The only positive side of this would be that I would get to see what the future holds for mankind and the earth herself. Could be the only person left on the planet after so mankind dies off. Might be interesting to see what life is like after people, other then what Discovery channel and other channels like that have guess at life after people on our planet.

[Seven]

Depends, would I age?

[Maikeru D. Shinigami]

I don't care how long I live (though I'd like to finish One Piece and The World God Only Knows). So, I could live forever. I think at some point the idea of people close to me dying would become normal. I've already kind of got over the fact that people die in my first 21 years of life. So, I don't think death would bother me ever. I also don't really have many "loved" ones. I could play all the video games I want to, forever!

I'd also be fine with dying though. Maybe see what exactly the afterlife would be like.

Well, Say you want peace on the Earth, have the perfect plan and all, but once you die chaos will ensure and the order will change, if you could keep working your ideas and plans for the rest of time, you would mantain peace.
world peace is worth wanting, but most people who want it are hypocrites.

World peace will never happen.

Law is maddening,but it is what keeps america stable. >.>

I'd hardly call America "stable". Closer than many/most, maybe.

So you're saying that if I believe in Heaven then I will go there, or if I believe in the Shadow World then I will go there? :lol:

Any proof against that? Who's to say the afterlife can't be made different for each person? Assuming a higher power exists, I'm pretty positive he could create that.

I used to say I'd rather die than live forever without the ability to die. However I have changed my stance. I would want to be immortal. After living for hundreds of millions of years I think it likely I would of evolved my mind more than a few times and ceased being human, instead becoming something far greater. Shedding myself of humanities tiresome traits and focusing my efforts on understanding the real universe would be delightful.

Who knows, living for potentially hundreds of billions of years one might even evolve into a god-like being. You would certainly have near infinite knowledge of the universe at that point in anycase. I could dig that.

Another person who would go with it!

[Bacon]

I'm sorry for your losses maik.

But I disagree:

I'd hardly call America "stable". Closer than many/most, maybe.
Do you ever worry about what will happen if the wrong guy is elected? Have you ever had to worry about congress passing a law which gives them full authority. Have you ever had to worry about a singular cultural influence siezeing absolute power? :lol: For the most part, we are affluent @ssholes living in our own bubbles while some homeless family suffers down the street. Meanwhile we talk about helping other countries and ignore our own poor,because it's their fault.

/thought

[Maikeru D. Shinigami]

I didn't say our government was bad, just that I don't consider us "stable" per se. That last sentence is one of those reasons why.

[sagemaster777]

Whats An America?

[Leafy]

Any proof against that? Who's to say the afterlife can't be made different for each person? Assuming a higher power exists, I'm pretty positive he could create that.





I mean, it's possible...

And that's all I'm gonna say.

[loganace]

I would want to live until I'm ready to die. So I guess what I'm saying is, I would want to live as long as i want, but die when i wanted to

There are some thoughts of imortality not nececarily meaning you would live forever. In that form you can die but will never die of old age. That might be cool.

[Hakumaiu]

In my opinion I would actually want to stay alive or observe the the Earth. I want to see how technology advances, look what we have now and 40 years back. It's amazing how far we come and it's very interesting to me what we will be in 1 million years from now.

Please don't hate it's just an opinion.

[Throw Rasen-Shuriken]

Well, sure there is a lot of things that you can do with a long life, you can go and do everything that you ever had wanted, become powerful, get with many people, do frankly anything without the worry of time, the flip side to all of this is the fact, think of the worst circumstances that you would have to endure, seeing the death of people you adore or even love, if you are unfortunate enough to get health problems that can impede you through life that, will obviously also affect you in a negative way, just because you are immortal it does not neccassarily mean you will also have very good health, unless that comes with it then, that would not be so much of a problem, yet for just being immortal, could just mean endless longetivity of life, so they both do not neccassarily go in hand.

Then there is the fact of the world destroying itself around you, through your whole life watching the planet constantly get ruin by both natural and manmade disasters, then there is also the fact of the very real possibility being immortal that eventually you may only end up being the only person ever left within this world in it's very destruction when the planet is suppose to burn, unless you find somewhere else, out on another planet with lifeforms and everything, you will end up seeing the living hell of complete annihilation of so many things infront of you.

If that does not make you feel absolutely worst you could just be driven insane by all the unsightly things that you would have experience, then there is also the fact that even though you can live forever, you could possibly still age, which will also have a negative effect on you. Unless the whole immortality comes with forever young and good well being you will basically become a prisoner in your own body and possibly completely alone after everything, which by then, I would say most would have not wanted any of that yet alone seeing every single thing that has and ever will happen right infront of you and considering this world is far from utopia, you could end up being mentally scarred with all the negative events that have fallen before your eyes.

Overall I would not want to be immortal, increased longetivity of life seems to me to be way more better then never dying no matter what befalls you, since I get thoughts of drifting in endless space, after seeing this planet break up infront of me, that is just how it will become if you never die.

