Sasori vs Akatsuki (seperate 1 on 1 battles)

[MrAnalytical]

[SPOILER]Analysis


Itachi vs Sasori


Sasori is literally the worse possible match for Itachi for 2 main reasons: his strengths are itachi's weaknesses. Itachi in his sick state would pose little match for Sasori.
As narutopedia states, Itachi's weakness is fighting prolonged matches against strong opponents. Since he can't do this, he resorts to strong genjutsu's to end a match quickly.
Sasori, as a puppet, has literally infinite stamina. Thus he can control the pace of the battle and outlast most opponents. He can prolong a match against sick itachi, until overuse of MS, or low stamina makes him succumb to his sickness, or until he simply passes out.
Itachi would have to resort to strong genjutsu's to end the match quickly, but this is a problem.


3 things almost everyone (including sasori fans) ignore when talking about him in vs. threads



[LIST=1]
[LEFT][SIZE=2]Genjutsu's don't work on him. This has been long debated, but simply using the facts from the manga/anime, the fact is that he only has a heart. The real sasori is his heart. He doesn't have a brain IN his heart, like some say, because it is stated that he only has a heart/is a heart, not has his lungs, brain, spleen, stomach, liver, kidneys, etc. in his heart container. Without a brain, no genjutsu can work, since genjutsu's are illusionary images that use the physical brain of an opponent. Sasori also doesn



(EDIT) PLEASE NOTE TO ADD TO THE OP
I did some research and I have to add some stuff.
1. Regarding Kakashi's and Kakuzu's water jutsu's damaging Sasori's Iron sand (since water +sand=messed up sand), that is FALSE. Water jutsu's wouldn't mess up the IS at all, since it is just Iron filaments, not sand. I somehow thought it was sand mixed up with Iron- it isn't. So blocking water jutsu's would be easy with IS.
2. Gaara would be easy meat ASSUMING Sasori is out of Hiruko. Why? He could use the water scroll jutsu on Gaara's absolute defense sand shield. As said water messes up sand. Or he could use the powerful flame scroll jutsu to render his sand very hot, then use water immedaitely- Gaara's sand defense would crack like an egg. Or he could cleverly put iron sand and mix it with Gaara's sand (like Deidara mixed his clay with Gaara's sand), the when Gaara puts up his defense, Sasori can use the IS to attack Gaara (w/sand bullets maybe?) while he's in the sand dome w/o any defense.
3. The point about Electromagnetic fields isn't entirely wrong (I don't think). As seen with Toroi (manga), who does similair things, it might be valid if the EM field is strong enough, i.e. strong magnetism w/strong electricity. If it's true, then Sasuke, Kakashi and Raikage would have no chance against Sasori once the Kazekage puppet is out.

Thanks allhttp://forums.saiyanisland.com/images/smilies/smile.gif
Note- I'm mature enough to respect another's opinion even if it differs from mine. I never said 'I'm right and everyone else is wrong'- as long as people actually use arguments with logic, instead of just writign one-line opinions based on nothing, especailly since I have addressed many things that people are disagreeing with (i wonder if people actually read the OP?). I'm sickened by the fact that adults can't discuss things intelligently on forums w/o it turnign into an insult contest. I haven't given any offense/insults/disrespect, and I hope to not receive any. If I'm wrong, I will happily admit it.

[Sephiroth]

Data books are pretty much useless here btw

[Rikudo-Sennin]

Sasori could only beat Madara>pain>Itachi>Kisame>Guy>Kakuzu>SASORI

[-nagato_uzumaki-]

he only has as much stamina as his chakra...... not everything you read on naruto pedia is true, and itachi genjutsu's sasori, in your misconception thread you talk alot about biased opinions, but you are mistaken and thinking very biased if you think that sasori can win one on vs pain, madara, deidara, konan and maybe not even the rst of the akatsuki......

[Super Sanin 3]

This is pretty nice lol some flaws here and there but overall good job :D

[MrAnalytical]

is the entire argument showing up?
To all- I DID SAY that Pain, Madara and Konan would probably win. I DIDN'T say Sasori would hands down win. I said at the end that EEVRYONE that I said Sasori MIGHT beat could also beat him, so how am I being biased?

[MrAnalytical]

Could someone confirm that the entire thing is showing up? On my PC it cuts off in the middle of the Itachi argument.

[Super Sanin 3]

1.So which puppet is Sasori starting out with in all these matches?
2.Was the water and fire sasori in the manga? I dont think you can use anime stuff if it's not written in the manga here
Good work being able to type all this btw, i suck at typing walls of text

[Kuromaki]

I fixed things up a bit, but you still got some copypasting to do.
2.Was the water and fire sasori in the manga? I dont think you can use anime stuff if it's not written in the manga here
Water no, fire yes

[Super Sanin 3]

Could someone confirm that the entire thing is showing up? On my PC it cuts off in the middle of the Itachi argument.
It's same with me, maybe you could repost?

[Phoenix Wright]

If you use ALT Codes then it cuts off sometimes, like I'm typing then suddenly in mid sentence I'll put blah blah talking gonna ad

Yep it cut off lol, if you use ALT Codes this forum usually doesn't answer too well.

[MrAnalytical]

Then I am reposting- sorry about that. But first to Nagato Uzumaki- if you get to the bottom of the OP, you will see that I said EEVRYONE who I thought Sasori could beat could also beat him- I only analyzed plausible scenarios where he could win. i don't know how I can be any more unbiased by stating that there. I have analyzed scenarios- could you refute the points. Just stating your opinion w.o any explanatino isn't an argument. And please explain WHY itachi could still genjutsu sasori. And even more, since I never said they CANT beat Sasori, can you explain/analyze why sasori CANT beat them. Am I really being biased? I say this with all due respect, and in no way am trying to be rude. Thanks

[MrAnalytical]

Oh and Nagato Uzumaki, I didn't think abotu the stamina thing- excellent point. Thx

[MrAnalytical]