[EYE OF AGES]

Then there is the fact of the world destroying itself around you, through your whole life watching the planet constantly get ruin by both natural and manmade disasters, then there is also the fact of the very real possibility being immortal that eventually you may only end up being the only person ever left within this world in it's very destruction when the planet is suppose to burn, unless you find somewhere else, out on another planet with lifeforms and everything, you will end up seeing the living hell of complete annihilation of so many things infront of you.

Transcend your human limitations, grow beyond measure to become closer to god in your plane of existence, as a living god, you would embody truth and comprehension with intellect and tact beyond measure, the ideal state of existence.

Godhood.

[Jutsu Junkie]

No one should be ashamed to want to live forever. It is not hubris, but simply the universal desire of life to keep living.

Here are some of the arguments against immortality, and my refutations:

1. I don't want to see my loved ones die.

How is that a problem different from what we see today? Even the very young face this problem. Why not make your life worthy of those you've outlived, instead of running away to the grave?

2. I'll get bored.

I weep for your lack of imagination. You do realize that with eternity on your side that you will eventually be many times wealthier than Bill Gates -- or the US government, even if you have a bad job -- which means someday you will be able to amuse yourself in unforeseen ways.

3. I'll have to watch the world destroy itself.

Who says? And if that happens, so what? Dead is dead. You won't die, everyone else will, come Doomsday or not, so don't worry about it. If the world keeps going, individuals will still die no matter what. The world has ended for them, just like it's ended billions of times previously. By the time you need to worry about this, you will be fabulously wealthy (unless you are truly stupid) and able to watch the world destroy itself on your android-inhabited tropical island on Mars. Dream bigger.

---

Did I cover it all? Probably not. Oh well. I wouldn't mind living forever, and if I got tired of it, so what? I'll just go to sleep like a vampire -- for a very long time. When I wake up, everything old is new again!

[Shikamaru Nara]

Haha some of the ignorance in this topic.

I'm surprised I didn't see more comments along the lines of what I'm thinking but I overestimate some people again. xD

Anyway it's just my opinion.
I think that what makes life beautiful is death. Knowing that your time is limited and you have death looming just really makes you realize how beautiful and short life is.

[Jutsu Junkie]

Haha some of the ignorance in this topic.

I'm surprised I didn't see more comments along the lines of what I'm thinking but I overestimate some people again. xD

Anyway it's just my opinion.
I think that what makes life beautiful is death. Knowing that your time is limited and you have death looming just really makes you realize how beautiful and short life is.

Ah, number 4! I'd forgotten this trope.

Why should a short life be more beautiful than an eternal one? And why should shortness add any sort of quality to the only thing that allows you to perceive any quality in the first place? And even if it's true for you, it's clearly subjective: there's no reason to believe this perception is indicative of wisdom in the slightest. Quite to the contrary. Indeed, the logical end of your argument is that everyone should know exactly how long they are to live, and the best way to ensure that is to encourage suicide. Why languish in a long life, when you could end it on a high note? After all, shortness is sweetness, right? I think you've just tricked yourself into accepting as positive a glaring flaw in our biology.

[EYE OF AGES]

Haha some of the ignorance in this topic.

I'm surprised I didn't see more comments along the lines of what I'm thinking but I overestimate some people again. xD

Anyway it's just my opinion.
I think that what makes life beautiful is death. Knowing that your time is limited and you have death looming just really makes you realize how beautiful and short life is.
Ah but death saves you from fates worse than death, how sad is that? Stare death in the eye, and just keep going foward, no one knows when one dies, in the real world if we admit probability you have greater odds of dying in any one year than winning the lottery(and the odds double about every 8 years after age 25 or something), if the system has hidden variable you will die time and again or maybe forever? what is death? what does it even mean?

What if it is mere fiction? or nothing more than a transition, an illusion of rest in a never ending life of servitude towards oblivion with only the faintest hint of control and illusion of freedom. Unable to move foward but forced against your will to live each and every day, moving foward against your will.

and the best way to ensure that is to encourage suicide. Why languish in a long life, when you could end it on a high note? After all, shortness is sweetness, right? I think you've just tricked yourself into accepting as positive a glaring flaw in our biology.I view death as very possibly self-inflicted, it is suicide, if there is such a thing(again it might just be another illusion, self-inflicted pain can be quite dramatic and one can lose access to morality, dreams, vision, taste, etc lots of things come and go). If one jumps in front of a train, a bullet, or causes such mayhem that one is burned at the stake, even the most minor action might result in one's annihilation*(chose the wrong tooth paste? death penalty). Likewise even the most minor action may also result in unlimited wealth or power for no reason at all, godhood.

The immortal may seek the eternal rest of death and the mortal the eternal peace of immortality.

The logic of reality.

[Cult of Personality]

You're very big into fauxlosophic gibberish aren't you EYE OF AGES?

Anyway, on the subject of the thread, conditionally eternal life is where it's at. Endless until you choose to meet a preset list of criteria necessary to end it.

That way you can do everything there is to do and when that gets boring, just end it and go on to whatever comes next, supposing there is anything next. Maybe there's nothing. Who knows.

[anotherperson]

I would like to die, because what is the point of living forever when the things and people you love will be gone forever?