Repost

Analysis
Itachi vs Sasori
Sasori is literally the worse possible match for Itachi for 2 main reasons: his strengths are itachi's weaknesses. Itachi in his sick state would pose little match for Sasori.
As narutopedia states, Itachi's weakness is fighting prolonged matches against strong opponents. Since he can't do this, he resorts to strong genjutsu's to end a match quickly.
Sasori, as a puppet, has literally infinite stamina. Thus he can control the pace of the battle and outlast most opponents. He can prolong a match against sick itachi, until overuse of MS, or low stamina makes him succumb to his sickness, or until he simply passes out.
Itachi would have to resort to strong genjutsu's to end the match quickly, but this is a problem.
3 things almost everyone (including sasori fans) ignore when talking about him in vs. threads
1. Genjutsu's don't work on him. This has been long debated, but simply using the facts from the manga/anime, the fact is that he only has a heart. The real sasori is his heart. He doesn't have a brain IN his heart, like some say, because it is stated that he only has a heart/is a heart, not has his lungs, brain, spleen, stomach, liver, kidneys, etc. in his heart container. Without a brain, no genjutsu can work, since genjutsu's are illusionary images that use the physical brain of an opponent. Sasori also doesn’t have a normal Chakra circulation System (CCS). He only has a heart that projects chakra threads through his fingers, or from a right cavity. A genjutsu would paralyze his body via his chakra that runs through his body, but with a puppet body (no CCS), his body would not be paralyzed. Basically, only the chakra in his heart would be distorted, but w/o a brain, no genjutsu would actually do anything. For those who know of ghost in the shell, consider cyberbrains- not physical brains you, but they are cybernetic computer brains. That which would work on a normal brain would not work on such a computer brain, thus to say genjutsu's work on a puppet is like saying one would work on a robot. Now this is not to insult readers, because I admit that it makes no sense. Sasori can stand in a cloud of gas and not die, since he doesn't breath. But w/o oxygen, how does his heart cells not die- w/o lungs, how is his heart sustained? He shouldn't be able to live. Same w/thinking w/o a brain- it doesn't make sense, but going strictly on the manga/anime that says that he only has a brain, I must say that he somehow thinks w/o a brain. Kishi perhaps needs a lesson in biology (or he should have explained Sasori's biological makeup), but the fact remains that people should take that up with him. My stance is that genjutsu's thus don't work on a puppet.
2. Everyone acts like the second Itachi pulls out susanoo, that it would be over for Sasori. Not so- poison gas & poison from smoke bombs CAN go through susanoo. This should be obvious- susanoo is only a chakra form, which is energy. Gas can go through it as it isn't solid. Air/gas has to pass through susanoo or else Itachi would suffocate. It isn't sealed. When Mei faces Sasuke, though his susanoo is incomplete, her acidic mist (gas) slips right pass the chakra of susanno and melts it's ribs. So yes, poison gas can go through susanoo. Everyone also forgets that Sasori has 2 rotary wind blades on either side of him, allowing him to fly. Thus he can easily fly outside of the range of Susanoo's sword, while dropping endless poison gas bombs on Itachi, until the entire battlefield is gassed. Some say itachi can hold his breath. It is implied that Itachi had TB, as he coughed up blood in his match against sasuke. TB=respiratory illness. He wouldn't be able to hold his breath for long. Some say he could do what Sakura did. Yet Chiyo said it was reckless- it's a miracle Sakura survived. Yet even though she did, she was unconscious after using an exploding tag. Chiyo had to nurse her back to consciousness- who would nurse itachi back to consciousness? And the second he went out of it, Susanoo would disperse
3. Everyone jumps on the Amaterasu bandwagon, yet this might be the worse possible thing Itachi could do. First, Iron sand can easily block ammy. Sasori can switch his heart into another puppet case in a split second, before Ammy burns the puppet completely. He could then attach puppet strings to the former Sasori (empty shell now ignited) and send it towards Itachi. Contrary to what many say, Ammy doesn't burn 'as hot as the sun,' i.e. burn anything to ashes automatically, as can be seen with the Samurai armor in the Land of Iron, and the Raikage's arm. Only if Itachi constantly focuses on an object will it burn quickly. With sasuke, sasuke himself was caught on fire then shed his skin, which is why it burned so quickly- the trees around the Uchiha hideout were caught on fire yet burned slowly- not even 1 tree burned down. And no, a sharingan cannot automatically locate Sasori's heart, since it's NOT the Byakugan (might be wrong here). So sasori wouldn't just burn to ashes quickly. Even more, imagine 100 puppets, all caught on black flames & with poison weapons, flying at you at once! If Itachi used ammy against the 100 puppets, then he might incinerate some of them, but would only ignite most of them- Sasori's 100 puppet jutsu would be 100x deadlier! Itachi would inevitably be caught on fire by his own flames (everyone forgets that the user of ammy is not immune to his own black flames). I assume that Itachi can put out his own flames (despite the fact that narutopedia says only sasuke can), but he would have to concentrate on putting out the flames engulfing him while not being re-ignited by more puppets flying at him. So he would probably be re-ignited by black flames. And during this time of he'd have to not be so much as scratched by 1 poison weapon. He'd have to resort to Susanoo to defend himself, which requires great strain. Ammy also can't burn chakra/chakra strings like some say (I don't think so, but like many things here, I could be wrong. Btw, this is my first post, so go easy on me. I'm humble enough to admit when i'm wrong:)
Even more, ,with Sasori flying with his wind blades, Itachi couldn't hit him if he flies high and is dropping poison gas bombs. It's like trying to hit a fly with a gun.
Itach's fire element jutsu's are mid-range. Not getting hit with poison needles is hard at close range while doing a jutsu (itachi couldn't dog 2 shuriken at mid range while about to do a jutsu), and IF sasori gets on fire, then he can switch bodies and send the ignited puppet at Itachi, or put the fire out with a water scroll jutsu.
Some say Itachi could just make shadow clones and sit back and study Sasori's movements- Sasori could also make sand clones and study Itahci's movements- both have a 5 rating of intelligence in the Naruto STATbook. Sasori is said to be slow by many, yet he has a 4.5 rating of speed in the stat book- faster than Kakuzu, as fast as Sasuke and Kakashi, and almost as fast as Itachi himself.
Even more, with Sasori in Hiruko, Itachi might try to use that MS genjutsu on Sasori, and thus would waste chakra before realizing that Sasori was a puppet that couldn't fall for genjutsu.
When one adds all of this together, one can see that Itachi in his sick state would not win against sasori- sasori, once again,, would be able to strike Itachi's Achilles heel. The stamina factor alone is Itachi's weakness against Sasori, such that Sasori would be able to control the match and use poison to win with relative ease. I'm neither a Sasori fan or an Itachi fan, so I readily admit that Itachi would probably win in his prime (not going blind, and not sick). Fan=fanatic, btw, and I'm not a fanatic of any character. I just think itachi is overrated and Sasori is underrated.

[MrAnalytical]

Hidan vs Sasori
Sasori has no blood, so Hidan can't curse kill him. Hidan w/o Kakuzu, can't thread himself if he is decapitated. Sasori wins.
Konan vs Sasori
No idea

Jiraiya vs Sasori
No idea, but I'd honestly put my bets on Jiraiya
Kisame vs Sasori
A bad match up. While most say Samehada can just eat Sasori's chakra strings, the fact is that he would have to be close to Sasori to do it- inf act, he's have to be behind the puppet since chakra strings aren't in front of the puppet. Kisame is a strong melee fighter, but most forget that Sasori is one of the few that makes up for taijutsu being a puppeteers weakness. Even more, CQC/close-range fighters are always weak against long range fighters. If sasori got too close to Kisame, then yes he would be in trouble. But if he stayed far away, then Kisame would be toast, since sasori can just use long-range attacks against Kisame. Kisame could use the water dome jutsu that he used against Killer bee, but Sasori could just fill the entire dome with poison (like Bee with ink), since poison can travel through water and diffuse through Kisame 'gills' and into his system; then Sasori could fly with his wind blades out of the water dome to an island to sip apple cider while Kisame is going numb from poison. And Sasori wouldn't drown in the water dome since he doesn't breath. If kisame did the huge water jutsu that he used against Team Gai, then Sasori could fly over it and rain poison needles/smoke bombs on Kisame, or use Iron Sand World Order, where Kisame would get poisoned/hit. Almost all other water jutsu's can be easily blocked by Iron Sand (yet water messes up sand). Sasori wins with mid difficulty.
Pain vs Sasori
This is tricky. While most say Sasori would lose easily, he wouldn't. First the misconception is that poison doesn't work on dead bodies- why then did a rasengan from Jiraiya on the animal path result in blood coming out of the that Pain- same when he impaled them with swords? Poison travels through the blood-stream; despite being dead bodies, they are biologically living flesh. The cells are living, which means they require blood, so biologically they are 'alive.' thus poison in the blood will effect them, and numb them. And since they aren't dead, the Pain that resurrects bodies won't be able to resurrect them- they will just be useless on the battlefield. Summons? They are too living flesh biologically (blood), SO THEY CAN BE POISONED. The multi-headed dog thus would pose no problem. Shinra Tensai? Puppets go by-bye? Not quite- Sasori can remake his body if he's smashed to pieces, and some of his puppets can too. And with the 5-second window, sasori can exploit that to poison Pain. Am I saying Sasori would win? No- Pain would. Planetary devastation would crush Sasori, and the demonic statue that can steal souls would kill him instantly. So Pain wins, but not as easily as people say.
Kakuzu vs Sasori
This would be hard for Sasori for 2 reasons- Kakuzu can harden his skin making all physical poison needles and even 100 puppets with poison blades, pointless. Yet he still breathes oxygen, so poison gas can work. And despite what some say, Kakuzu's hearts can be poisoned, and the main Kakuzu can too- he can take organs and hearts into his won body, but that has nothing to do with his circulatory system folks. He still has 1 set of arteries, 1 set of veins, etc (I ASSUME- why would he have a heart If he had no veins/arteries?). So poison would still go through his body, whether he can take more organs into his body or not. Again, this I say as an assumption, as I have no idea what his biological makeup is- I assume he has veins. Kakuzu can use both the wind and fire hearts to create a massive fire blast (since wind+ fire=bigger fire), and I don't know if a hard wall of Iron Sand can withstand it, but it probably could. If he used a combo blast of all 4 natures, then Sasori is probably toast.
Sasuke vs Sasori
Ironically, sasuke would do much better against Sasori then Itachi would, since Sasuke doesn't have the stamina limitations, neither does he use genjutsu's that much.
Ammy? Talked about that.
Susanoo? Talked about that. Susanoo's arrows would be blocked by Iron Sand, or at least diverted in it's path. Sasori can be broken to pieces and just remake his body.
Genjutsu's? Talked about that.
Kirin? Utterly pointless in a real fight, unless they happen to be fighting outside in a rainstorm. It takes minutes (not seconds) to prepare and use. Sasori won't stand there and let him use it. And though Iron sand probably won't block it, it will dilute it's power.
Sasuke has little long range attacks- fire jutsu's are mid range. He can use wires with fire jutsu's, but Sasori won't stand there while he does that. Chidori blade is mid range, so no there. The closer Sasuke gets (he's already hot headed and not as cautious as Itachi), the more likelihood he'd get poisoned, especially w/o prior knowledge. And Oro making Sasuke immune to poison does not mean immune to all poisons, especially poison of the highest calibre (sasori's). Chidori? Too close- people constantly say that Sakura could evade all 100 puppets, but forget that if Sasuke could also, w/o super strength he'd just be on the defensive. He can't punch one puppet and not break his hand. He can't use chidori 100 times to destroy all either. The 'if Sakura could do ___, then ___ would win' is wrong, since Sakura can do things most others can't do, and Chiyo was the main problem for Sasori- Sakura wouldn't have lasted 1 minute in the fight w/o Chiyo.
Yet the most obvious thing is this- what happens when one mixes electricity/lightning with magnetism? They create an electromagnetic field. Now I'm writing this quickly, and don't claim to know physics well, so if I”m wrong, then let someone tell me (again, I don't claim to know everything). But with the creation of an electromagnetic field, then the person that is put in that field (i.e. using chidori at close range, by Kakashi/sasuke) will charge them and make them into a living magnet IF the field doesn't crush them. That would make the unfortunate fellow a large metal magnet, so that the Kazekage puppet can literally control the person, just like Magneto can easily control Wolverine. With such a field, metal weapons can also be charged as the opposite charge, so that Sasori can make kakashi/sasuke collide with 100 kunai or poisoned swords. He would literally be able to control them. Kirin, with it's large burst of lightning, would make it worse, if the magnetic field is strong enough. So any strong lightning user would be easy meat against the Kazekage puppet- including Sasuke, Kakashi, Kakuzu (the lightning heart), Raikage (lightning armor)etc. Kakuzu would have to stay outside of the field to not be 'charged,' and thus could still win.
*(EDIT Above is wrong, I'm sure. But a better argument is this- the human body has many metals in it- Hemoglobin alone, in the blood, has a certain metal as it's core element in the macromolecule- IRON (FE +2 if I remember correctly). Thus if the Kazekage puppet can control iron sand, then it could control the Iron in the blood/body of an opponent, which =instant kill for ANYONE. A strong EM Field due to lightning jutsu's would probable increase the effect.)

[MrAnalytical]

Deidara vs Sasori
Deidara said Sasori would win, so I'd say Sasori. Deidara's nano-bomb jutsu might not work against Sasori since he doesn't breath (Itachi vs Deidara Note though that Deidara's nano-bombs are on the billionth of a meter scale, and thus would compare to air molecules- in a word, it can also pass through susanoo, and would thus be inhaled by Itachi. W/o lightning affinity, Itachi would be toast. Btw, Itachi vs Kisame? Kisame's sword can literally absorb/eat all of Susanoo, since it's chakra! Itachi would still win of course. Itachi vs Pain. Nagato/Pain can also absorb chakra, and thus could absorb susanoo. We all know Pain would win there.)
Gaara vs Sasori
Sasori's iron sand is better than Gaara's sand and can be used in the same way (it can even take the shape of any weapon), and that's just 1 weapon. Yet Gaara's sand is much more ubiquitous, much easier to control, much quicker, etc. Still, I'd say Sasori.

Kakashi vs Sasori
Kumai drains Kakashi out a lot, and he can't aim it very well or use it in an instant until later. Deidara was flying slowly in a linear fashion, and Kakashi had trouble using it. Sasori won't just stand there and watch while he does it. Or if Sasori is flying in a non-linear fashion, then Kakashi can't use it. All water and fire jutsu' Kakashi can do that we've seen, can easily be blocked by iron sand (water would mess up the sand though). Iron Sand world Order would probably end it there. Going under ground to grab Sasori and using shadow clones is good, but even if Kakashi got that close to use chidori on the real sasori, Sasori could transfer his heart in an instant. All 100- puppets pose the same problem to him as it does to most non-sakura/tsunade nin- he can dodge but can't strike all with 100 chidori's. If Kakashi uses Kumai on the wrong Sasori (an empty shell) and then is worn out, then he's toast. Sasori can fly high and drop poison gas bombs. The possibilities are endless- Kakashi loses. And everyone assumes for some odd reason, that he'd have an antidote, though he isn't a medical nin. One scratch and it's over. Then there's the lightning problem against Magnetism. More? Why does Sakura wear gloves? Many state that Kakashi can use chidori against a wall of iron sand, if Sasori used it as Gaara does (an absolute defense). Kakashi wears gloves, but it exposes the fingers, so doing lightning cutter against iron sand (or punching iron sand) will result in Kakashi being scratched by the iron sand- poisoned.
Guy vs Sasori
A bad match-up- close range vs long range = long range generally wins. In the same cave where Chiyo/sakura fought Sasori, if guy used Noon Tiger than he might beat Sasori- if he misses and hits an empty shell (i.e. if Sasori blasts a hole in the top of the cave and flies out), then guy can't do anything else. Sasori can just fly and avoid his taijutsu, while raining poison gas bombs onto the battlefield, where guy will most likely eventually inhale it.
Madara vs Sasori
Everyone assumes that Madara would win. But if Minato could trick Madara into becoming tangible to use a well-timed Rasengan on him, then where Sasori doesn't have speed, he has numbers. If he could trick Madara into sucking in a sasori that is an empty shell (heart transfer), then the real sasori, with all 100 puppets, should be able to impale or at least scratch Madara while he's tangible- having to be tangible while sucking people into another dimension is his weakness. Am I saying Sasori can beat Madara outright? No- the battle can go either way.
Sasori vs Shino/aburame clan
Sasori loses easily. Why? TERMITES
I, being objective and non-biased (try to be) readily admit that everyone above who I said would lose to Sasori, w/the right location, could also beat him- that goes for EVERYONE above (accept lightning users, and possibly sick Itachi). Honestly, no one in akatsuki is weak, or else they wouldn't be in akatsuki- the organization is made up of insanely, Kage-level nin: ALL with abilities that are around the same level. Anyone in the org. could, w/the right location, beat anyone else in the organization (GENERALLY). It's sad that people are so biased that they cling to their favorite character in Akaktsuki and spit on every other character: people are EXTREMELY biased in the forums.
Also note- on the web, an 'official' level chart supposedly from Kishi, put Sasori as 4th strongest in akatsuki, 2nd only to Pain and Itachi (& Madara). Sasori is widely regarded as the strongest nin in the Sand (village's) history, AT 15! He defeated not a hidden village, but a COUNTRY, with 1 JUTSU! He killed the most powerful Kage in Sand's history, at 15 (no reason to say he just slipped poison into the Kage's drink, like some assume, I..e that he didn't fight the Kazekage and beat him- it's implied that he did).
P.S. Remember folks, I don't claim to no everything in Naruo- if i'm wrong, just correct me.
Written in: ~30 minutes

[MrAnalytical]

(EDIT) PLEASE NOTE TO ADD TO THE OP
I did some research and I have to add some stuff.
1. Regarding Kakashi's and Kakuzu's water jutsu's damaging Sasori's Iron sand (since water +sand=messed up sand), that is FALSE. Water jutsu's wouldn't mess up the IS at all, since it is just Iron filaments, not sand. I somehow thought it was sand mixed up with Iron- it isn't. So blocking water jutsu's would be easy with IS.
2. Gaara would be easy meat ASSUMING Sasori is out of Hiruko. Why? He could use the water scroll jutsu on Gaara's absolute defense sand shield. As said water messes up sand. Or he could use the powerful flame scroll jutsu to render his sand very hot, then use water immedaitely- Gaara's sand defense would crack like an egg. Or he could cleverly put iron sand and mix it with Gaara's sand (like Deidara mixed his clay with Gaara's sand), the when Gaara puts up his defense, Sasori can use the IS to attack Gaara (w/sand bullets maybe?) while he's in the sand dome w/o any defense.
3. The point about Electromagnetic fields isn't entirely wrong (I don't think). As seen with Toroi (manga), who does similair things, it might be valid if the EM field is strong enough, i.e. strong magnetism w/strong electricity. If it's true, then Sasuke, Kakashi and Raikage would have no chance against Sasori once the Kazekage puppet is out.
Thanks all
Note- I'm mature enough to respect another's opinion even if it differs from mine. I never said 'I'm right and everyone else is wrong'- as long as people actually use arguments with logic, instead of just writign one-line opinions based on nothing, especailly since I have addressed many things that people are disagreeing with (i wonder if people actually read the OP?). I'm sickened by the fact that adults can't discuss things intelligently on forums w/o it turnign into an insult contest. I haven't given any offense/insults/disrespect, and I hope to not receive any. If I'm wrong, I will happily admit it.

[MrAnalytical]

sorry about the wall of text with no spacing- if your eyes can take it, then can someone confirm that it is showing up now?

[Super Sanin 3]

Yeah it shows up now

[Kuromaki]

It appears to have shown up all the way.

[MrAnalytical]

Guys, please go here. I detail how Sasori can beat anyone in akatsuki, even Pain. It's a long read, but worth it. This page has some of the info, but the site below has more. Thx

[Super Sanin 3]

I don't think you're suppose to have those links X_X

[iDooom]

Problems. You are assuming Sasori would be able to poison any close range fighter who gets close. Unfortunately, most of Akatsuki are much faster than Sasori, so he isn't winning. And no, narutoverse lightinig isn't really electricity and even if it was, it's not mixing with magnetism.

[MrAnalytical]

Most of Akatsuki are MUCH faster than Sasori?
Hidan said he was slowest of Akatsuki.
Sasori's Stat book rating for speed is 4.5.
That's faster than Kakuzu, as fast as Sasuke, as fast as Kakashi, as fast as Oro, faster than Kisame, and probably (I assume) faster than Konan, Zetsu, etc. He's faster than MOST of akatsuki.

[Super Sanin 3]

About the Susano'o thing, doesn't the acidic mist actually prove that wrong? I mean it's not harming Sasuke just the bones of his Susano'o. However you make a good point about Itachi having low stamina while being sick
Also seems to be a lot of trolls here >.>

[SageoftheSixPaths]

Hidan: Poison does nothing to him. He's effectively immortal in that sense. However, Iron Sand or 100 Puppets can easily lop off limbs/render Hidan unable to move/fight pretty easily. So, yeah.

Kakuzu: He technically has no blood since his entire body is made up of threads with only a small heart in each of the masks he carries. Therefore, I'm doubting poison does much good against him. However, Iron Sand's defensive capabilities are strong enough to stop an elemental blast and fast enough to catch any of the masks/Kakuzu. The problem here for Sasori is the fact that there are 5 masks PLUS Kakuzu coming at him from all different angles with powerful elemental blasts. His 100 Puppets are easily dispatched with a couple of shots, and Sasori himself has no chance against any of the puppets with his own body. His best hope is to stay behind his Sand and maybe fire a water jet or scorpion tale attack every now and then, but eventually a blast will get through and kill him. So that's a no against Kakuzu.

Orochimaru: Not a chance. Manda gets summoned and just swashes Sasori into a pulp. Or Orochimaru just takes everything out with the Grass Sword and tanks all other attacks. Poison does nothing when he can just counter substitute. Iron Sand will only slow him down for a few minutes at most.

Kisame: Not even a remote chance for Sasori to win here. Water Sharks chase down Sasori/100 Puppets, and poison can be easily washed away. Combine that with the fact that Iron Sand would fall apart like a Jenga set without any chakra holding it together and Sasori is screwed.

Itachi: Ammy on all puppets, Susano'o stops Iron Sand, Ammy on Sasori. Or Fireball on Sasori. Or Susano'o projectiles on Sasori. Or sealing sword. Or literally any other technique Itachi wants to use. Susano'o cannot be penetrated (lolololol) by Iron Sand, and Ammy cannot be stopped by anything Sasori has.

Konan: She's made out of paper. She has nothing to poison or crush. Sasori has no fire to attack her with, which is really her only weakness. A few well timed paper bombs ends this easily. Paper weapons wreck 100 Puppets, and Iron Sand is literally useless against Konan except as a defense.

Deidera: As long as Sasori doesn't give Deidera a chance for C3 (C4 won't do anything since Sasori doesn't breath) he wins this pretty handily. Iron Sand is fast enough to track Deidera, and one scratch wins it for Sasori. C0 would just be a draw since nobody wins.

Zetsu: Army of several thousand clones that can travel almost completely in an undetectable manner? Zetsu wins by sheer volume of numbers. That, and chakra spores help.

Pain: Lol.

Madara/Tobi: Warp to cube dimension or summons giant statue. GG.

[Super Sanin 3]

He technically has no blood since his entire body is made up of threads with only a small heart in each of the masks he carries.
Shikimaru got it somehow `!:)
BTW water attack is non-canon i think

[SageoftheSixPaths]

Shikimaru got it somehow `!:)
Oshi-

Good point. I take that back, then. Poison would somehow work on Kakuzu. `:P

EDIT: Fire was non canon. Water was.

[Super Sanin 3]

Really? I wiki'd it really quick just to make sure and it said water was from anime :shock:
To the manga!

Muwahaha i was right, 2 points for Super Sanin. :cool:

And i just remembered the sasori puppet was able to put itself together after being hit into many pieces, not bad

[MrAnalytical]

I realize once again that no one really read all of the OP.

The Susanoo bones were inside Susanoo's chakra cloak if I am not mistaken. Danzo using Baku's wind vacuum pulled not only Susanoo forward, but also Sasuke (inside an almost completed Susanoo) where he did a fire jutsu to use that air to his advantage. Thus I beleive air was going through, thus gas would too.

Having hearts and organs means Kakuzu has blood, but either way, I'm assuming and you are too.

Oro's summonos can be poisoned, and IS World Order could destroy all of them.

Sasori can fly over all of Kisame' attacks, and w/o an absoltue defense, IS World Order wins. Water sharks assumes Sasori is udnerwater, where wind blades can cut them all in pieces, and poison can fill the water and poison Kisame. And of coruse, I ASSUME Samehada is metal, that means Kazekage puppet uses it to rip Kisame in pieces. If Kisame is underwater, poison will diffuse into his gills. Water attacks can be blocked by IS. 100 puppets NOT UNDERWATER will surely scratch Kisame. Truly, most people, even Kisame fans, know Sasori would win that one.

Pain- mechanical pain can be disabled by IS. Mechanical pain is all METAL and it's missiles are too- Kazekage puppet can send them back at Pain. Ah- hah- ALL PAINS HAVE METAL PIERCINGS as chakra receivers. Kazekage puppet + metal? Yes folks, Sasori could win simply by removing the piercings.

Madara- 100 puppets with a well-timed trick-attack to get him tangible(trying to S/T an empty shell of sasori) BEFORE he uses Izanagi? Izanagi won't cure the poison if he's already attacks.
I'm only mentionning plausible ways that Sasori can win- not saying he'd win agaisnt ANY of them. And for the love of.... READ THE OP BEFORE RESPONDING

[iDooom]

Most of Akatsuki are MUCH faster than Sasori?
Hidan said he was slowest of Akatsuki.
Sasori's Stat book rating for speed is 4.5.
That's faster than Kakuzu, as fast as Sasuke, as fast as Kakashi, as fast as Oro, faster than Kisame, and probably (I assume) faster than Konan, Zetsu, etc. He's faster than MOST of akatsuki.
You are new here right? Well you'll learn soon enough that narutopedia and anime mean nothing here. Oh yeah, so do character statements and databooks. FEATS on the other hand, ARE counted. And no, Sasori is not the speed of Sasuke, he is NOT remotely close to Itachi, Kakuzu, Hidan, etc. are arguable. And Deidara is not weaker than Sasori just because he said so.

[Super Sanin 3]

Sorry, i didn't see it in the OP (i scanned thought it but still couldn't see it, i'll take your word for it though)
Kakuzu DOES have blood as it was shown he does (few posts up) and btw i have to ask if you included magatama in your battles or what is written before the chapter?

[MrAnalytical]

Sage of Six Paths
I forgot to mention that I agree with you on Zetsu and Madara- I don't want to seem like I ignored your message, like everyone is ignoring my OP. Madara's summon (statue) would beat Sasori.
iDoom
Yes, I'm new. And thanks for the heads up, i didn't know that. But why are DB stats useless? I say this because I know that comparing one character to another by stats alone is foolish- they are mere technicalities. but I thuoght that with specific things like speed, one could use the stats. Again, I'm new, so go easy on me. I guess I'm wrong.So feats... Hmmm. Well, I am more ignorant than most on that.
Btw, please refute my OP point by point. I do agree that you know more than I, and if you read my sig you'll see that I said EEVRYONE in akatsuki can also beat Sasori - I say that so it doesn't seem I'm being biased. I simply wanted to analyze plausible ways that Sasori COULD beat those people (just like they can beat him). did you read the entire OP? also, I don't think speed alone would allow them to not be poisoned, especially with poison gas used at the right time with large amounts. Again, i don't claim to knwo it all- these are just my very humble opinions, so please don't bash me in pieces.
thx
Now I'm confused- I thought fire WAS cannon, and water wasn't. But honestly, I agree with Sage on Konan, because Jiraiya's fire didn't seem to do all that much. Btw, I don't understand Konan's biological makeup- her fight with the J man- was that a paper clone, or her? I mean, she turned herself into paper? because IF she didn't and she is still 'human,' then poison would work, and poison gas would work since she breathes air. And for Sage, I would NEVER say that Sasori, or anyone has 'no chance' against anyone. Eevryone thoguht that of Konan vs Madara, and we know Konan almost one. And to say Konan would beat Sasori 'easy' with a few paper bombs? Again, that seems a little harsh for the S man- surely he would at last put up a fight before going down. Edit- i foolishly said Gaara would be easy meat. i must have been not thinking.
Sanin- i wasn't talking about you, regarding the OP thing. I didn't include that part in the OP.
Magatama is Itach's long range jutsu with Susanoo right? I wrote abuot that in another forum. I will post it in a sec.
'More on Itachi- now eevryone will jump on the Yasaka Magatama (Manga Chapter 551) and state that now Sasori has no chance. I will make this short- this certainly makes things much more difficult for Sasori, but he still has a chance. First I will note that I DO NOT know the specifics of the Yasaka Magatama, so if I'm wrong, let someone correct me. I dont' know the size of the chakra shuriken, nor the speed at whcih it flies, but I ASSUME it is similar to Naruto's rasenshuriken. That said, Sasori has 2 options. On the ground, he would have to use the Kazakage's IS as a solid, Iron wall. As I said with Kirin, it certainly won't block the entire blast of the Yasaka Magatama, but it will certainly dilute the effect- enough to not kill Sasori. But this is questinoable. If Sasori uses the 100 puppets, then the Yasaka Magatama will destroy all of them and Sasori. Thus, Sasori has only one real alternative- to go airborne. Using the wind blades, he will have to fly moderately high above Itachi. Once again, assuming that the Yasaka Magatama is average size (NOT as big as the rasenshuriken when it expands) and assumign that it flies as fast as any normal chakra projectile (like the rasenshuriken, which was EASILY dodged by the core Pain), then I see no problem with Sasori dodging them while flying. Again, this is with my limited knowledge on the size/speed of the Yasaka Magatama. It will still be like trying to hit a fly with a bullet, or in this case, a chakra shuriken- again, this is IF the Yasaka Magatama is not super-large and not super-fast. If it is both, then Sasori would have little chance dodging them. With this info, it is obvious now that ITachi would beat Sasori in his prime (not blind/sick) with little difficulty. But with his sickness, I still beleive he would succumb to illness, or fall out due to low stamina, etc. especailly with having to use many Yasaka Magatama and sustain Susanoo for so long, while Sasori is dropping poison gas bombs and gassing the entire battlefield, so Itachi can't escape. And yes, even if he kills Sasori, he will most liekely die due to chakra exaustion, or due to being poisoned, making it a tie. And of course, ET Itachi wasn't sick, so his use of Yasaka Magatama wasn't limited, while sick Itachi's would be. Sasori's stamina isn't UNLIMITED as someone pointed out, as it is as much as his chakra. But he doesn't TIRE as a puppet, having no muscles, etc, makign his stamina infinately higher than sick Itachi's.'
Everyone- note that i put that NOT knowing the facts about Magatama- I ASSUMED it's like Naruto's rasenshuriken. If it is, then it can be dodged, just like Naruto's RS can be- especially if Sasori is flying. It's still like hitting a fly with a shuriken. but i admit that this makes it much harder for Sasori, and in the least, can make it a tie, even with Itachi sick. Prime, non-blind/sick Itachi would obviously win.

[Super Sanin 3]

There's just a lot of confusion with the data book, like the first thing at the top of my head is Gaara's speed, it's 3 but Gaara HIMSELF rarely moves, so it must be the sand. Just many flaws in the design of it all

[MrAnalytical]

I forgot to mention SAge's post on Hidan:
poison won't kill hiim, but it will still go through his bloodstream and destroy his cells- he will still go numb and not be able to move. So poison is actually the most eFFECTIVe thing agaisnt thim, since he won't die. He'll just go numb, and Sasori can walk away with a yawn.
Sanin- well don't hold me in suspense? What do you say about my entry on Sasori vs Pain, Madara, and Itachi's Magatama? Everyone on all of my forums are extremely hesitant to reply on that, as if no one wants to beleive Sasori COULD beat them

[Super Sanin 3]

Why? I even thought Sasori was in the top 5 akatsuki, and that his posion makes him overpowered imo. About the summons, would the posion work at effectively considering their large figure? As you can see i'm not too smart lol but would it attack their WHOLE system? Fire IS canon water is non-canon, i think he just got them confused. However i think he probably COULD stun the paths. However, if Pein's summonings DO get affected that easily, it would be much tougher for him. How will he counter the chameleon summon though? I'd just like to point out that a regular ST might not work even if he blows his parts off, as he was able to put them back together. Madara never struck me as strong, but i'm still wondering about his rinnegan form, which will probably be too overpowered for pretty much anybody to beat. As for Itachi's Magatama, it's kinda hard to tell from lack of feats. But if someone comes out with a sword i probably wouldn't expect something FRS speed to come flying at me so it's hard to tell

[SageoftheSixPaths]

I did read the OP. I just rendered my own opinion instead of taking everything you stated, though well thought out, for granted.

And DB stats don't matter here because we DEBATE a character's statistics based on what they've shown. Obviously Raikage is faster than essentially every character in the series save Minato, but the DBs may put him far closer to someone without any real feats than they should be based on what they've shown. Here in the BGs, you are not allowed to assume -- only debate and cite source.

Also, many of the stats in the DBs are out of date. Obviously Naruto is now stronger than when the last DB came out, so we can't use it as a source when talking about characters for that reason as well.

As for Itachi losing to Sasori, I still don't see it happening. Ammy is just too hax for him to NOT win. Obviously Genjutsu is useless, but Susano'o will not fall against any of Sasori's attacks. That, combined with the fact that Itachi can seal literally anything Sasori throws at him with his sword means he'd win. Plus Mirror Shield. Plus superior ranged Jutsu. Plus superior speed. All in all, Itachi is superior to Sasori in everything but stamina, and even then he's too fast for Sasori to make the fight last long enough.

[MrAnalytical]

Not to be rude to anyone, and I say this with all due respect- I get this literally on every thread that I have posted this on- but people aren't actually REFUTING my points (OP).

An opinion with an explanation/analysis=an argument that can be debated. An opinion with no explanation = a theory that is merely an opinion- an ASSUMPTION.

I still see people saying 'Ammy will work,' 'Susanoo will work,' etc.

But HOW will they work in light of me refuting them workign? HOW will Ammy work since I've refuted that Ammy would work? HOW will Susanoo work since I've refuted that it would work.
A point by point refutatino is required, because I have attempted to show how they will NOT work. This is why I asked whether people read the OP.
Simply saying ammy will work- Susanoo will work- is thus... an ASSUMPTION.

By the way, Sage, I'm surprised that you said genjutsu's won't work on Sasori. People still argue with me on that. And it isn't in the manga/anime that Sasori is immune to genjtusu. It is... an ASSUMPTION that I made (and you agreed with it) since it's based on logic.

And for others- Iron Sand spikes shoudl be able to impale Pain's summons. IS bullets can at least poison them.
Poison gas, I think , effects the nervous system automatically, so even large summons would go numb quickly (prob. wrong on that).
And what about the metal piercings on Pain's body? Did you agree the Kazekage puppet can rip them out, making pain lose? Chameloen summon would be a problem- accpet for a cloud of poison gas. It would go down, and ironically, so would the Pain inside it (if he hid).
Again, for everyone, especailly Sage, I say this respect and not in a rude way.
cheers

[Super Sanin 3]

I'm not sure what the chakra rods are made out of, but it could possibly be affected if it's the right substance. It kind of also depends how he starts out. The chameleon summon itself isn't that powerful, but also, would Sasori use posionous gas if he doesn't know there's an invisible summon walking around? If the animal path hid in his mouth, would his rods get affected as much? Sasori may: already see the chameleon and know to use posion gas OR maybe the chakra strings can sense it moving if he's lucky? (100 puppets)

[MrAnalytical]

Thanks Sanin-
I also wanted to add. On a debate team, people put forth an argument, and it must be refuted. Simply saying 'this is wrong, this is right,' will get a person nowhere on a debate team. Refutations via logic must be used.
i regard these forums as a debate team. Since this is my thread, I opened with a lengthly analysis of how Sasori could defeat so and so. The opening statement must be REFUTED to make it a debate. Simply saying 'i don't agree' without explanatino or refutation is thus invalid.
Arguing by feats alone can only go so far. Since these are hypothetical fights that have never taken place, some logical assumptions must be made. If an assumption goes too far, then I will admit that. But in the end, a debate means a refutatino to the opening statement (the OP). And again, just to show how unbiased I was trying to be, I explicitly stated that everyone whom I said Sasori could beat, could also beat him, since the circumstances need to be accounted for. I NEVER said that so and so had 'no chance against Sasori.' With sick Itachi, almost everyone chooses to ignore just how important stamina is in a battle, and choose to ignore that even if he fought Sas like he did Sasuke, he would be pushed to his limits and would die in the process, meaning even if he beat Sasori, he would probably die also due to over-doing it. That's the huge different between sick Itachi and prime itachi. with the other characters, I simply analyzed how Sasori could defeat them, and left it up to people to DESCRIBE/analyze how those characters could defeat Sasori, as I already admitted that such a thing is possible (since I'm not a Sasori fanboy). Please simply rooting for their favorite characters and spitting on all others are fanboys stating opinions. That isn't a debate, as nothing can be debated. i look forward to seeing people refuting points, as I have no problem admitting that even sick Itachi can take Sasori, IF someone can analyze how.

Oh, and btw, couldn't IS world order take out Oro's snake summons- same with IS spikes/bullets?

[Super Sanin 3]

But wouldn't it be easier if i just debate the things i didn't agree on and agree on everything else? I mean if it's right in my eyes what am i suppose to debate?

[MrAnalytical]

lol- sorry Sanin. you keep thinking what I'm writing is for you. it was not a response to you. Just clarification for others who are not agreeing that Sasori could take sick Itachi.

[Super Sanin 3]

oops, my bad >.>. But on that subject, would Sasori know when to use the iron sand to defend against Amaterasu? Raikage knew to dodge it but i'm not sure if it was because he saw Sasuke's eye before wards or if there was just some other way.

[MrAnalytical]

First, true about the chameleon summon. I guess after writign an anlysis, I should write an actual battle scenario- but I'm too lazy!
Right about Ammy. If the battle is with no knowledge, then he might be messed up until he gets caught on fire. IF he has other puppets out, he could switch bodies, then attack strings to the burning puppet and send it at Sasuke.
If he has no other puppets out then he's messed up.
A battle with knowledge, I assume he would notice the eyes and defend more. With his true form, he would have to do some flying.
Also, I never mentioned the long coiled up cable he can use to attack- that might come in handy when Sasuke starts to fire up ammy (w/knoweldge)- he could at least distract Sasuke with that (i.e. force him to dodge and lose ocular focus). I assume Sasuke would have to put up Susanoo if Sasori gets too attack frenzy with poison. I assume though that Sasuke can use ammy though Susanoo (I think he did that with Danzo). I really need to actually write a battle scenario, since all I did was analyze plausible ways Sasori could win. The truth is, for ALL of those battles, it could go either way due to differing battle circumstances.
Btw, you and I seem to ALWAYS be online, on the forum 24/7?! lol

[Super Sanin 3]

So you write all this but too lazy to write a battle scenario? `:P
I wonder if Sasori has knowledge on the rinnegan? I mean if he knows what it is than he can just look at his eyes (they were always together, like when sealing the tailed beasts)
However just knowing the rinnegan might not help him here, since he wouldn't really know his powers. This can work both ways to the fights though, without knowledge, the opponents won't know about the posion or him being able to switch his heart container to another puppet. However if he does that, he loses the abilities of his true form, it's best for a surprise attack.
Since they're in the crater, where there's not really any place to hide, it's possible that he'll know the chameleon turns invisible just looking at it (or is it summoned invisible?)
Battles on BG don't really go as planned, part because Plot is involved and part because a new jutsu always sprouts up. But since he don't know these jutsu all we can really do use what we have (like we assume a character's gonna use a specific jutsu when the opponent uses the other, which most of the time it never turns out like that.)
Yeah i do see you online but you never seem to post alot :P, pft sleep is for mortals

[MrAnalytical]

Actually, for me, writing an analysis is easier than a scenario, because i have to put it all together. Can you write a scenario, perhaps for Sick itachi vs Sasori, with the analysis i provided-
Sasori shows up to fight Itachi instead of Sasuke.
Limited knowledge(meaning they know of each other's abilities due to being in akatsuki)
Uchiha location
Going for the kill
...

And btw, Sasori vs Pain thing is hard to tell, unless an actual scenario is written, since I don't know the location. I doubt he would be able to see the chameleon. And you are right, big summons wouldn't be poisoned so easily, unless poison gas is used (which I beleive attacks the nervous system automaticall). You are 100& correct about battles- this is why it is really all speculation
How do you see me online? Yea, I have like 10 different threads on 5 forums, so I don't post all that much on this one, but I will try and write some scenarios. Btw, where did iDoom and Sage go? Just you and me? lol

[Flying Fortress Skyfire]

He can beat Hidan and Zetsu and MAYBE Kakuzu. The rest annihilatify him.

[Super Sanin 3]

Ah okay why not, my first real scenario

But i didn't finish it, just until about to the part after the 3rd Kazekage puppet, how is it so far? Kinda leaning towards Itachi for this part though
I'll be judging this based on the opinion that Itachi, with sharingan and his overall speed and reflexes, can dodge at least as much as Sakura can (even with Chiyo helping at some points). Why? Sasuke was easily faster than Sakura can make out on two occasions: When he used his speed to move his arm around Naruto, and when Sasuke was about to kill Sakura. I'll assume Itachi is at least on par with Sasuke in speed.

Now, as for knowledge, i'm going to assume that Itachi knows Sasori is a puppet master and that Itachi has the sharingan. When Itachi sees the puppet (i'm assuming he starts with Hiruko), he'll see instantly the difference, and that the chakra is coming from the inside. Knowing Sasori's master puppetry, and the overall shape of Hiruko, especially under the cloak, he could probably use his intelligence to realize Sasori is inside. This fact, along with the sharingan, should tell him Sasori can't fall under genjutsu, thus he won't try it (he can try it in the beginning, but he'll see the chakra undisturbed and realize it anyways).

Now in this situation, Itachi should be able to dodge anything Sasori throws at him, the sharingan allowing him to dodge and all; the tail is a dead give away not to go close too. There's a big possibility that he will see the posion on the attacks Sasori uses on top of that. Itachi's fire style should easily be enough to take care of Hiruko, given it has no real evasion feats. Sasori makes a quick jump out of his puppet before his fire style hits his real body. Both sides havn't done much at this point; it's time to get serious.

Hiruko actually does worse for Sasori here, since Itachi now knows about the posion (the needles are soaked in it so it becomes obvious). Now here comes the tricky part, when will Itachi use Ammy/Susano'o? I can see the Kazekage puppet trying to rush Itachi off the bat, and although Itachi is way faster than Sakura it was Chiyo who was pulling Sakura towards her while Itachi has to get some distance on his own. If Itachi decides to bust out susano'o there, the puppet will get crushed by Susano'o's strength and activation feats (he can actually crush the puppet and go for Sasori since it has 2 right arms i believe). IC i don't think he would though, and the puppet will try out-maneuvering him as well. One scratch and it's over. However i'd still like to point out Itachi's gift to see through tactics easily.
I belive Itachi has the intelligence to escape from the posionous gas trap, thanks to his speed, kage bushin and epic hand seal timing. Then there's the Iron Sand technqiue. There are only 2 options i see for Itachi here: Amaterasu while the puppet preps the iron sand or Susano'o right before it hits him and catch Sasori off guard. Once Itachi is pressured enough, i'm sure he'll use Amaterasu, either on the puppet or Sasori himself. If he uses it on the puppet, the worst that happens is that Sasori reveals his true self and Itachi faces the side effects of using the MS, plus his stamina should drop even more since he's sick. If he uses it on Sasori himself, there's a big possibilty he can just take the cloak off, kinda like what happened to the Samurai's armor (can he transfer to the Kazekage puppet?)
When i say using Susano'o i really mean when Sasori uses his Iron Sand to attack, you can see the smoke it makes. Remember the latest chapter? That's what happened with Nagato, and it got him totally off guard when the sword got him. IF it hits the container it could possibly work on Sasori. If he just uses it to destroy the puppet however, he'll be killing himself. If Sasori shows his 100 puppets, Itachi would have to keep Susano'o up from there and eventually kill himself(not sure how Magatama works so not using it).

[MrAnalytical]

@Flying Fortress Skyfire
Thanks for the comment, but do please be so kind as to write an anlysis of how the others would beat him, i.e. refute the points I gave. Just saying 'the others annihiltafy (or whatever) him' isn't an argument, but just an opinion. And most think Sasori can beat Kisame.

[MrAnalytical]

@Sanin
Your first Scenario? It's excellent! I'm friggan jealous (j/k)!
But I do disagree that Itachi wouldn't use genjutsu- he can't see through Hiruko to know Sasori is inside, and wouldn't know that sasori IS a puppet himself, and that genjutsu wouldn't work, so I can swear that he'd throw some kunai as a diversion then try to genjutsu Sasori to make him immobile. Remember, the Sharingan isn't the Byu.. (ah- can't spell it. The Hyuga Dojutsu!).
And actually, Itachi's ability to dodge was severely impaired due to his sickness. Oh, oops, is this sick itachi or regular itachi? Oh, it is sick Itachi, I read that.
It is good, and you do put Itachi's sickness in there, in regards to using MS.The thing is, if Sasori pulls out the IS and uses IS World ORder or those sand bullets, there's no way Itachi can survive/dodge it w/o Susanoo. So I'd guess that he'd blow the ceiling up and jump up there to give himself more space (since this is where he fought Sasuke). And dodging those huge IS blocks is possible for him, but he will be defending a lot. He will have to use Susanoo, which will kill him faster.

[ItaSakuWTH]

MrAnalytical can't he see the chakra from the inside even though he cant see it? Sasuke saw the mines vs Deidara just wondering I think the sharingan can sense disturbed chakra too

[321zigzag3]

. And most think Sasori can beat Kisame.

Actually I have seen it go both ways from many after Kisame went all out.



Also for this kind of thread I could make such with other characters. I will praise your ability to analyze though.

However many of your statements are assumptions with plausibility occuring yet you are not considering how the opponent will react.

As for speed. You keep listing the 4.5 of Sasori's.

If you had further analyzed on that you would easily discover Sasori in terms of movement isn't akatsuki level at all.

In fact his so called 4.5 is more likely in main with his reflexes and reactions not his movement so much.

At least acknowledge Sasori is not what you call a high tier speedster in movement.

[Super Sanin 3]

But I do disagree that Itachi wouldn't use genjutsu- he can't see through Hiruko to know Sasori is inside, and wouldn't know that sasori IS a puppet himself, and that genjutsu wouldn't work, so I can swear that he'd throw some kunai as a diversion then try to genjutsu Sasori to make him immobile. Remember, the Sharingan isn't the Byu.. (ah- can't spell it. The Hyuga Dojutsu!).
And actually, Itachi's ability to dodge was severely impaired due to his sickness. Oh, oops, is this sick itachi or regular itachi? Oh, it is sick Itachi, I read that.
It is good, and you do put Itachi's sickness in there, in regards to using MS.The thing is, if Sasori pulls out the IS and uses IS World ORder or those sand bullets, there's no way Itachi can survive/dodge it w/o Susanoo. So I'd guess that he'd blow the ceiling up and jump up there to give himself more space (since this is where he fought Sasuke). And dodging those huge IS blocks is possible for him, but he will be defending a lot. He will have to use Susanoo, which will kill him faster.
But i thought the sharingan can detect if someone is under a genjutsu? Then there's what ita said about the mines, i think it would be the same thing. If Itachi is smart here, he'll use the smoke from the iron sand to get a surprise attack with his sword, if he misses however, or instead attacks the puppet, he's at a big disadvantage

[MrAnalytical]

@ 321
You are right.
I simply tried to right a plausible analysis on how Sasaori can win- these aren't battle scenarios. The scenario makes the difference- check the Sig of the OP- that's why I said anyone whom I said Sasori can beat can also beat Sasori. and I thought the DB speed stat was for body movement? Also, Hidan claimed to be slowest in Akat. I wouldn't say Sasori's speed isn't Akatsuki, but yes, he isn't top tier in speed.

@ Sanin and ITa
He saw thru the ground and saw the mines? Maybe I missed that. I thought only the Hyuga dojutsu could see thru it. i need to look up the manga to see that, because I thought he wou;dn't be able to see thru Hiruko to see the real Sasori...

[321zigzag3]

@ 321
You are right.
I simply tried to right a plausible analysis on how Sasaori can win- these aren't battle scenarios. The scenario makes the difference- check the Sig of the OP- that's why I said anyone whom I said Sasori can beat can also beat Sasori. and I thought the DB speed stat was for body movement? Also, Hidan claimed to be slowest in Akat. I wouldn't say Sasori's speed isn't Akatsuki, but yes, he isn't top tier in speed.


Yes that is true its mainly an analysis.

DB speed stat is for movement and reaction/reflexes. Sasori's reflexes were commented on by Sakura.

Yes Sasuke saw the mines and C4 because sharingan gave color to chakra. He is going to see chakra mass in the middle.

[MrAnalytical]

But to the best of my knowledge, ONLY Sasuke's sharingan could see chakra color

[321zigzag3]

If Sasuke's sharingan can see color, then at the very least other sharingan masters should as well.

[MrAnalytical]

Thanks all for your replies- that's it for me. My time on these forums is up- I'm permanently leaving. I wish you all well. Take care:)
Sorry Sanin i couldn't finish reading/responding to your scenarios...

[Super Sanin 3]

Aw :( buh byee it's no problem